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Thread: HR45 - Full Licensing, Registration, and Mandatory safe storage - WITH INSPECTIONS

  1. #1
    Campaign Veteran Right Wing Wacko's Avatar
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    Say goodbye to your second and fourth amendment rights!

    http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/wp-c...09/01/hr45.pdf

    I don't know what to say about this bill other than FIGHT IT!

    It is a bill that mandates licensing, registration and safe storage for handguns and semi-automatic rifles with detachable magazines. It also provides for inspection, so you surrender your fourth amendment rights by being licensed. It also requires reporting of Lost and Stolen firearms, and you must inform the federal government if you change addresses.
    Edit for spelling. Quote is from Sebastian at snowflakes in hell. He said it so much better than I.

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    I would suspect this is a "line in the sand" for many, many folks.

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    No NAU wrote:
    I would suspect this is a "line in the sand" for many, many folks.

    Is for me.

    If it even passes just the House, its time for in-person protests and rally's, at a minimum.

    If it even passes out of sub-committee, its time.

    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    It's also vital that we "cheer on" and urge support for bills such as H.R. 17 ( Citizens' Self-Defense Act of 2009 (Introduced in House)

    HR 17 IH ) :

    111th CONGRESS

    1st Session

    H. R. 17

    To protect the right to obtain firearms for security, and to use firearms in defense of self, family, or home, and to provide for the enforcement of such right.

    IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

    January 6, 2009

    Mr. BARTLETT introduced the following bill; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary

    A BILL

    To protect the right to obtain firearms for security, and to use firearms in defense of self, family, or home, and to provide for the enforcement of such right.

    Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

    SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

    This Act may be cited as the `Citizens' Self-Defense Act of 2009'.

    SEC. 2. FINDINGS.

    The Congress finds the following:

    (1) Police cannot protect, and are not legally liable for failing to protect, individual citizens, as evidenced by the following:

    (A) The courts have consistently ruled that the police do not have an obligation to protect individuals, only the public in general. For example, in Warren v. District of Columbia Metropolitan Police Department, 444 A.2d 1 (D.C. App. 1981), the court stated: `[C]ourts have without exception concluded that when a municipality or other governmental entity undertakes to furnish police services, it assumes a duty only to the public at large and not to individual members of the community.'.

    (B) Former Florida Attorney General Jim Smith told Florida legislators that police responded to only 200,000 of 700,000 calls for help to Dade County authorities.

    (C) The United States Department of Justice found that, in 1989, there were 168,881 crimes of violence for which police had not responded within 1 hour.

    (2) Citizens frequently must use firearms to defend themselves, as evidenced by the following:

    (A) Every year, more than 2,400,000 people in the United States use a gun to defend themselves against criminals--or more than 6,500 people a day. This means that, each year, firearms are used 60 times more often to protect the lives of honest citizens than to take lives.

    (B) Of the 2,400,000 self-defense cases, more than 192,000 are by women defending themselves against sexual abuse.

    (C) Of the 2,400,000 times citizens use their guns to defend themselves every year, 92 percent merely brandish their gun or fire a warning shot to scare off their attackers. Less than 8 percent of the time, does a citizen kill or wound his or her attacker.

    (3) Law-abiding citizens, seeking only to provide for their families' defense, are routinely prosecuted for brandishing or using a firearm in self-defense. For example:

    (A) In 1986, Don Bennett of Oak Park, Illinois, was shot at by 2 men who had just stolen $1,200 in cash and jewelry from his suburban Chicago service station. The police arrested Bennett for violating Oak Park's handgun ban. The police never caught the actual criminals.

    (B) Ronald Biggs, a resident of Goldsboro, North Carolina, was arrested for shooting an intruder in 1990. Four men broke into Biggs' residence one night, ransacked the home and then assaulted him with a baseball bat. When Biggs attempted to escape through the back door, the group chased him and Biggs turned and shot one of the assailants in the stomach. Biggs was arrested and charged with assault with a deadly weapon--a felony. His assailants were charged with misdemeanors.

    (C) Don Campbell of Port Huron, Michigan, was arrested, jailed, and criminally charged after he shot a criminal assailant in 1991. The thief had broken into Campbell's store and attacked him. The prosecutor plea-bargained with the assailant and planned to use him to testify against Campbell for felonious use of a firearm. Only after intense community pressure did the prosecutor finally drop the charges.

    (4) The courts have granted immunity from prosecution to police officers who use firearms in the line of duty. Similarly, law-abiding citizens who use firearms to protect themselves, their families, and their homes against violent felons should not be subject to lawsuits by the violent felons who sought to victimize them.

    SEC. 3. RIGHT TO OBTAIN FIREARMS FOR SECURITY, AND TO USE FIREARMS IN DEFENSE OF SELF, FAMILY, OR HOME; ENFORCEMENT.

    (a) Reaffirmation of Right- A person not prohibited from receiving a firearm by Section 922(g) of title 18, United States Code, shall have the right to obtain firearms for security, and to use firearms--

    (1) in defense of self or family against a reasonably perceived threat of imminent and unlawful infliction of serious bodily injury;

    (2) in defense of self or family in the course of the commission by another person of a violent felony against the person or a member of the person's family; and

    (3) in defense of the person's home in the course of the commission of a felony by another person.

    (b) Firearm Defined- As used in subsection (a), the term `firearm' means--

    (1) a shotgun (as defined in section 921(a)(5) of title 18, United States Code);

    (2) a rifle (as defined in section 921(a)(7) of title 18, United States Code); or

    (3) a handgun (as defined in section 10 of Public Law 99-408).

    (c) Enforcement of Right-

    (1) IN GENERAL- A person whose right under subsection (a) is violated in any manner may bring an action in any United States district court against the United States, any State, or any person for damages, injunctive relief, and such other relief as the court deems appropriate.

    (2) AUTHORITY TO AWARD A REASONABLE ATTORNEY'S FEE- In an action brought under paragraph (1), the court, in its discretion, may allow the prevailing plaintiff a reasonable attorney's fee as part of the costs.

    (3) STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS- An action may not be brought under paragraph (1) after the 5-year period that begins with the date the violation described in paragraph (1) is discovered.


    Use the same link above ( http://www.theorator.com/government/house.html ) to FAX this one to your Representative! Pete

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    This is what I just FAX'ed regarding H.R. 45 :

    "Absolutely OPPOSED to H.R. 45 (Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009 )

    This bill is total firearms registration on a massive (and burdensome, to the purchaser/owner) scale.

    Its’ only purpose is to further erode both the spirit and the letter of the Second Amendment by imposing artificial and illegal requirements on gun owners and gun purchasers before they can exercise a God-given right (the right to self-defense).

    I urge you not only to OPPOSE this bill vigorously, but to speak out against it – and any LIKE bills that come out in this 111th Congress.

    I also urge you to make sure that you OPPOSE any form of “assault weapon” bill that comes before you, whether it be a “stand-alone” bill, or slipped in to another “package” (read: “bailout” of some kind).

    You’re my – and the Constitutions’ – only defense against this kind of thing in the new Congress.

    I urge your vigilance and your OPPOSITION to any such bill this year.

    Thank you.

    (Signed)"

    People - you had better let them hear from you about BOTH bills! We have GOT to let them know that this sort of thing is NOT going to fly in the 111th Congress! Pete

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    Gun Banners are already using REAL (Dangerous) ID. Anybody who does not think that DANGEROUS ID does not = registration and denial of gun rights ought to read HR 45.

    WARNING: This Bill will make you sick!It shows you how serious our fight will be and it really should make any gun owner oppose Real (Dangerous) ID!!

    The DANGEROUS ID clause of HR 45:

    (2) require the applicant to provide a valid

    identification document (as defined in section

    1028(d)(2) of title 18, United States Code) of the

    applicant, containing a photograph of the applicant,

    to the licensed dealer or to the office or agency of

    the Federal Government, as applicable, at the time

    of submission of the application to that dealer, office, or agency; and..





    Link: http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/wp-c...09/01/hr45.pdf
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitableand let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come . PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Regular Member KansasMustang's Avatar
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    Dang, I had to show my Birth Certificate to get my "Hazardous Materials" endorsement on my CDL, which has all that S*&# on back magnetic strip and such. Wonder if B Hussein hadda show his to get his drivers license???
    Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. Thomas Jefferson

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    I thought we already had to show a pic ID to buy a firearm. I know I stopped showing my driver's liscense when I got my CHL but it was my understanding I had to show ID

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    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
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    The crux of the issue is that if this passed you would have to show REAL ID toget a license to obtaina firearm.Citizens instates that do not use REAL ID would not be eligible for a license and automatically loose the right to obtain firearms.

    Firearms linked to REAL ID would give the location of all gun owners to any government official that would want it.

    Here is how evil this crap is: Under HR 45 you must have a license to own a gun. That license is linked to yourREAL ID. If you move and change the address on your license, but forget to change the address on your federal firearms license the database will spit out your name as a violator. Congratulations you are now a felon, BATFE will come knocking to arrest you and confiscate all of your firearms, and you will have lost your right to ever own firearms again.


    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitableand let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come . PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

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    Campaign Veteran Right Wing Wacko's Avatar
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    Duplicate Topic to http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_to...342078#p342078

    Perhaps a mod could merge them?

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    I just wrote my senator. I'll be damned if this rolls

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    Regular Member 2a4all's Avatar
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    Sent e-mails, one in protest of HR45, another urging support of HR17 to my congressman.
    A law-abiding citizen should be able to carry his personal protection firearm anywhere that an armed criminal might go.

    Member VCDL, NRA

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    Regular Member demnogis's Avatar
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    I will be sending faxes and making calls. H.R. 45 is the first step of what can be predicted as many in this new government's will to disarm the populace.

    I know california gets a rap as a bad state. But as you can see, it's not an isolated issue
    Gun control isn't about guns -- it is about control.

  14. #14
    Regular Member Alexcabbie's Avatar
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    Holeee mackerel. So this is their strategy: FA legislation, "spray and pray" that something gets through.

    Is that Concord Bridge I see coming up down the road?

    The Clock is now by my estimate at three minutes before midnight. Dear God. Dear God. Dear God.

    I am sorry folks but I don't have the words to describe what I am feeling. I pray, intensely, that this gun-grab precursor is foiled. This is unbelievably foul and dastardly. We all need to start planning and not on public forums either If this abomination passes, "The Day" will shortly follow. This bill MUST be defeated or else bloodshed is certain.

    We are dealing with people who think that the results of the last election are a mandate for tyranny. These people are playing with fire. The American electorate has been fooled into allowing them control of two branches of the government. The stink of corruption is swirling around the incoming administrtion before the inauguration. My God, these wannabe tyrants are no doubt so arrogant that they may even think they can just disregard any Supreme Court decisions they disagree with and only enforce the ones they do agree with. And they are more than capable of a massacre which will make Kent State look like a toddler's pretend tea-party. They proved it at Waco and Ruby Ridge.

    I never thought I would be writing these words. There is more than "gun rights" at stake here. These people seek control of every aspect of personal life that they can possibly control. Just let them pass mandatory health insurance and then they will be issuing coupons for rations of meats and fats on the grounds that bad health costs "the government" "taxpayer dollars".

    The same former 60s park-and-beach trash who used to sing along with CSNY "Rules and regulations, who needs them?" have grown up into people who think that EVERYBODY needs rules and regulations, it is just a question of whose; and they are determined to impose theirs on all of us. They MUST be stopped. Let us hope that our political processes and our Constitution are sufficent to do so. But if not, then as Our Founders pledged, so I pledge and so must we all; "our lives, our Fortunes, and our Sacred Honor" to defeat this tyranny. And the loss of the first two will only increase the value of the last.

    SIC SEMPER TYRANNIS









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    He also introduced the same bill last session: HR 2666 (110th) I pray it goes no further this time than it did last time.
    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

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    wrightme wrote:
    He also introduced the same bill last session: HR 2666 (110th) I pray it goes no further this time than it did last time.
    In that case, it may be time to send a considerable monetary donation to whoever runs against him in both the next Primary and General Election.

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    Regular Member KansasMustang's Avatar
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    The line is drawn, hope Y'all stand up together, and be counted. Or surely we will hang seperately.
    Keep your powder dry ! And I hereby pledge as did my forefathers My life, My pittance (joking) my fortune and my Honor!!
    Freeeeeeeeeedooooommmmmmm
    Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. Thomas Jefferson

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    KansasMustang wrote:
    The line is drawn, hope Y'all stand up together, and be counted. Or surely we will hang seperately.
    Keep your powder dry ! And I hereby pledge as did my forefathers My life, My pittance (joking) my fortune and my Honor!!
    Freeeeeeeeeedooooommmmmmm
    I'm with ya KM to the bitter end! E-mails sent!

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    KansasMustang wrote:
    The line is drawn, hope Y'all stand up together, and be counted. Or surely we will hang seperately.
    Keep your powder dry ! And I hereby pledge as did my forefathers My life, My pittance (joking) my fortune and my Honor!!
    Freeeeeeeeeedooooommmmmmm
    I make the same pledge.

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    My husband just found a new bill that is being discretely pushed through the House of Representatives. It is called Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009 (HR.-45). It has not shown up on any major news sites or T.V. stations but is requiring that any new/already ownedfirearms that use a detachable magazine be federally registered. This will allow access for the feds to check your mental health records. It will be on a "shall issue" status (meaning they can choose who can carry and who cannot). If passed anyone with a qualifying gun will have to have it registered within one year. This bill is currently on the floor as we speak. It is being shoved through very quietly and I suggest that everyone do whatever possible to bring attention to it. Here is a link that reads the bill in its entirety.

    http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-...:h45ih.txt.pdf



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    Regular Member shad0wfax's Avatar
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    Thans for posting this, but two threads exist about this already. Perhaps the mods should merge the three (now) of them?

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    wow...

  23. #23
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    When they come kicking down your door close your eyes and remember the words of Col. Jeff Cooper, "Let us reflect upon the fact that a man who covers his face shows reason to be ashamed of what he is doing. A man who takes it upon himself to shed blood while concealing his identity is a revolting perversion of the warrior ethic. It has long been my conviction that a masked man with a gun is a target. I see no reason to change that view."

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    Icarus wrote:
    wow...
    WOW! oh I know, I say it louder! Right now I could chew a 10 penny nail and spit out a barbed wire fence!

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    Alexcabbie wrote:
    We all need to start planning and not on public forums either If this abomination passes, "The Day" will shortly follow. This bill MUST be defeated or else bloodshed is certain.

    I never thought I would be writing these words. There is more than "gun rights" at stake here. These people seek control of every aspect of personal life that they can possibly control.They MUST be stopped. Let us hope that our political processes and our Constitution are sufficent to do so. But if not, then as Our Founders pledged, so I pledge and so must we all; "our lives, our Fortunes, and our Sacred Honor" to defeat this tyranny. And the loss of the first two will only increase the value of the last.

    SIC SEMPER TYRANNIS
    Could not have been more eloquently said. All I can say is that if the time comes credit card maximums canbe useful, especially if it may never come around to payingthem off.






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