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Thread: New Bills on the Senate Floor: Senate Bill 358 and House Bill 412

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    Honorable Senators of the State of Hawaii,



    I am writing to you today to voice my opinion on the subject bills.



    First of all, a little about myself. I am mentally stable and have never been accused or convicted of felony crimes. I served 20 years and 6 months on active duty in the United States Navy, serving on 5 different fast attack submarines - 4 of them home ported in Pearl Harbor. I am a US citizen, born and raised in the State of Montana but am now a legal resident of the State of Hawaii. I registered to vote (and voted for several of the people this email is addressed to in the past election) and actively exercise that right. I am a lifetime member of the National Rifle Association and havedecided to join the Hawaii Rifle Association as well.



    I am strongly supportive of Senate Bill 358. The 2nd Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America explicitly guarantees the right to keep and bear arms. The unconstitutional confiscation of firearms from law-abiding citizens in the wake of Hurricane Katrina brought the issue to national recognition that our rights have eroded. The firearms were confiscated as a "protective security measure" and the seizure of weapons and firearms during that declared state of emergency did not provide security for law abiding citizens - it left them unarmed to defend themselves if necessary, reducing public security.



    The 2nd amendment already takes the necessity for security into account. A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. If this is still the "Home of the Free" and we still believe in the Bill of Rights as guaranteed in the Constitution this bill should pass unanimously.



    I will save my discussion on the fact that I cannot carry a firearm whether concealed or in the open although that is also a part of the right guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment (keep and bear arms) for another time as that is not up for House or Senate action at this time.



    Now on to House Bill 412:



    I strongly oppose this bill. The 2nd amendment (once again) wants the civilian population to be a well regulated militia to maintain the security of our free state. If we are to be an effective militia, we ought to have the ability to arm ourselves to the same extent any entity, foreign or domestic, may be armed when threatening our free state.



    Yes, the .50BMG is a very powerful round with a very long range. A fatal shot with that .50 caliber round will not make a person any more dead than a fatal shot with the smallest commercially produced round - the .22 Short.



    I realize there will be a lot of opposition to this bill but am hoping that the pros and cons are fairly represented and considered. I don't need a .50BMG for home security. I will not likely ever buy a .50BMG even if they were legal and I could walk around town with one strapped on my back. But just because there isn't a need for something doesn't mean it should be illegal. If that was the case, you wouldn't see any BMW, Mercedes Benz, Lexus or other luxury/exotic cars in Honolulu - we would all ride bicycles or drive economy cars becauseall we NEED is basic transportation.



    The basis for the assault weapons ban under the Clinton administration relied heavily on the rhetoric thatif it isn't a sporting weapon it must only be for killing people. Many sporting weapons themselveds are actually designed to kill (animals)and many weapons designed for shooting competitions are useless as sporting weapons. There is also misrepresentation about semi-automatic guns as being machine guns with a rate of fire of 600 rounds per minute. Even with a fully automatic M-16 machine gun as used in the Vietnam War you would be very challenged to shoot 600 rounds in a minute.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    MachOne.45ACP wrote:
    Honorable Senators of the State of Hawaii,



    I am writing to you today to voice my opinion on the subject bills.



    First of all, a little about myself. I am mentally stable and have never been accused or convicted of felony crimes. I served 20 years and 6 months on active duty in the United States Navy, serving on 5 different fast attack submarines - 4 of them home ported in Pearl Harbor. I am a US citizen, born and raised in the State of Montana but am now a legal resident of the State of Hawaii. I registered to vote (and voted for several of the people this email is addressed to in the past election) and actively exercise that right. I am a lifetime member of the National Rifle Association and havedecided to join the Hawaii Rifle Association as well.



    I am strongly supportive of Senate Bill 358. The 2nd Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America explicitly guarantees the right to keep and bear arms. The unconstitutional confiscation of firearms from law-abiding citizens in the wake of Hurricane Katrina brought the issue to national recognition that our rights have eroded. The firearms were confiscated as a "protective security measure" and the seizure of weapons and firearms during that declared state of emergency did not provide security for law abiding citizens - it left them unarmed to defend themselves if necessary, reducing public security.



    The 2nd amendment already takes the necessity for security into account. A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. If this is still the "Home of the Free" and we still believe in the Bill of Rights as guaranteed in the Constitution this bill should pass unanimously.



    I will save my discussion on the fact that I cannot carry a firearm whether concealed or in the open although that is also a part of the right guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment (keep and bear arms) for another time as that is not up for House or Senate action at this time.



    Now on to House Bill 412:



    I strongly oppose this bill. The 2nd amendment (once again) wants the civilian population to be a well regulated militia to maintain the security of our free state. If we are to be an effective militia, we ought to have the ability to arm ourselves to the same extent any entity, foreign or domestic, may be armed when threatening our free state.



    Yes, the .50BMG is a very powerful round with a very long range. A fatal shot with that .50 caliber round will not make a person any more dead than a fatal shot with the smallest commercially produced round - the .22 Short.



    I realize there will be a lot of opposition to this bill but am hoping that the pros and cons are fairly represented and considered. I don't need a .50BMG for home security. I will not likely ever buy a .50BMG even if they were legal and I could walk around town with one strapped on my back. But just because there isn't a need for something doesn't mean it should be illegal. If that was the case, you wouldn't see any BMW, Mercedes Benz, Lexus or other luxury/exotic cars in Honolulu - we would all ride bicycles or drive economy cars becauseall we NEED is basic transportation.



    The basis for the assault weapons ban under the Clinton administration relied heavily on the rhetoric thatif it isn't a sporting weapon it must only be for killing people. Many sporting weapons themselveds are actually designed to kill (animals)and many weapons designed for shooting competitions are useless as sporting weapons. There is also misrepresentation about semi-automatic guns as being machine guns with a rate of fire of 600 rounds per minute. Even with a fully automatic M-16 machine gun as used in the Vietnam War you would be very challenged to shoot 600 rounds in a minute.
    Use the state constitution too, Article 1 Section 17.

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    Yeah, I had that in there but edited it out. I was on a tangent that I didn't want to continue for this email...

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    I feel sorry for folks in Hawaii I lived there several years and visit a couple times a yr. and plan on moving back someday. Hawaii is the only state I can think that is worse than California hopefully Heller decision will have an impact on hawaii too.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    I feel sorry for folks in Hawaii I lived there several years and visit a couple times a yr. and plan on moving back someday. Hawaii is the only state I can think that is worse than California hopefully Heller decision will have an impact on hawaii too.
    I'm doing all I can to change things here. NRA, HRA (Hawaii Rifle Association - which in honesty I haven't actually joined yet) and letters to politicians are just a few of the things I'm involved in. I'm also working on getting certified as a gunsmith and am considering being licensed as a FFL dealer (in support of the gunsmith business).

    I long for the day when, evenhere in Hawaii, I can enjoy the right guaranteed me by the 2nd amendment - not just to keep arms, but also to BEAR arms!

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    MachOne.45ACP wrote:
    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    I feel sorry for folks in Hawaii I lived there several years and visit a couple times a yr. and plan on moving back someday. Hawaii is the only state I can think that is worse than California hopefully Heller decision will have an impact on hawaii too.
    I'm doing all I can to change things here. NRA, HRA (Hawaii Rifle Association - which in honesty I haven't actually joined yet) and letters to politicians are just a few of the things I'm involved in. I'm also working on getting certified as a gunsmith and am considering being licensed as a FFL dealer (in support of the gunsmith business).

    I long for the day when, evenhere in Hawaii, I can enjoy the right guaranteed me by the 2nd amendment - not just to keep arms, but also to BEAR arms!
    When I am there I go to the range with my brother-in-law, Koko head range is actually the best gun range I have ever been to. Next time I come I am going to bring my pistols, and share with my braddah. I have yet to shoot pistols there since the only folks I know in Hawaii with pistols are Law enforcement and armored truck drivers. I should let him know about this site, he would be interested I think.

    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    When I am there I go to the range with my brother-in-law, Koko head range is actually the best gun range I have ever been to. Next time I come I am going to bring my pistols, and share with my braddah. I have yet to shoot pistols there since the only folks I know in Hawaii with pistols are Law enforcement and armored truck drivers. I should let him know about this site, he would be interested I think.
    When I was in Washington State (Bremerton) I joined the Poulsbo Sportsman's Club and used their gun range. It was a pretty decent setup. Check it out if you haven't been there...

    I went to Koko Head once probably 15 years ago to shoot my 1911 Colt Combat Elite with a Pachmayer Dominator conversion chambered to .308 Winchester. Put 20 rounds through it at the silhouette range. Decided to send it off for MagnaPort - it hurt too damn much, lol.

    I recently got back into guns and have a Rock River Arms CAR-15, a Benelli M1 Super 90 12Ga and a Ruger 10/22 I've had foralmost 30 years. Went down to Koko Head this past weekend, got the handout to build the target holders and plan on going down this weekend or the next, depending on when I get time to build targets.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    My brother-in-law lives in Kapolei not too far from you, I definately have to let him know about this site I think he is always looking for someone to shoot with. When he isn't too busy, he's a busy man. Next time I am there maybe we can go together, not sure when that will be though unless you know anybody that needs work done on their house. I am a contractor by trade specializing in framing and carpentry work.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  9. #9
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Just curious if there was a reply back from the state Senate or did they choose to ignore you?
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    Just curious if there was a reply back from the state Senate or did they choose to ignore you?
    So far - they have chosen to ignore me. Similar to the last time I wrote them concerning other gun related laws...

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Too bad our governments have come to ignoring the people they serve. Feels like there is no accountability anymore.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    Too bad our governments have come to ignoring the people they serve. Feels like there is no accountability anymore.
    Absolutely! Seems they forget that elected and appointed officials arePUBLIC SERVANTS, not that the people are the servantsof thegovernment.

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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    I feel sorry for folks in Hawaii I lived there several years and visit a couple times a yr. and plan on moving back someday. Hawaii is the only state I can think that is worse than California hopefully Heller decision will have an impact on hawaii too.
    Hawaii is part of the Ninth Circuit, so a favorable Nordyke ruling applies in Hawaii immediately, and will allow people there to start pursing gun rights cases in Federal courts. I realize that the HI state const. has a RKBA clause in it but I wouldn't count on Hawaiian state courts to take that seriously. Federal courts, however, have none of Hawaii's anti-gun cultural baggage.

    A Nordyke decision could be coming out any day now.

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    We can only hope , I have gotten so used to carrying my gun with me it would be a shame not to do so in what I consider my second home state.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    As you surely know, the only concealed carry permit in HI is the one limited to the HPD armorer.
    The dirty little secret, as I learned from my life-long espionage duty, much of it on Maui, that you should ask all your Representatives, Senators & Judges about, is this:
    They are simply quietly issued "Deputy Sheriff Badges" with no power to arrest - But power to carry concealed.
    Only the racially and PC - Correct. Not the average people, not the average Kanaka.
    Not the guy who's terrorized on his own block by the drugs dealers that are protected by these elite, not the guy who's afraid to voice his own political dissent.
    Not the patriotic, not the religious, not the property owner, not the head of the family, not some guy or girl who has a sudden need to thusly be armed.
    No: I used to be very vocal on this when I lived on Maui, and anti-drug, so I was beaten three times. Twice by the Hawaiian "Mafia," and once - By the MPD.
    Sen. Inouye even wrote me to say it would be investigated, and I never heard a thing about it.
    The irony? Well, I had something on me at the time that I won't repeat - And feared more what it would mean if I used it in self-defense of my body and my life - Than having my head bashed in.
    Which it was.
    Now you know why you have so much crime - It's "Controlled."
    You can google my name to get to my website if you wish to know more.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    I know what you mean its is funny how Hawaii is always labeled as a safe place but is one of the most violent places I have lived. I still love it there, but we gotta get guns back into the hands of people. The gangbangers and drug dealers all carry I was in Kalihi last year and witnessed this little filipino banger pull out a gun on some Somoan folks, of course it was all gone by the time the cops showed up and luckily no one was hurt, but there were no arrests either, could have been a very different situation.


    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Well, I'll never forget my first "Kill Haole Day" in High School, nor in that Gov. Waihee later sanctioned the activity as a "Cultural Event."
    It's as funny as this "Birther" thing for in that I remember when the legislation for the COLB was being debated as a good idea for the Filipino plantation immgrants. So that they could apply for & get social services, health care, etc., they otherwise wouldn't be able to. There was some resistance to that.
    But once someone pointed out that such legislation could potentially let some Asian agent into becoming President of the US, they RUSHED to pass it.
    So now you have The Great O, the greatest firearms salesman of all time, according to the NRA.
    Rush Limbaugh finally has reached that intellectual point in his mine, yesterday: He said just couldn't grasp the possibility, but was considering it, now.
    That The Great 0 was out to sell the country out to foreign domination.
    Took him a while, didn't it?


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    Sudden Valley Hey dude I used to live in Kahlihi right on the main st I cannot for the life of me remember what the name of that street is called. There is a run down apt complex about a block after the main bus stop accross from the elementary school, I used to live in that slum piece of **** about 5 years ago, damn its been a longtime.
    Sounds like everyday in Kahlihi to me I remember smoking in my car and writting down notes on all the drug deals I would see that place is ******.
    I really hope things change on Oahu for sure and for the islands as a whole.

    Does anyone know if the Big Island has a pretty large gun ownership I would just expect a place like Puna or another town down there to be pretty lax on gun stuff.

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    rickahyatt wrote:
    Well, I'll never forget my first "Kill Haole Day" in High School, nor in that Gov. Waihee later sanctioned the activity as a "Cultural Event."
    According to some friends of mine who spent about 10 years in Hawaii, ending in the early '70s, every day was "Kill Haole Day" in public schools!

  20. #20
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    Bustelo5% wrote:
    Sudden Valley Hey dude I used to live in Kahlihi right on the main st I cannot for the life of me remember what the name of that street is called. There is a run down apt complex about a block after the main bus stop accross from the elementary school, I used to live in that slum piece of @#$% about 5 years ago, damn its been a longtime.
    Sounds like everyday in Kahlihi to me I remember smoking in my car and writting down notes on all the drug deals I would see that place is @#$%ed.
    I really hope things change on Oahu for sure and for the islands as a whole.

    Does anyone know if the Big Island has a pretty large gun ownership I would just expect a place like Puna or another town down there to be pretty lax on gun stuff.
    Big Island has a larger gun ownership, more hunting and what not, more of a country feel to a lot of the parts of the island, the same state rules apply though, they just don't issue carry permits.

    Even Oahu has some hunting areas, not too far from town too, by Pearl City.

    Believe or not I spend a lot of time in KPT when I am on Oahu, now talk about ghetto.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Kpt projects? holy crap I havent heard of that place in years I had alot of friends from there and also mayor rights also.
    Pearl City are you sure I mean thats pretty much all high rises and that move theater block right? I mean I can be wrong its been about 4 years since I have been back home.
    Although the Walabee hunting in the ft shafter/kahlihi area would be alot of fun lol.

    Its so weird to think about Hawaii being that Anti gun even though I lived there for half my life I didnt even notice it that young.
    This make me wanna set up shop on one of the atolls that are not part of America and just kick it.

  22. #22
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    well past Pearl City the Palisades area.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Can anyone tell me when these bills Senate Bill 358 and House Bill 412 will be voted on ? thanks

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    No update as of yet. We here are pretty much waiting to see what the outcome of the MacDonald vs. Chicago. If that goes the way we would like it to, then we have some major ammo to change the laws here.
    "My dedication to my country's flag rests on my ardent belief in this noblest of causes, equality for all. If my future rests under this earth rather than upon it, I fear not."

    -Leopold Karpeles, US Civil War Medal of Honor Recipient

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