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Thread: So you want to get tough ?

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    live in County - http://www.micounties.org/

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    Attend your local government meeting ! First two three times sit back and Absorb put then to task on OPEN Meetings and Freedom of Information Act keep them on there toes .Then with politeness During open citizens time vocalize your thoughts but make sure you are correct on your topic take no prisoners .Be a ambassador of Education they will respect you and US . Please add any sites that may help others .Then post your updates to motivate all.

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    Here is test !
    The Board meets under the rules of the Michigan Open Meetings Act, 1976 PA 267. Closed sessions, usually held prior to the meetings, also follow these guidelines. That means meetings are posted in advance and minutes are kept.

    Board Meeting Participation Guidelines
    • Public Hearing: Once the public hearing is declared open, residents are invited to speak. Afterward, the public hearing is declared closed, and the Board may take action on the item.
    • Citizens' comments on agenda items: Residents who wish to comment on a specific action item may do so when the issue is being discussed by the Board.
    • Citizens' comments on non-agenda items: Residents who wish to comment on non-agenda items may do so at the beginning of regular meetings.
    • Additional public comments: Citizens are given a second opportunity to make any comments at the end of the meeting.
    Meeting Participation Code of Courtesy
    The Board respects the rights of citizens to participate in the legislative process, and asks that everyone adhere to the following Code of Courtesy:

    • Begin your comments by stating your name and address for the record.
    • All public comments should provide a point of view, gain information, share a criticism, or express a concern.
    • Be considerate of others who wish to speak by limiting your comments to a reasonable length. The Supervisor may impose a three-minute limit on individual comments when deemed necessary.
    • At the Supervisor's discretion, the forum portion of the agenda may be limited to 30 minutes Public Meetings******** This is good*******
    The Board meets under the rules of the Michigan Open Meetings Act, 1976 PA 267. Closed sessions, usually held prior to the meetings, also follow these guidelines. That means meetings are posted in advance and minutes are kept.

    Board Meeting Participation Guidelines
    • Public Hearing: Once the public hearing is declared open, residents are invited to speak. Afterward, the public hearing is declared closed, and the Board may take action on the item.
    • Citizens' comments on agenda items: Residents**Wrong ! any person may speak !] ^^^ who wish to comment on a specific action item may do so when the issue is being discussed by the Board.
    • Citizens' comments on non-agenda items: Residents **wrong !**who wish to comment on non-agenda items may do so at the beginning of regular meetings.
    • Additional public comments: Citizens are given a second opportunity to make any comments at the end of the meeting.
    Meeting Participation Code of Courtesy
    The Board respects the rights of citizens to participate in the legislative process, and asks that everyone adhere to the following Code of Courtesy:

    • Begin your comments by stating your name and address for the record. ***Only if ALL do !***
    • All public comments should provide a point of view, gain information, share a criticism, or express a concern.
    • Be considerate of others who wish to speak by limiting your comments to a reasonable length. The Supervisor may impose a three-minute limit on individual comments when deemed necessary. ****Wrong ! Only if The Board has passed Time Limit and it is enforced for ALL at ALL times if not NO time limit !***
    • At the Supervisor's discretion, the forum portion of the agenda may be limited to 30 minutes Wrong Time of open Citizens Time May NEVER be Total Limited **!
    Access to Public Meeting Is to all*********************************************** *******************TOP[/font]******************TOP[/align][/font]

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    taxwhat wrote:
    Attend your local government meeting ! First two three times sit back and Absorb put then to task on OPEN Meetings and Freedom of Information Act keep them on there toes .Then with politeness During open citizens time vocalize your thoughts but make sure you are correct on your topic take no prisoners .Be a ambassador of Education they will respect you and US . Please add any sites that may help others .Then post your updates to motivate all.
    I agree, we can call out the legislature all we want, but what kind of a voice does 100, 500, 5000 citizens have? we need to band together, and yes, attempt to influence the legislature, but while doing so, we need to work on our local gov'ts.

    hypothetical.

    I am introducing this bill because I have recieved over 500 letters demanding this portion of the law be changed, and I support this.

    or

    I am introducing this bill because I have recieved over 500 letters, and been contacted by representatives of these 5 counties, and these 3 cities demanding this change.

    or

    I am introducing this bill because I've recieved over 5000 letters, and have been contacted by nearly half the township boards in the state demanding that this be changed.


    which is more likely to pass?

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    edit for doggone double post

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    CITY COUNCIL MEETING INFORMATION

    City Council meetings are open to the public and are held on the first and third Tuesdays of each month in the Council Chambers at City Hall, 23200 Gratiot Avenue, Eastpointe, Michigan 48021; (586) 445-5016 ext. 3. All meetings are held in accordance with the Michigan Open Meetings Act. The City Council meeting agenda is prepared by the City Manager's office.


    Each regular meeting agenda contains two "Hearings of the Public" as standard items, one near the beginning of the meeting and one near the end of the meeting. Any public statements made during the "Hearing of the Public" are subject to the following rules:







    Public participants must first state their name and place of residence.





    Public participants may speak for a maximum of five minutes.





    Public participants may speak only once during each "Hearing of the Public."


    CITY COUNCIL MEETING INFORMATION


    City Council meetings are open to the public and are held on the first and third Tuesdays of each month in the Council Chambers at City Hall, 23200 Gratiot Avenue, Eastpointe, Michigan 48021; (586) 445-5016 ext. 3. All meetings are held in accordance with the Michigan Open Meetings Act. The City Council meeting agenda is prepared by the City Manager's office.


    Each regular meeting agenda contains two "Hearings of the Public" as standard items, one near the beginning of the meeting and one near the end of the meeting. Any public statements made during the "Hearing of the Public" are subject to the following rules:









    Public participants must first state their name and place of residence. Only if all do at all times





    Public participants may speak for a maximum of five minutes. Only if passed and never vared





    Public participants may speak only once during each "Hearing of the Public." Who made this up ? Wrong !




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    guidelines for audience participation apply to a public hearing.



    General Courtesies For All
    Please direct your comments to the Mayor.
    Please be polite and refrain from using offensive or abusive language.



    Communication With The City
    In addition to attending City Council meetings, you can communicate your specific interests with the City of Novi in a variety of ways. You may want to consider these actions prior to attending a meeting:

    • Contact the city departments directly to speak with the staff who are there to assist you with your questions and comments. If you are not sure which department to speak with, contact the Public Information office at 248-347-0494 and they will direct you to the appropriate personnel.
    • City department directors oversee the daily operations of the city and may have the specific information that you want. Prior to an item being placed on the meeting agenda, there has usually been a record of action of the subject within the city departments, so it may be best to start your inquiries there. Department phone numbers are available on this website, or you may call the general city number at 248-347-0460 for an automated listing of departments.
    • You may also consider writing a letter to the City Council. Your letter is then photocopied listed under communications and included in the packet of information that is given to Council prior to a meeting. The letter should be sent to the attention: Novi City Council, 45175 West Ten Mile Road, Novi, MI 48375



    All here is legal

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    For today and tomorrow, we need to remember that the founders of our republic did not choose representative government to remove us from the decision process. They chose it, in part,to ensure that moderation and accountability would be built into that process. We Americans have abdicated most of the power we have over our government by our absence. It is well past time to make up for our short-comings.

    For next year and the years to come, we need to remember that local politicians form the largest portion of our dominant political parties. These are often the people who will be voted into office for county, state, and even national offices. As we petition them today for our grievances, we help them develop the perspective they will carry in years to come.

    We must be insistent. We must be persuasive. We must give our opponents nothing they can use against us.

    Please also remember that our state legislators are well aware of who fills the local offices in their district. As they consider new legislation, they are definitely receptive to these people's view points. Any council person, mayor, sheriff, or police chief that indicates a new law would be generally unenforceable (or of no positive substance), is typically given that lawmaker's ear. It is our job to influence the understanding of these local office holders before they share their opinions.



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    So many battles are fought and won, but never heralded. For the sake of increasing the momentum of the Michigan Open Carry movement, I suggest we create some type of victory chart.

    This would not be to brag about how so-and-so was put in their place. I would be more interested in seeing a list of documentable incidents where published or posted city, park, state rules were removed or amended to reflect the law. I would include any legislative victories in which OC activists had taken a significant part. I would even include a major change of understanding in a local council or LEO department which brought them toward a better understanding of the law.

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    Hcidem wrote:
    So many battles are fought and won, but never heralded. For the sake of increasing the momentum of the Michigan Open Carry movement, I suggest we create some type of victory chart.

    This would not be to brag about how so-and-so was put in their place. I would be more interested in seeing a list of documentable incidents where published or posted city, park, state rules were removed or amended to reflect the law. I would include any legislative victories in which OC activists had taken a significant part. I would even include a major change of understanding in a local council or LEO department which brought them toward a better understanding of the law.
    I received a response that the City of East Lansing will be taking down any no firearms signs they may have at their city parks.

    I'm working on removing the no firearm ordinance in parks fromBath Township. They are in the reviewing state and I will post the result.

    Currently working with Traverse City on removing the no firearm ordinance in their parks. Just notified them two weeks ago and have notgotten a response. I emailed them yesterday for an update, with no response. I did give them 90 days to correct the issue. I will update as needed.

    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    I'm just happy some body used some of my favorite words...Representative Republic. So many people use the D word ugh!

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    Hcidem wrote:
    For today and tomorrow, we need to remember that the founders of our republic did not choose representative government to remove us from the decision process. They chose it, in part,to ensure that moderation and accountability would be built into that process. We Americans have abdicated most of the power we have over our government by our absence. It is well past time to make up for our short-comings.

    For next year and the years to come, we need to remember that local politicians form the largest portion of our dominant political parties. These are often the people who will be voted into office for county, state, and even national offices. As we petition them today for our grievances, we help them develop the perspective they will carry in years to come.

    We must be insistent. We must be persuasive. We must give our opponents nothing they can use against us.

    Please also remember that our state legislators are well aware of who fills the local offices in their district. As they consider new legislation, they are definitely receptive to these people's view points. Any council person, mayor, sheriff, or police chief that indicates a new law would be generally unenforceable (or of no positive substance), is typically given that lawmaker's ear. It is our job to influence the understanding of these local office holders before they share their opinions.

    The bold is GOLD ...........This is very good .....TEAM work . Any council person, mayor, sheriff, or police chief that indicates a new law would be generally unenforceable (or of no positive substance), is typically given that lawmaker's[ VOTER is key ]ear.

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    If you wish to ask question ask . or pm or call 734-657-3268....................Is there a no gun sign at your [ City Hall , Twp meeting place ,Village or other public place ] is it legal ? ASK ?> Does your Police Office Have no gun posting on general [public ]entrance ? ASK is it legal ? At public park ?

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    The little City of Rockford is one of those places where one might expect a lot of "generally accepted" extra-legal activities such as this type of signage. They continually surprise me, however.

    I have found no ordinances, postings,or rules contrary to Michigan's pre-emption law on firearms. As usual, they are particularly within the limits of the law.

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    [/b]

    Attached Image (viewed 496 times):



    IMO We Must Have 3 to 5 County RTM [ organisers]These are to large to have Mini rallies [ Educational Meets] , Divide and Conquer .Urban < rulal may have more .

  19. #19
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    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/15442.html

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/15972.html



    The links above talk about RTM’s. I originally suggested we get a few for each region and would love to have one for each county. But no one has stepped up since the original15 or so volunteered. So if anyone wants a particular county please let me know.

    To date members have worked independently as a grass roots operation with a small core group of people assisting where they can, and that has worked out well. There is no board of directors, no official officers, just volunteers doing what they can. But the Michigan Open Carry (MOC) movement is growing and with growth comes increasing responsibility as our actions could affect millions of Michigan gun owners.

    It’s evident that open carry is growing in Michigan
    . With the recent arrest and dismissal for open carry in Grand Haven and the possible civil litigation to follow it’s prudent to consider the possibility that as word gets out those opposed to OC will start enacting ways to restrict or ban our OC right.
    I’m asking for volunteers to be “MOC Regional Team Members” (MOC-RTM) with a goal of five for each region, that’s just 25 people total, and more is always welcome. These Team members would be the “go to person” in managing OC activities in their regions. Ideally I would like to see one contact person for each county, but for now 5 people per region would be very helpful. Duties for the contact person could include but not limited to any of the following.

    1) Organize OC get-togethers, present talks on OC to local sportsman groups, gun clubs, Police agencies, etc. Develop other members to be county contact persons within their regions.

    2) Contact and be interviewed by the media.

    3) Keep abreast and post any current pro and anti-gun legislation in their regions.

    4) Work to develop good relationships with Sheriffs, Local PDs, and Legislators in their regions. Also help with any clerical need e.g. mailings, fund-raising, etc.

    Everyone has talents that they can use to promote the OC cause. The MOC-RTM would develop a network of talented volunteers within their region to assist them in promoting OC.

    As a start I have divided the state into regions that takes into account Counties and to some extent senate political boundaries. There is some overlap between districts but at this time we will have to deal with this until we get more volunteers to work smaller areas within regions.

    If you are interested in helping to represent and work in your area let me know either by posting here or by PMing me. You will have the opportunity to shape the future of OC in
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Now that's motivational. Hope and pray there is a line to sign up ! Just doit .

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    Venator wrote:
    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/15442.html

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/15972.html



    The links above talk about RTM’s. I originally suggested we get a few for each region and would love to have one for each county. But no one has stepped up since the original15 or so volunteered. So if anyone wants a particular county please let me know.

    To date members have worked independently as a grass roots operation with a small core group of people assisting where they can, and that has worked out well. There is no board of directors, no official officers, just volunteers doing what they can. But the Michigan Open Carry (MOC) movement is growing and with growth comes increasing responsibility as our actions could affect millions of Michigan gun owners.

    It’s evident that open carry is growing in Michigan
    . With the recent arrest and dismissal for open carry in Grand Haven and the possible civil litigation to follow it’s prudent to consider the possibility that as word gets out those opposed to OC will start enacting ways to restrict or ban our OC right.
    I’m asking for volunteers to be “MOC Regional Team Members” (MOC-RTM) with a goal of five for each region, that’s just 25 people total, and more is always welcome. These Team members would be the “go to person” in managing OC activities in their regions. Ideally I would like to see one contact person for each county, but for now 5 people per region would be very helpful. Duties for the contact person could include but not limited to any of the following.

    1) Organize OC get-togethers, present talks on OC to local sportsman groups, gun clubs, Police agencies, etc. Develop other members to be county contact persons within their regions.

    2) Contact and be interviewed by the media.

    3) Keep abreast and post any current pro and anti-gun legislation in their regions.

    4) Work to develop good relationships with Sheriffs, Local PDs, and Legislators in their regions. Also help with any clerical need e.g. mailings, fund-raising, etc.

    Everyone has talents that they can use to promote the OC cause. The MOC-RTM would develop a network of talented volunteers within their region to assist them in promoting OC.

    As a start I have divided the state into regions that takes into account Counties and to some extent senate political boundaries. There is some overlap between districts but at this time we will have to deal with this until we get more volunteers to work smaller areas within regions.

    If you are interested in helping to represent and work in your area let me know either by posting here or by PMing me. You will have the opportunity to shape the future of OC in
    Look I do not want to be the Grand poobah nor do INot respect Venator .My actions are to make you Think !Using the senate boundaries is one . What has Your Senator done for you [us] ? Do You know your Leader at home { work ] ? Can You name home town [ Village President ,City mayor ,Twp Supervisor] ? Can you name there hobbies ,likes ,week spots ? Anyone can talk trash about size of there GUN now go after the
    keepers of the LEOs! The group is doomed if they do not take up with
    the vim and vigor to with to become winners ..Yes they will fall but
    will get up and ask questions again and again until the overlords are
    tamed .WE must make government do there JOB ,WE the People . Please I am not English major its the thought .Make it happen No One will do it for YOU .



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    You have heard never leave home without it ! MOC never Sell without one ! http://www.michigan.gov

    (To Print: use your browser's print function) Release Date: November 25, 2003
    Last Update: January 10, 2007

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Non-Profit Corporation Information
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    File non-profit Articles of Incorporation with the Michigan Department of Labor & Economic Growth, Corporation Division at (517) 241-6470 to determine name availability and to request forms too.

    Contact the Internal Revenue Service at (800) 829-4933 to obtain the publication "Tax-Exempt Status for your Organization" (Publication 557) and the accompanying package "Application for Recognition of Exemption" (Form 1023 and Form 872-C).

    Due to a change in the law regarding nonprofit organizations, the Department of Treasury no longer has an application for exemption process. Organizations exempted by statute, organizations granted exemption from Federal Income Tax under Internal Revenue Code Section 501(c)(3) or 501(c)(4) or organizations that had previously received an exemption letter from this division are entitled to sales and use tax exemption. A copy of the federal exemption letter or a letter previously issued by this department must accompany a completed Michigan Sales and Use Tax Certificate of Exemption, form 3372.

    Contact the Department of Treasury, Single Business Tax Division (517) 636-4700 to determine if the organization will be exempt from the state Single Business Tax.

    If the non-profit organization is soliciting funds from the public, it should be registered with the Attorney General's Charitable Trust Division at (517) 373-1152. When contacted, the Attorney General's Office will mail you (at no charge) an "Initial Charitable Trust/Charitable Solicitation Questionnaire."

    Further Information:

    Volunteer Accounting Service Team of Michigan (VAST-MI), a private nonprofit organization, publishes a start-up packet to assist new nonprofits in fulfilling their filing requirements. The packet costs $25.00 (plus sales tax and shipping, if applicable).

    Contact VAST-MI, 18145 Mack Avenue,

    Detroit, Michigan 48224 or (313) 647-9620.

    Revised: 1/2007





    Copyright (c) 2009 State of Michigan
    I drive past ever time I take my wife for treatment , Let me know if you want me to pick one up .

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    Picking up packet Tuesday !

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    Some of are Colonists came from there .........



















    This may be closer to reality than you think











    You're sound asleep when you hear a thump outside your bedroom door. Half-awake, and nearly paralyzed with fear, you hear muffled whispers. At least two people have broken into your house and are moving your way. With your heart pumping, you reach down beside your bed and pick up your shotgun. You rack a shell into the chamber, then inch toward the door and open it. In the darkness, you make out two shadows.

    One holds something that looks like a crowbar. When the intruder brandishes it as if to strike, you raise the shotgun and fire. The blast knocks both thugs to the floor. One writhes and screams while the second man crawls to the front door and lurches outside. As you pi ck up the telephone to call police, you know you're in trouble.

    In your country, most guns were outlawed years before, and the few That are privately owned are so stringently regulated as to make them useless. Yours was never registered. Police arrive and inform you that the second burglar has died. They arrest you for First Degree Murder and Illegal Possession of a Firearm. When you talk to your attorney, he tells you not to worry: authorities will probably plea the case down to manslaughter.

    "What kind of sentence will I get?" you ask.

    "Only ten-to-twelve years," he replies, as if that's nothing. "Behave yourself, and you'll be out in seven."

    The next day, the shooting is the lead story in the local newspaper. Somehow, you're portrayed as an eccentric vigilante while the two men you shot are represented as choirboys. Their friends and relatives can't find an unkind word to say about them. Buried deep down in the article, authorities acknowledge that both "victims" have been arrested numerous times. But the next day's headline says it all: "Lovable Rogue Son Didn't Deserve to Die." The thieves have been transformed from career criminals into Robin Hood-type pranksters. As the days wear on, the story takes wings. The national media picks it up, then the international media. The surviving burglar has become a folk hero.

    Your attorney says the thief is preparing to sue you, and he'll probably win. The media publishes reports that your home has been burglarized several times in the past and that you've been critical of local police for their la ck of effort in apprehending the suspects. After the last break-in, you told your neighbor that you would be prepared next time. The District Attorney uses this to allege that you were lying in wait for the burglars.

    A few months later, you go to trial. The charges haven't been reduced, as your lawyer had so confidently predicted. When you take the stand, your anger at the injustice of it all works against you. Prosecutors paint a picture of you as a mean, vengeful man. It doesn't take long for the jury to convict you of all charges.



    The judge sentences you to life in prison.



    This case really happened.



    On August 22, 1999, Tony Martin of Emneth, Norfolk , England , killed one burglar and wounded a second. In April, 2000, he was convicted and is now serving a life term.



    How did it become a crime to defend one's own life in the once great British Empire ?



    It started with the Pistols Act of 1903. This seemingly reasonable law forbade selling pistols to minors or felons and established that handgun sales were to be made only to those who had a license. The Firearms Act of 1920 expanded licensing to include not only handguns but all firearms except shotguns.



    Later laws passed in 1953 and 1967 outlawed the carrying of any weapon by private citizens and mandated the registration of all shotguns.



    Momentum for total handgun confiscation began in earnest after the Hungerford mass shooting in 1987. Michael Ryan, a mentally disturbed Man with a Kalashnikov rifle, walked down the streets shooting everyone he saw. When the smoke cleared, 17 people were dead.



    The British public, already de-sensitized by eighty years of "gun control", demanded even tougher restrictions. (The seizure of all privately owned handguns was the objective even though Ryan used a rifle.)



    Nine years later, at Dunblane , Scotland , Thomas Hamilton used a semi-automatic weapon to murder 16 children and a teacher at a public school.



    For many years, the media had portrayed all gun owner s as mentally unstable, or worse, criminals. Now the press had a real kook with which to beat up law-abiding gun owners. Day after day, week after week, the media gave up all pretense of objectivity and demanded a total ban on all handguns. The Dunblane Inquiry, a few months later,

    Sealed the fate of the few sidearm still owned by private citizens.



    During the years in which the British government incrementally took Away most gun rights, the notion that a citizen had the right to armed self-defense came to be seen as vigilantism. Authorities refused to grant gun licenses to people who were threatened, claiming that self-defense was no longer considered a reason to own a gun. Citizens who shot burglars or robbers or rapists were charged while the real criminals were released.



    Indeed, after the Martin shooting, a police spokesman was quoted as saying, "We cannot have people take the law into their own hands."



    All of Martin's neighbors had been robbed numerous times, and several elderly people were severely injured in beatings by young thugs who had no fear of the consequences. Martin himself, a collector of antiques, had seen most of his collection trashed or stolen by burglars.



    When the Dunblane Inquiry ended, citizens who owned handguns were given three months to turn them over to local authorities. Being good British subjects, most people obeyed the law. The few who didn't were visited by police and threatened with ten-year prison sentences if they didn't comply. Police later bragged that they'd taken nearly 200,000 handguns from private citizens.



    How did the authorities know who had handguns? The guns had been registered and licensed. Kinda like cars.



    Sound familiar?



    WAKE UP AMERICA , THIS IS WHY OUR FOUNDING FATHERS PUT THE SECOND AMENDMENT IN OUR CONSTITUTION.



    "..it does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.."

    --Samuel Adams


  25. #25
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    S E Michgan all mine, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    800

    Post imported post

    MSU to offer classes in homeland security
    EAST LANSING, Mich.
    (AP) — The Michigan De­partment of Military & Vet­eran Affairs and Michigan State University’s School of Criminal Justice are team­ing up on four homeland de­fense and security courses.
    The courses will be for the Michigan National Guard and other public safety per­sonnel.
    The first 15-week course is called Foundations of Home­land Defense and Security and is part of a new certifi­cate in Homeland Defense and Security being offered by the School of Criminal Justice.
    Can Anyone attend ? If not Why not ? Is it ONLY for REAL Americans ?
    'The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'
    - Ronald Reagan 'Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases : If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.'- Ronald Reagan

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