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Thread: Odd news article out of western Tidewater

  1. #1
    Regular Member paramedic70002's Avatar
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    Unlawful gun owners can’t ‘conceal’ truth By Charlie Passut | Tidewater News
    Published Wednesday, February 18, 2009
    Photo by Charlie Passut
    Richard Harris, owner of Firearms Sales Co. LLC, stands in the doorway of his Ivor gun shop while talking to a customer on his cell phone.
    IVOR—When two men entered Richard Harris’ gun shop last year, they were both there for the same reason: to purchase an additional firearm.
    They both presented a valid Virginia driver’s license as their primary identification. And they both provided a valid concealed handgun permit from Virginia as their second form of ID.
    And they were both rejected after a background check by the State Police.
    And that worries Harris — particularly the part about the men having concealed handgun permits.
    “This really got our attention because it was within a short time frame,” said Harris, who owns Firearms Sales Co. LLC in Ivor.
    Harris said the two men came in separately and were not together.
    “These two individuals both had firearms already,” Harris said. “They wanted something different. They picked out what they wanted.”
    The men then filled out two forms — one state and one federal — for the weapons. Harris, who is required to call the State Police afterward, calls and relays the information from those forms so that the authorities can perform a background check, something the police have three business days to complete.
    “We got a delay,” Harris said. “A few minutes later they called back and said, ‘This purchase has been denied. Do not release the firearm.’ Well, I told them that this person has a concealed carry permit issued by the Commonwealth of Virginia. They said, ‘Sorry, you cannot release the gun. His purchase has been denied.’”
    Harris said after a denial, he gives the person who was rejected the phone number to Virginia State Police Headquarters in Richmond.
    “Due to privacy reasons, they won’t tell me why anyone’s denied,” Harris said. “But that individual can inquire.”
    “If an individual cannot purchase a firearm, why would the state of Virginia issue a concealed carry permit?” Harris asked.
    Concealed handguns have been legal in Virginia for many years, but the process was changed about 10 years ago, Harris said. Before the change, a judge would decide if an individual could get the permit.
    “It was just the judge’s discretion,” Harris said. “If the judge did not like you, or didn’t like guns, no one in his jurisdiction got a permit.”
    Harris said people complained that the system was discriminatory and arbitrary. In response, the General Assembly changed the law and Virginia became a “shall issue” state, opening the door for any citizen to fill out an application for a concealed handgun permit.
    AC_FL_RunContent( 'codebase', ',0,28,0', 'width', '300', 'height', '250', 'src', '/tidewater/southampton/smhfinal', 'quality', 'high', 'pluginspage', '', 'align', 'middle', 'play', 'true', 'loop', 'true', 'scale', 'showall', 'wmode', 'window', 'devicefont', 'false', 'id', 'smhfinal', 'bgcolor', '#ffffff', 'name', 'smhfinal', 'menu', 'true', 'allowFullScreen', 'false', 'allowScriptAccess','crossDomain', 'movie', '/tidewater/southampton/smhfinal', 'salign', '' ); [line] window.google_render_ad(); Comments Posted by steinertc (anonymous) on February 18, 2009 at 2:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)
    There should be no permits for concealed weapons at all. The only ones allowed to carry concealed weapons is undercover officers. Seems to me, if your up to no good, you would be concealing. But after all one bad apple ruins it for all. Just issue permits to own a weapon. Why conceal it?????
    Posted by mrpowr2u (anonymous) on February 18, 2009 at 3:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)
    As a concealed handgun permit owner, I wonder at your reasoning for the statement you made. ("There should be no permits for concealed weapons at all. The only ones allowed to carry concealed weapons is undercover officers. Seems to me, if your up to no good, you would be concealing. But after all one bad apple ruins it for all. Just issue permits to own a weapon. Why conceal it?????")
    I grew up having used rifles, shotguns and other weapons to hunt and target shoot for recreation. I learned from an early age to respect a weapon and how to use it properly. I learned to respect others and their property.
    I served in the military and used handguns, rifles and shotguns as part of my service. I have used handguns, rifles and shotguns for more than 40 years. I have never caused another person to be injured as a result. I hope I never need to. But if my family or I am under imminent threat, I will use any method available to protect them and myself.
    Evil does not care what method it uses to kill. Evil people will strangle, shoot, stab, run over, bomb or even use airplanes to perpetrate their acts. There is no inanimate object that causes people to die indiscriminately. Whether it is bare hands, a gun, knife, bomb etc. It must be used with an intent to kill OR an act of mischief OR an act of negligence by allowing a child to have access to a weapon who does not know otherwise. The object itself is benign until one of those acts takes place.
    Remember that fertilizer and diesel fuel were the cause of the largest number of deaths in US history by a domestic terrorist in Oklahoma. Men, women and children were killed, maimed and left with scars for the rest of their lives, and not a single gun was involved.
    Do not confuse the object with the intent or the action.
    Good people, law-abiding citizens, who have concealed weapons are not the ones to worry about. Those who disregard the law, who have no respect for others, are the ones everyone needs to worry about and protect themselves against.
    Posted by paramedic70002 (anonymous) on February 19, 2009 at 10:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)
    I agree that there should not be permits for concealed weapons. Why should I need to give the courts $50 in order to place a piece of fabric over my weapon? As far as I am concerned, either I can legally possess guns, or not. Why have shades of gray? Vermont and Alaska do not require permits, and they have not suffered because they recognize what a free society is all about.
    And as for why people should conceal; because there are too many Chicken Littles in this world that would have a hissy fit every time they saw someone carrying a weapon. Which is why some people insist on "open carrying," to desensitize the citizens to what is a natural right, the right to self defense.
    Even liberal Democrat Governor Kaine approves of open carry, since he vetoed the bill allowing concealed carry in restaurants that serve alcohol last year.
    That's right, per VA law, you can't conceal your weapon in Applebees or Joe's, unless you are the business owner or agent, a police officer, or a Commonwealth's Attorney.

    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

    Guns Save Lives. Paramedics Save Lives. But...
    Paramedics With Guns Scare People!

  2. #2
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    If it were something serious, the cops would have been down there to pick them up in a paddy wagon.

    More than likely a name conflict?

  3. #3
    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    hsmith wrote:
    More than likely a name conflict?
    That's not cause for declining a purchase.

    Multiple matching names will only put a NICS into ""delay".

    Every purchase and transfer I've ever made, sans the very first, has been delayed. Having a common name is the most frequent culprit, from what I've been told. Meh, maybe I'm wrong. Either way, it is an inconvenience and communication between the denied purchaser and SP or jurisdiction of residence should clear up any questions.

    The comment about only undercover LEOs being allowed to carry concealed makes me laugh. According to the Constitution, NOBODY can legislate your carry options... but they do it anyway.

    And then, those of us who CHOOSE to follow their illegal and arbitrary laws are demonized when a criminal, who is not honor-bound to any law to begin with, commits a crime.

    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
    And the newest slavery is to keep the people poor, and stupid
    Novos ordo seclorum ~ Mustaine

    Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

  4. #4
    Regular Member riverrat10k's Avatar
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    My guess is restricted under statute for offense after the license was issued. How long until a CHP is revoked for, say, domestic violence charges? How is vendor to know if a validly issued CHP has been revoked?

    Either that or counterfeit CHP's. I would really like to know more about this but guess we won't.
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