OC in your car Manassas, VA and you will get arrested

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Hokie wrote:

SNIP Just because you are arrested does not make it illegal. LEOs can make mistakes...

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Hence the 6th Amendment.

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Citizen wrote:

Tomahawk wrote:

Oh, I see. As far as I'm concerned, unless it's a staple gun or a caulk gun it's a weapon. Sounds very NRA-ish, though.

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I wonder if they say, "Don't call it a weapon." Or if they recommend calling it something else.

I've met plenty of people who confuse the latter with the former, especially in relaying the information. Yet, there is a world of difference. The latter is more a suggestion to take advantage of connotationswords have.

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About 15 years ago, my son, while he was still in elementary school, joined the Quantico Shooting Club and participated in thier junior matches. One of the instructors/coaches set up a tour for the youngsters of the FBI Academy (this is before everything was fenced off). I was accompanying the youngsters and being active duty at the time, I referred to firearms as "weapons". I was promptly admonished by the NRA certified instructor. "WE" don't call them weapons because of the negative connotation of the word. At the time I accepted it because the NRA was all knowing and all seeing and all understanding. The NRA has its own agenda.

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kaiheitai17 wrote:

SNIP I was promptly admonished by the NRA certified instructor. "WE" don't call them weapons because of the negative connotation of the word. At the time I accepted it because the NRA was all knowing and all seeing and all understanding. The NRA has its own agenda.

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Sounds like some of themlost track of the difference between theirPR tacticand fact. As in, PR is for the target audience.The vocabulary doesn't need to be changed for discussion among members of the gun world.

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hello, i am sam hatfield. owner of the store mentioned in this thread. i came across this online and felt the need to defend myself. this thread is very much like the "telephone" game i remember from childhood. misinterprtation and assumption. i made no mention of legality at all. nor did i "choose a side" during the conversation. my only comment after seeing the card was that "Open carry in your car very well could getyou arrested."i repeated this exact thing several times. not my fault you didnt understand what i was saying. what is legal and what is likely to happen are sadly not oftenone in the same. you asked several questions that were leading. ioffered you no answer to these questions, just repeated what i had already stated.dont fill in the blanks for me. i speak on this issue from personal experience. MY personal experience. not everyone wants to spend hours getting processed (not to mention time in court if needed- and it was). at that time, i was not aware that being right could be so costly.i was giving you friendly advice and recived an onlineslandering for my troubles. thanks.

i have been quotedCORRECTLY in the washington post and infantry magazine if anyone cares to look. you can find both online.

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Thanks for coming on to defend yourself, it is beneficial to get both sides of the argument.

As we all benefit from each others experience here, what was your circumstance that led to the conclusion that you could get arrested for OCing in a car?

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i would rather not go into any more detail than this.it took place locally many years ago. i was arrested. the arresting officer did not have a good grasp on firearm law. i went to court and i won. cost me a bunch of money, some time at the police station, and the surrendering of my weapon for approx 6 months. it was a pain in the....to say the least.

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Times have changed. Manassas PD is now well aware of the legality of OC.

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OK I could see that happening pre-2004. However, I think while an arrest/ gun confiscation for legal OC is not impossible, we have a much better climate for OC now.
The first Starbucks incident in 2004 comes to mind as to how it would go down.

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hatfield wrote: snip

hello, i am sam hatfield.
my only comment after seeing the card was that

1.
"Open carry in your car very well could getyou arrested."
i speak on this issue from personal experience. MY personal experience.

2.
i was giving you friendly advice and recived an onlineslandering for my troubles. thanks.

Click to expand...

Thanks for coming onto this board.

Ever heard the statement "the Police can arrest anyone and the DA could indite a ham sandwich."

I don't see that anyone slandered you, they statedtheir opinion.

OC is legal in VA telling people otherwise is incorrect.
http://www.vsp.state.va.us/Firearms_Transporting.shtm


Please tryto attend a VCDL meeting in your area or sign up for the alerts.

http://www.vcdl.org/static/meetings.html

[font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]01/22/09 - Mason District Gov't Ctr - Lg Conf Room
7:30-9:30 [/font]

[font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]Meeting Schedule (Unless Otherwise Noted Above):
[/font][font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"][/font]

• [font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]
  [*]7:30 - 8:00 pm -- Informal Gathering
  [*]8:00 - 9:30 pm -- Meeting
  [*]9:30 - ?? pm -- Informal Gathering at a Local Restaurant [/font]

[font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"][font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]Mason District Governmental Center
6507 Columbia Pike
Annandale, VA 22003
[/font][/font]

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Well welcome hatfield, although you were drawn in to defend yourself regarding the conversation of the thread, we hope you'll stick around and contribute with the rest of us. Just about all of us have some history we can draw from to share our experiences just the same as you do.

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ProShooter wrote:

Doug Huffman wrote:

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Gentlemen, can we not do this.

Thanks.

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OT but I wanted to post that I was driving thru Manassas (open carrying of course) and saw what I believed to be Mr. Hatfield's business.

Think I might stop in and have him look at my Glocks.

I also have a lil voice in me telling me to by a 'dress gun' for more social events.. 1911 maybe with customized grips and some etching. Just thinking about that makes me gushy in my stomach. :celebrate

Nice to have a local establishment that is pro-OC to do business with.

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hatfield wrote:

i would rather not go into any more detail than this.it took place locally many years ago. i was arrested. the arresting officer did not have a good grasp on firearm law. i went to court and i won. cost me a bunch of money, some time at the police station, and the surrendering of my weapon for approx 6 months. it was a pain in the....to say the least.

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Just curious..... why did you not sue for false arrest and malicious prosecution?

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I like all of Hatfields work that I've seen up close and have been sending people his way for stuff.

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Citizen wrote:

I wonder if they say, "Don't call it a weapon." Or if they recommend calling it something else.

Click to expand...

They do exactly that. See: http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum54/17607-3.html

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hatfield wrote:

hello, i am sam hatfield. owner of the store mentioned in this thread. i came across this online and felt the need to defend myself. this thread is very much like the "telephone" game i remember from childhood. misinterprtation and assumption. i made no mention of legality at all. nor did i "choose a side" during the conversation. my only comment after seeing the card was that "Open carry in your car very well could getyou arrested."i repeated this exact thing several times. not my fault you didnt understand what i was saying. what is legal and what is likely to happen are sadly not oftenone in the same. you asked several questions that were leading. ioffered you no answer to these questions, just repeated what i had already stated.dont fill in the blanks for me. i speak on this issue from personal experience. MY personal experience. not everyone wants to spend hours getting processed (not to mention time in court if needed- and it was). at that time, i was not aware that being right could be so costly.i was giving you friendly advice and recived an onlineslandering for my troubles. thanks.

i have been quotedCORRECTLY in the washington post and infantry magazine if anyone cares to look. you can find both online.

Click to expand...

Hi Sam -

First.. my original post was in no way an attack or a call for you to have to DEFEND yourself. I even called you back to reconfirm that my "intent" to bringing this to light was that if there are cops our there that are "still" arresting people "just" for OCing then they need to be stopped and brought to justice. As an advocate of my 2A rights and a firearm instructor and former Marine, etc. etc. etc. I am concerend with my freedoms as are you. We are on the same side. When you pointed to that line on the card you said.. "If you do THAT (referring to OC) you will be arrested sooner or later". I disagreed.. plain and simple. You even said to ask Dan Howe from Virginia Legal Defense and I have already e-mailed Dan.

Finally.. I appreciate your opinion and experience.. even if they are different than mine. I appreciate your service in the Army and commitment to our country. I have no doubt that your are a skilled 1911 expert (which is why I came to you and trusted you). I am further thrilled that you have joind us here on OCDO to offer even MORE expert advise than we already have here. I too think you should joing VCDL and would even offer to pay your first year's membership. I did send you an invite the other day to an OC Dinner in Sterling and would enjoy your company. The invite at http://www.tinyurl.com/teds020309 .

I would look forward to it.

P.S. Is my Delta Elite slide almost done? :celebrate

Thanks! Ed

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Got your e-vite, checking our schedule to see if we can attend. Might be taking you up on that membership.

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hatfield wrote:

Got your e-vite, checking our schedule to see if we can attend. Might be taking you up on that membership.

Click to expand...

Great!

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Can we get a group hug.
(proshooter & Doug included)

Now, remember a VCDL membership entitles you to join thefight (with other like minded people)for gun rights in VA, it is an all volunteer group.

Please, know Ed's $25 (money well spent)will be going to a great organization that all VA gun owners have and will benefit from.

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Hi Sam! Welcome to OCDO! I'm glad you joined and jumped into our discussion! I and many others here look forward to you sharing your experience and perspectives as someone in the business full-time.

As Agent19 stated there is a VCDL meeting tonight if you are interested.

I first met some of the members at a OC dinner. We are meeting at Ted's Montana Grille in Cascades on Tuesday February 3rd at 7:00 PM if that suits your schedule. You can sign up here:

http://tinyurl.com/teds020309

I look forward to meeting you in person.



ETA: Wow...there were a lot of posts while I was writing mine!!