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Thread: How Do I prove Ownership of a Gun?

  1. #1
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    Thought this might make a good topic,



    Ok I was reading NRA v. Mayor Ray Nagin, The city of New Orleans admitted that it holds a number of confiscated firearms, and the Property and Evidence Division of the New Orleans Police Department is to return the firearms to their owners on request and proof of ownership.

    How do you prove “Ownership” ?



    A receipt? (I don’t have any of them) some I bought when I was a kid many years ago (shotguns, ext)



    What if you’re a good record keeper (unlike myself) and it’s now lost in the Hurricane?


    So now what do you do?

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    I don't imagine you could with out some sort of paperwork. If the firearm was legally purchased and registered to you then i would imagine you can get the registration paperwork from the BATF.

    The only other way I see you proving it would be if the PD did the proper paperwork which recorded the residence (or what was left of it) it was found at, then you could show a picture ID with that address on it. But I wouldn't count on the PD doing that.

  3. #3
    mdgary
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    I have recorded all serial #'s and taken photos of all my guns , I plan on keeping all of my guns, so I have taken them apart and scribed my initials in a stategic location that only I can find and identify.

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    That's actually a great idea. I knew i joined this community for a reason.

    I think I'm going to have to do the same thing.



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    ATF doesn't maintain a database of who owns what (except for NFA stuff like machine guns). The background check just OKs the person to receive a gun - the weapon details aren't called in even though they're on the 4473 form. You might be able to get a copy of the 4473 or the "bound book" entry from the dealer you bought the gun from, if that's the case. That or make up handwritten receipts for private purchases. Better yet, record all pertinent info and take pics and give a copy to your insurance agent or attorney or someone at a remote location so the info is (more) retrievable after some disaster.

    -ljp

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    I keep serial #s on google documents (and on paper).

    Those will probably last longer than I live.

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    kurtmax_0 wrote:
    I keep serial #s on google documents (and on paper).

    Those will probably last longer than I live.
    I wouldn't recommend keeping info like that on Google.

    I have mine on a couple of flash drives, and hard copy of course.

  8. #8
    mdgary
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    serial #'s can easily be wiped out on a firearm, I enscribe my initials in a stategic location on my firearms that can be identified only by me..

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    Campaign Veteran T Dubya's Avatar
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    That is a good question. The right answer is this. New Orleans is a rogue state acting outside of the constitutional agreementthat Louisiana has with the Union. The mayor, the police chief, and all the law enforcement officers that took an oath to uphold the constitution should be brought up on charges. The only officers that should be exemptare the ones that didn't confiscate guns. I don't know if they even exist.

    New Orleans officials might say that I wasn't there and that they were under marshall law. My answer would be simple. There is no part of the constitution that has rules for marshall law and the constitution of the United States can never be superceded by marshall law.

    If that would have been Virginia I would have had to make a citizen's arrest.
    "These are the shock troops (opencarry.org) of the gun lobby. And, they are not going away."
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    Since we have gun registration in Michigan I show them my Green registration Card(s)
    The use of force is a last resort. One aspect of violence is that it is unpredictable. Although your initial intention may be to use limited force, once you have engaged in violence the consequences are unpredictable. Violence always brings about unexpected results and almost always provokes retaliation.

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    It's not a concern of mine. My guns are tightly locked away so they probably won't get stolen. Plus, other than a possible OCing incident, it's extremely unlikely that I would have my guns forcibly and illegally confiscated and live to whine about it.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    Unless you kept some form of documentation off site from your house, it would possibly be destroyed by the same disaster which brought on the confiscation in the first place. A flood may not destroy your guns, but it does horrible things to paper work.

    In another case of confiscations, victims of an F-5tornado in Greensburg, Kansas were disarmed by authorities. In this case, even if they had records of their firearms, what likelihood do they have of finding those records.

    The few homes that were left intact were broken into and the guns removed.

    Funny, reports are that most of the best guns were never recovered. There were numerous reports of stolen guns being sold by agents that had been there to "help maintain the order".

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    I'm not sure if I know exactly how guns were being confiscated when Katrina occurred, were they being taken from folks just walking around and OC, or were the cops going from door to door confiscating firearms??

    it mighta been kinda tuff to have a showdown in the streets of such a disaster as one gun owner being confronted by 1/2 dozen cops , but I'd be Damned if they came to the front door and demanded me to hand em over.. That woulda been a mess probably for me and the cops!!

    as far as being able to claim a confiscated firearm, the police dept in new Orleans most likely sold em out on the street or picked through em and rat holed what they wanted.. I'd say if the dept. doesn't have an evidence tag on a particular firearm, and therefore it wasn't used in the commission of a crime, then they should be bound by law to at least advertise it publicly and allow someone to come forth with proof of #'s or registration..

    anytime a tornado siren blows around here, The wife and I have our handguns in the basement with us, so the looters need to bring their own firepower if one does land on my hill and tear the place up as far as the cops feeling the need to run all over town and collect up all the firearms? their ain't enough cops around here!!

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    They did both, they took them wherever they found them.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sm5PC7z79-8

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-taU9d26wT4

    And apparently, it's still going on.

    http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2...iscations.html


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    I've got some Cajun aquaintences that share a lease in KY., but they usually hunt a different part of the seasons than I, ain't ever had the chance to ask how they fared through all that mess, that'll be #1 on my inquiry list next opportunity I have to meet em in KY... They live right on the Gulf, but my Brother never said anything about those fellas having any problems with confiscation .. if the attempt ever did come about, the cops better set a good trap, cause them Coonasses can sure shoot !!

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    One of the things they did to force people to leave who would not evacuate on their own was to disarm them either by taking weapons from them while out and about or going door to doorso they would no longer be able to defend themselves from looters and other criminal elements.
    Revelation 1911 - And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

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    I have hard copies (photos and SNs in the safe), plus copies on my thumb drive. If things get hairy as far as weather threats or moves or the like, backup info is sent to certain individuals outside of the immediate area.

  18. #18
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    Re:Internet storage.

    Its pretty easy to create a free email acct on some service at any public wifi point, load your thumbdrive info onto it, and upload. Not ever traceable to your home computer. I don't see any reason for your name to actually be on the documentation you keep, possession of the documentation alone should be enough. So it isn't traceable back to you in any way.

    Just remember to login to the account from a safe location every 6 months or so.

    I keep lots of things in online storage, including copies of photos and tax records. They go in pgp encrypted files, with a copy of the private key kept in another location (and disguised as another file).

    Since my passwords are never written down (or even the location of the files), and court cases have determined that requiring me to give them may constitute self-incrimination, I should be perfectly safe from anything other than torture.

  19. #19
    Campaign Veteran XD-GEM's Avatar
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    Gordie wrote:
    They did both, they took them wherever they found them.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sm5PC7z79-8

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-taU9d26wT4

    And apparently, it's still going on.

    http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2...iscations.html
    The Xavier piece you quoted from was before the City settled the NRA lawsuit out of court. they have agreed not to do this anymore. If they do, the Federal court will come down on them rather hard, I would think.

    However, as I live in New Orleans and have had a run in with them over my gun, I always keep a copy of my sales receipt in my wallet and I memorize the serial number. Nothing surprises them like being able to rattle it off to them without looking at it.

  20. #20
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    XD-GEM wrote:
    Gordie wrote:
    They did both, they took them wherever they found them.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sm5PC7z79-8

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-taU9d26wT4

    And apparently, it's still going on.

    http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2...iscations.html
    The Xavier piece you quoted from was before the City settled the NRA lawsuit out of court. they have agreed not to do this anymore. If they do, the Federal court will come down on them rather hard, I would think.

    However, as I live in New Orleans and have had a run in with them over my gun, I always keep a copy of my sales receipt in my wallet and I memorize the serial number. Nothing surprises them like being able to rattle it off to them without looking at it.
    I am not saying I distrust LE or the government. But, the Federal Government can only do something after the fact. Once you rights are violated that's it. IMO If a LEO's commanding officer tells them to go get it, they will.

    Ido have digital pictures of of my weapons I keep at home, work, and my brothers home.

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    All of my personal data, records and pictures are stored on flash drives, one that I keep in my safe, the other in a safe deposit box at the bank.

  22. #22
    Campaign Veteran XD-GEM's Avatar
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    rugergirl wrote:
    All of my personal data, records and pictures are stored on flash drives, one that I keep in my safe, the other in a safe deposit box at the bank.
    That is a good idea, but let me share a lesson from Hurricane Katrina.

    Many of the banks here in New Orleans received significant amounts of flooding during Katrina. Most of the saftey deposit boxes in town went under water. These were supposed to be safe places for important things, but no one anticipated the kind of flooding we got. A few people, like my mother in law, were lucky enough that their boxes were above the water line even though the building and the safe box room were flooded.

    Check out the area where your box is located for potential damage due to flash flood, earthquake, and fire.

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