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Thread: Question about CPLs and buying

  1. #1
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    I've read that the 5 day waiting peroid doesn't apply if you have a CPL, but when I purchased mine, I was put on hold by whoever the guy called, and had to wait the five days. (It took about two weeks to get the approval.)
    Is it a federal law that you still have to wait?

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    Nope, you should have no waiting period if you have a CPL. They run the NICS check and you should be able to walk out with your new gun. Now, if you got a hold on your NICS check, then that could explain the wait. But the law itself does not require the wait for CPL holders.

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    To be more specific, Washington State law provides for a waiting period for delivering a pistol after purchase, that does not apply if you have a WA CPL (RCW 9.41.090.)

    This is a completely separate issue from getting a hold on the required federal instant background check (which appears to be what happened to you.)

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    Also, there seems to be no consistency on the accept/hold/deny decision coming while you are at the shop purchasing. I bought 4 handguns across a few months last year and one would get the accept right there on the spotbut the next would get a hold, the accept came4 workingdays later (5 days). You can contact the FBI to find out what is going on, but they won't give out specific info about the request over the phone. You must send in a request form (notarized IIRC) and wait awhile to get the info. Here are a couple of links to get you started if you are curious:

    http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cjisd/nics/nicsfact.htm#bkchk

    http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cjisd/nics/index.htm





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    To directly answer your question...

    There is no federal waiting period* for handguns let alone long guns. (For all intensive purposes we're referring to non-NFA firearms)

    The waiting periods you hear about across the country are STATE mandated waiting periods.

    The WA CPL allows your to cash and carry your firearm (meaning purchase it and walk out with it like you had just purchased some snow tires for your car). The CPL is a state issued permit and the 5day waiting period is a state law. The hiccup is the CPL in our state does not circumvent the federal mandated NICS check we are all so familiar with when we purchase a firearm.

    So it looks like this:

    Step 1:
    Gear up to purchase your firearm.
    State Mandated 5 day waiting period for handguns (CPL's exempt) proceed to step 2

    Step 2:
    Federal NICS check to ensure you have nothing preventing you from legally obtaining the firearm. Check comes back while you're in the store? Proceed to step 3. If not, proceed to step 4.

    Step 3:
    If you have a CPL and the NICS comes back clean. Step 5.

    Step 4:
    *If the NICS is delayed you have to wait until the feds call your FFL back to give you the green light before you take it home. If NICS never calls back the FFL must turn over the firearm to you. Step 5.


    Step 5:

    Get to the range!

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    One more thing I wanted to add...

    many states' CPL equivalent (CHL, CWP, whatever you want to call it) fall within the NICS background check requirements so if you walk into a store in one of those respective states you don't even have to do the Federal NICS. It truly would be cash and carry with no wait whatsoever.

    Provided you live in the state and have a valid permit, of course.

  7. #7
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    Hey SKSGuy, can you remind us why it is that WA's permit doesn't meet the NICS background-check requirements?

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    [font="Arial"][size="-1"]From:
    SKSGuy wrote: [/b]
    If NICS never calls back the FFL must turn over the firearm to you.

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    SKSGuy wrote:
    To directly answer your question...

    There is no federal waiting period* for handguns let alone long guns. (For all intensive purposes we're referring to non-NFA firearms)

    The waiting periods you hear about across the country are STATE mandated waiting periods.

    The WA CPL allows your to cash and carry your firearm (meaning purchase it and walk out with it like you had just purchased some snow tires for your car). The CPL is a state issued permit and the 5day waiting period is a state law. The hiccup is the CPL in our state does not circumvent the federal mandated NICS check we are all so familiar with when we purchase a firearm.

    So it looks like this:

    Step 1:
    Gear up to purchase your firearm.
    State Mandated 5 day waiting period for handguns (CPL's exempt) proceed to step 2

    Step 2:
    Federal NICS check to ensure you have nothing preventing you from legally obtaining the firearm. Check comes back while you're in the store? Proceed to step 3. If not, proceed to step 4.

    Step 3:
    If you have a CPL and the NICS comes back clean. Step 5.

    Step 4:
    *If the NICS is delayed you have to wait until the feds call your FFL back to give you the green light before you take it home. If NICS never calls back the FFL must turn over the firearm to you. Step 5.


    Step 5:

    Get to the range!

  10. #10
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    SKSGuy wrote:
    *If the NICS is delayed you have to wait until the feds call your FFL back to give you the green light before you take it home. If NICS never calls back the FFL must turn over the firearm to you.

    From:
    http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cjisd/nics/nicsfact.htm#bkchk

    The Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act of 1993 allows three business days to obtain this information before a Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL) can transfer a firearm. The FFL is not prohibited from transferring the firearm after three business days have passed; however, the FFL is not required to transfer the firearm.



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    kparker wrote:
    Hey SKSGuy, can you remind us why it is that WA's permit doesn't meet the NICS background-check requirements?
    Take a look at 18 U.S.C. 922 (t)(3)

    I decided to take a snippet from NRA's website so as not to rephrase everything over:

    "My state has a permit-to-purchase system. What can I expect under the NICS system?

    Permits that meet the criteria established by BATF will exempt purchasers from a NICS check at the point-of-sale, and handgun permits that meet the criteria will be accepted for long gun purchases. New buyers who do not have a permit will have to undergo a NICS check, but all "permit states" are expected to incorporate a NICS check into the permit application process by Nov. 30, 1998. Also, anyone renewing his permit will undergo a NICS check at that time.
    Note, however, that the exemption for permit holders only applies if the permit was issued within the past five years, and the permit process has verified that possession of a firearm by the applicant would not violate any federal or state law.
    BATF`s position is that "as of Nov. 30, 1998, the `information available to` state officials will include the NICS database. Accordingly . . . permits issued on or after Nov. 30, 1998, will be valid alternatives under the permanent provisions of the Brady law only if the state officials conduct a NICS check on all permit applicants."
    So, a permit holder with a permit issued more than five years prior will need to undergo a NICS check, as will new permit applicants. Permit renewal applicants will undergo a NICS check at the appropriate time as well. The state agency responsible for issuing permits can answer any questions about how these changes will be implemented."

    From the ATF:
    http://www.atf.gov/firearms/bradylaw/permit_chart.htm

    http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/br...120503wash.pdf




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    bcp wrote:
    SKSGuy wrote:
    *If the NICS is delayed you have to wait until the feds call your FFL back to give you the green light before you take it home. If NICS never calls back the FFL must turn over the firearm to you.

    From:
    http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cjisd/nics/nicsfact.htm#bkchk

    The Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act of 1993 allows three business days to obtain this information before a Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL) can transfer a firearm. The FFL is not prohibited from transferring the firearm after three business days have passed; however, the FFL is not required to transfer the firearm.

    Oop! I knew that. Embarrassing.

    Here is a list (pg 7) of those exempt states:
    http://lcav.org/content/background_checks.pdf

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    Also, there seems to be no consistency on the accept/hold/deny decision coming while you are at the shop purchasing. I bought 4 handguns across a few months last year and one would get the accept right there on the spot but the next would get a hold, the accept came 4 working days later (5 days).
    Well, I bought my second gun ever today. Got it on the spot, no delay.

    The first time I expected a delay- I HAD a juvenile record from almost ten years ago, which included felony arrests without convictions, and this was part of what caused a (unlawful) denial for the CPL.

    Also found out from the seller (FFL- I think, still don't know what that abbreviation means) that 'my' police department is difficult to work with, especially in areas of law, and that he had had to fax them RCWs before, similar to what I did (I did it in person- didn't have an affect until it included a direct threat of legal action.) I didn't ask what the subject was, which I kicked myslelf in the ass for as soon as I walked away.

  14. #14
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    FFL = Federal Firearms License
    MOST people deal with type 1 & 2. I've personally had a type 3 at one point.

    There are different types:


    Type 1 Title 1 dealer or gunsmith. NFA (with class 3 tax stamp) other than destructive devices

    Type 2 Title 1 dealer doing business as a pawnbroker

    Type 3 Licensed collector of Curio & Relic (C&R) firearms

    Type 6 Licensed manufacturer of ammunition and reloading components other than Armor Piercing ammunition

    Type 7 Title 1 dealer and manufacturer of firearms, including NFA (with class 2 tax stamp) other than Destructive Devices, ammunition and ammunition components other than Armor Piercing ammunition

    Type 8 Importer of Title 1 firearms and ammunition

    Type 9 Dealer in Title 1 firearms including NFA destructive devices, but no other NFA items

    Type 10 Manufacturer of Title 1 firearms, ammunition and ammunition components, including NFA Destructive Devices but no other NFA items, and not including Armor Piercing ammunition

    Type 11 Importer of Title 1 firearms, ammunition and NFA Destructive Devices, but no other NFA items

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