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Thread: Looks like we Virginian OCers touched a nerve on Democratic Underground

  1. #1
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    AlinPA (1000+ posts) Tue Dec-16-08 08:10 PM
    Response to Reply #5
    55. I still don't see why people can't just wear their guns out in the open.

    Since they have a permit to own a gun, why should they have to hide it?
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    Statistical (351 posts) Sun Dec-21-08 05:45 PM
    Response to Reply #55
    64. You don't. Depends on how free your state is.

    In VA you can "open carry" a firearm with no license or permit required.

    No license, permit, or waiting period is required for purchase either (only federally mandated instant background check).

    If you want to conceal the weapon you actually need a CHP "Concealed Handgun Permit".

    Due to some "weirdness" in the laws that the gov refused to correct you currently:
    Can NOT legally carry a weapon CONCEALED (even with a CHP) into any establishment that sells alcohol.
    You CAN legally carry a weapon OPENLY (with NO permit) into any establishment that sells achohol.

    So once a month I participate in a open carry dinner where about 40 of us openly carry into a local restaurant.
    We have fliers to explain the reason we legally can't conceal carry (even with a CHP) if anyone has a question.

    Of course private property owners are free to restrict firearms on their property.
    VA has no legal def of a "club" or "bar" only an establishment that serves alchohol so the restriction also covers any restaurant with ABC license (virtually ever sit down restuarant).

    Actually for a long time in this country OPEN carry was legal. Most locations had laws making CONCEALING a weapon a crime.
    The thinking was if you are doing nothing wrong why would you want to hide your weapon?
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    iverglas (1000+ posts) Sun Dec-21-08 08:21 PM
    Response to Reply #64
    65. who "we", friend?


    So once a month I participate in a open carry dinner where about 40 of us openly carry into a local restaurant.
    We have fliers to explain the reason we legally can't conceal carry (even with a CHP) if anyone has a question.

    Not, perhaps, the charming "Virginia Citizens Defense League"?

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A50416-20...

    Yours are unloaded, I trust:
    Virginia law 18.2-287.4 expressly prohibits "carrying loaded firearms in public areas."
    But then ... how would anyone know? given as how it's police harassment for them to inquire ...


    http://www.vcdl.org/localities/culpeper.html

    Pretty funny. That Mike, he's a real progressive's progressive, he is.

    http://www.FairfaxCountyPrivacyCouncil.org

    Check out the links.

    If you've never seen a lunatiac right-wing ******* up close before, that should do the trick.

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    X_Digger (53 posts) Sun Dec-21-08 09:09 PM
    Response to Reply #65
    66. Bzzt, wrong..

    Edited on Sun Dec-21-08 09:10 PM by X_Digger
    Most handguns are legal for open carry, as are most shotguns and hunting rifles. You'll also notice that this restriction is only in certain areas.

    18.2-287.4. Carrying loaded firearms in public areas prohibited; penalty.

    It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a loaded (a) semi-automatic center-fire rifle or pistol that expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material and is equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine that will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition or designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer or equipped with a folding stock or (b) shotgun with a magazine that will hold more than seven rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is chambered on or about his person on any public street, road, alley, sidewalk, public right-of-way, or in any public park or any other place of whatever nature that is open to the public in the Cities of Alexandria, Chesapeake, Fairfax, Falls Church, Newport News, Norfolk, Richmond, or Virginia Beach or in the Counties of Arlington, Fairfax, Henrico, Loudoun, or Prince William.
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    iverglas (1000+ posts) Sun Dec-21-08 10:12 PM
    Response to Reply #66
    67. I guess if I had cared enough


    I would have bothered to look it up.

    I'll just have to wait for answers for the rest, I guess.

    Or just review a little history.

    http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

    Yes, fine fellows all, those militant open-carry a******s in Virginia are.





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    I caught a line tonight in "Riding with the Devil" where a Southerner(paraphrasing a bit)stated he thought the South was not going to win the war because the Yankees were concerned with how everyone lived, and wanted to change the lives of everyone, whereas Southerners were just concerned with how each other lived, and how facing someone who was so concerned with how others lived they would never give up the fight until they won.



    I see the same attitude with those who are against the Second Amendment, they simply can't leave us alone, they are always fighting against our rights.

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    Rebfan, an excellent analogy.

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    I wonder what it feels like to have your beliefs disproved by reality, and subsequently fade into history.

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    rebfan wrote:
    I caught a line tonight in "Riding with the Devil" where a Southerner(paraphrasing a bit)stated he thought the South was not going to win the war because the Yankees were concerned with how everyone lived, and wanted to change the lives of everyone, whereas Southerners were just concerned with how each other lived, and how facing someone who was so concerned with how others lived they would never give up the fight until they won.



    I see the same attitude with those who are against the Second Amendment, they simply can't leave us alone, they are always fighting against our rights.
    Interestingly enough, things have changed a whole lot since 1861-1865. The South has the highest firearms ownership percentage of any distinct region in the country (78%). Compare that to the Northeast where it is only around 22%.

    Another thing is economics. This information is several years old, but I will report it anyway. If the 15 Southern states were considered as a separate country, they would be the third most powerful country in the world, surpassed by the United States as a whole and Japan respectively. As a distinct region, the South is the wealthiest region in America. Once again, this information is perhaps four years old, but I would imagine it is still pretty solid.

    Many of the western states share the spirit and attitude of Southerners when it comes to individual freedom and limited government. Makes you wonder what went wrong with the Northeast in particular since that is where the Revolutionary War began. Why have they cast aside those fundamental traits of Americanism? Don't they remember and hold dear Lexington and Concord and Revere's ride? I do.

    In the final seconds of your life, just before your killer is about to dispatch you to that great eternal darkness, what would you rather have in your hand? A cell phone or a gun?

    Si vis pacem, para bellum.

    America First!

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    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
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    marshaul wrote:
    I wonder what it feels like to have your beliefs disproved by reality, and subsequently fade into history.
    Here's a good quote that a friend of mine used to use for his e-mail sig:

    Nothing generates so much silence as confronting a person with an undeniable truth which is contrary to that person's beliefs.

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    Thats true what southern boy said about the west, I'm from Washington and as a whole with the exception of major cities like seattle we have a southern train of thought.

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    It's really a rural vs. urban thing. Once people get crammed close enough together in cities they seem to lose all sense of reality, becoming popular culture addicts and thinking that everything everyone does is their business.

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    GWRedDragon wrote:
    It's really a rural vs. urban thing. Once people get crammed close enough together in cities they seem to lose all sense of reality, becoming popular culture addicts and thinking that everything everyone does is their business.
    With a few exceptions, I think you're right about that. However, I think the urban and inner city areas attack people who want to be there rather than people going there and then changing. For example, there is no way on earth I would live in Washington, D.C.

    In the final seconds of your life, just before your killer is about to dispatch you to that great eternal darkness, what would you rather have in your hand? A cell phone or a gun?

    Si vis pacem, para bellum.

    America First!

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    SouthernBoy wrote:
    Another thing is economics. This information is several years old, but I will report it anyway. If the 15 Southern states were considered as a separate country, they would be the third most powerful country in the world, surpassed by the United States as a whole and Japan respectively. As a distinct region, the South is the wealthiest region in America.
    In 2005 the southern states received more federal tax dollars than they paid in. Virginia receives 1.50$ for every $1 paid in federal taxes. While states in every other region besides the south pay more into the system than they receive.

    http://www.nemw.org/taxburd.htm

    Here is a list of the Gross State products of the states:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_GDP_(nominal)

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    More people move from the NE and upper Midwest to the South, thenthe other way around. So, I think some of the clash comes whenthe anti-gunners move to areas that support the Second Amendment and set about trying to turn their "new""home" into their old home. I simply do not understand that at all.





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    tripledipper wrote:
    Rebfan, an excellent analogy.
    Thanks.

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    TFred wrote:
    Here's a good quote that a friend of mine used to use for his e-mail sig:

    Nothing generates so much silence as confronting a person with an undeniable truth which is contrary to that person's beliefs.
    'Cept when you are confronting the Brady Campaign or Million Mom March.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
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    Citizen wrote:
    TFred wrote:
    Here's a good quote that a friend of mine used to use for his e-mail sig:

    Nothing generates so much silence as confronting a person with an undeniable truth which is contrary to that person's beliefs.
    'Cept when you are confronting the Brady Campaign or Million Mom March.
    Yes, they just tend to lie louder.

    TFred


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    TFred wrote:
    Citizen wrote:
    TFred wrote:
    Here's a good quote that a friend of mine used to use for his e-mail sig:

    Nothing generates so much silence as confronting a person with an undeniable truth which is contrary to that person's beliefs.
    'Cept when you are confronting the Brady Campaign or Million Mom March.
    Yes, they just tend to lie louder.
    Oh! You've been to one of their meetings, too, I see.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Oh my God....I almost puked when I read some of the replies; especially from the one degenerate named "iverglas" that cant seem to grasp the idea of debate. I looked through many pages of her replies, I believe her to be mentally deranged or retarded in some way.

    In addition, her lack of class and upbringing are evident on just about every post -- all she does it post insults and duck questions. Class act all the way -- not!

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    Regular Member Neplusultra's Avatar
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    GWRedDragon wrote:
    It's really a rural vs. urban thing. Once people get crammed close enough together in cities they seem to lose all sense of reality, becoming popular culture addicts and thinking that everything everyone does is their business.
    True, if you think of it the psychological effects of living in a large city can make sense. In the small town I live in it would be impolite not to say hi, or at least acknowledge someone when you pass them on the street. That would be impossible to do in NYC for instance. If your neighbor needs help you know him and he's only one person. In a large city their may be huge neighborhoods with tens of thousands that need help so an organized, read governmental, system is not so unreasonable. Although still not best IMO.

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    Regular Member Neplusultra's Avatar
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    mkl wrote:
    In 2005 the southern states received more federal tax dollars than they paid in. Virginia receives 1.50$ for every $1 paid in federal taxes. While states in every other region besides the south pay more into the system than they receive.

    http://www.nemw.org/taxburd.htm
    Yep, the borrower shall become the slave of the lender. What a price we'd pay to be a truly sovereign state.

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    I've seen "iverglas" around before. She has a particularly deep hatred for Oleg Volk. Apparently, he is "misogynist trash" or something like that. After some time it came out that really she just hates pornography, finds it offensive as being inherently demeaning to women, and believes Oleg's work to be pornographic.

    How someone so illiberal can be considered a "liberal" in modern times is beyond me. However, such authoritarianism is disgusting.

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    We should feel fortunate to have for enemies people so utterly shrill and smug. Such abrasive self-satisfaction could damage even a just cause. One so unjust as the prohibition of self-defense will eventually be undermined completely by such attitudes.

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    Neplusultra wrote:
    mkl wrote:
    In 2005 the southern states received more federal tax dollars than they paid in. Virginia receives 1.50$ for every $1 paid in federal taxes. While states in every other region besides the south pay more into the system than they receive.

    http://www.nemw.org/taxburd.htm
    Yep, the borrower shall become the slave of the lender. What a price we'd pay to be a truly sovereign state.
    Its already been paid--they sold their souls and ours for political power.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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