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Thread: CCW shall issue bill now in play!

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    I spoke with AssemblymanKnight's office in Sacramento this morning. He has introduced a bill (AB357) that would make California a SHALL issue state for CCWs. While it's always a good idea to contact YOUR assemblyman to show support, Mr Knight's assistant urged me to send or fax a letter to his office. The idea being that each letter received will help in justifying support. We've got 31 days (after 2/19) until the bill goes to the safety committee, probably followed by the rules committee. Either way, call the representative of your district and please send or fax a letter in support of AB357 to Mr Knight's office:

    Steve Knight
    State Capitol
    Sacramento, CA 95814
    (916) 319-2036, (916) 319-2136 fax

    Heck, even if you don't live in California, send a letter! What could it hurt?


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    Regular Member demnogis's Avatar
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    Hell yes! Great freakin news!

    I advocate OC, but I would also like the option of conceal carry in certain occasions... Should I be riding past a school or having to send some packages from the local Post Office...

    Here's an interactive map to help you contact your assembly person:
    http://www.legislature.ca.gov/legisl...districts.html

    Can you please provide a link to the AB 357 legislature? I can't seem to find it. Only one I see is from 2007 and it was a shot-down teaching expenditure bill.
    Gun control isn't about guns -- it is about control.

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    ASSEMBLY BILL No. 357 Introduced by Assembly Member Knight
    February 19, 2009
    An act to amend Section 12050 of the Penal Code, relating to firearms.
    legislative counsel’s digest
    AB 357, as introduced, Knight. Firearms: license to carry concealed firearm.
    Existing law authorizes the sheriff of a county, upon proof that the person applying is of good moral character, that good cause exists, and that the person applying satisfies any one of certain conditions, as specified, to issue a license for the person to carry a concealed handgun, as specified. This bill would delete the good cause requirement, and require the sheriff to issue the license if the other criteria described above are met. By imposing additional duties on local law enforcement agencies, this bill would impose a state-mandated local program. The California Constitution requires the state to reimburse local agencies and school districts for certain costs mandated by the state. Statutory provisions establish procedures for making that reimbursement. This bill would provide that, if the Commission on State Mandates determines that the bill contains costs mandated by the state,
    reimbursement for those costs shall be made pursuant to these statutory provisions.

    The people of the State of California do enact as follows:
    SECTION 1. Section 12050 of the Penal Code is amended to read:
    12050. (a) (1) (A) The sheriff of a county, upon proof that the person applying is of good moral character, that good cause exists for the issuance, and that the person applying satisfies any one of the conditions specified in subparagraph (D) and has completed a course of training as described in subparagraph (E), may shall issue to that person a license to carry a pistol, revolver,or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person in either one of the following formats:
    (i) A license to carry concealed a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.
    (ii) Where the population of the county is less than 200,000 persons according to the most recent federal decennial census, a license to carry loaded and exposed in that county a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.

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    Regular Member mjones's Avatar
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    demnogis wrote:
    Can you please provide a link to the AB 357 legislature? I can't seem to find it. Only one I see is from 2007 and it was a shot-down teaching expenditure bill.
    Status

    History

    Text

    For status on any CA Bill in progress, look here

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    Regular Member mjones's Avatar
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    eflatminor wrote:
    The people of the State of California do enact as follows:
    SECTION 1. Section 12050 of the Penal Code is amended to read:
    12050. (a) (1) (A) The sheriff of a county, upon proof that the person applying is of good moral character, That good cause exists for the issuance,and that the person applying satisfies any one of the conditions specified in subparagraph (D) and has completed a course of training as described in subparagraph (E), may shall issue to that person a license to carry a pistol, revolver,or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person in either one of the following formats:
    (i) A license to carry concealed a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.
    (ii) Where the population of the county is less than 200,000 persons according to the most recent federal decennial census, a license to carry loaded and exposed in that county a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.

    clarification...

    italictext = stricken

    Bold text = addition


    SECTION 1. Section 12050 of the Penal Code is amended to read:
    12050. (a) (1) (A) The sheriff of a county, upon proof that the
    person applying is of good moral character , that good cause
    exists for the issuance,
    and that the person applying
    satisfies any one of the conditions specified in subparagraph (D) and
    has completed a course of training as described in subparagraph (E),
    may shall issue to that person a
    license to carry a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of
    being concealed upon the person in either one of the following
    formats:
    (i) A license to carry concealed a pistol, revolver, or other
    firearm capable of being concealed upon the person.


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    Regular Member mjones's Avatar
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    ...and with regard to Open Carry...

    Interestingly, this would also make LOC Licenses Shall Issue in 31 of 58 Counties. However the LOC license is only valid in the county of issuance

    County Populations

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    mjones wrote:

    ...and with regard to Open Carry...

    Interestingly, this would also make LOC Licenses Shall Issue in 31 of 58 Counties. However the LOC license is only valid in the county of issuance

    County Populations
    For those willing to take the test and pay the tax, a CCW license would exempt them from 12025, 12031, and 626.9.

    So long as there is a test and a tax, I refuse to get a CCW. I think a background check to make sure you're not a prohibited person is about as intrusive as I would endure.
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    I went and read the bill online and as I read it as you read down it, if you live in the city you still have to show good cause. I live in a town of 46,000 and here our City Police Chief takes the CCW app for people who live in the city limits. I did not see a shall issue change for Police Chiefs. Someone please correct me and make me feel better here!!!!!!!! I feel cheated about that. I read the HTML version of the bill.

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    Even if you live in the city limits you are still a resident of both the city and county. You can apply to either bureaucrat.
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    Regular Member mjones's Avatar
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    CA_Libertarian wrote:
    mjones wrote:

    ...and with regard to Open Carry...

    Interestingly, this would also make LOC Licenses Shall Issue in 31 of 58 Counties. However the LOC license is only valid in the county of issuance

    County Populations
    For those willing to take the test and pay the tax, a CCW license would exempt them from 12025, 12031, and 626.9.

    So long as there is a test and a tax, I refuse to get a CCW. I think a background check to make sure you're not a prohibited person is about as intrusive as I would endure.
    Also 171b

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    Here's the text of an e-mail I just sent to my assembly member urging him to support AB 357. I wonder how many other rhetorical approaches, beside hollering about the 2nd ammendment and endlessly qouting other states ctatistics, we can come up with to convince our politicians that guns is ok fur us reglar folks.

    -

    Dear Assembly Member Mendoza,



    I am a resident of Norwalk and am writing you to ask for your support of Assembly Member Knight's recently introduced bill making California a "shall issue" state with regard to permits to carry a concealed firearm (CCW).



    I know that firearms in general are a hot button issue and any change to firearms laws are politically sensitive but I believe that limiting the authority of county sheriff's to decide who is worthy of being treated like an adult can help make this particular gun issue less sensitive. One need only look at Orange County to see how damaging and divisive an individual sheriff's CCW issuance policies can be. Sheriff Carona is alleged to have handed out CCW's to wealthy political donors as political pay back. Now Sheriff Hutchins is at odds with many Orange County residents and her own board of supervisors over her LA County style decision to thin the ranks of CCW holders in her new county. Her actions are the subject of nationwide discussion and derision among gun owners and are frequently used to bolster the opinion that the Demokratik People's Republik of Kalifornia has no use for citizens having the right and ability to determine their own fates. Legislating that Sheriffs must issue CCWs to honorable citizens who apply and have proven themselves law abiding and properly trained removes yet another opportunity for corruption and political favoritism.



    I have served as a police officer in Orange County for over 11 years and I find it deeply disquieting that the legislators who's laws I have enforced hold their constituents in such contempt that they routinely deny them the ability to possess the means with which to defend their very lives out of some sense that regular people can't be trusted with dangerous tools. I can tell you from experience that when people needed me immediately to defend them from violent attack, I was always several minutes away. I am allowed to drive a big heavy dangerous car at really high speeds, poison myself with tobacco and alcohol and be irresponsible in raising my children with minimal interference from my government but I am virtually prohibited from even asking permission to do something that a growing number of Americans can practically take for granted. In Los Angeles County it is almost impossible to get a CCW from Sheriff Baca unless you are rich or a celebrity and are owed a political favor or are one of the people that these people pay to protect them from normal people.



    There are so many other reasons to support Assembly Member Knight's bill but I have purposely limited my argument knowing that others of your constituents are likely to make those other points for me.



    Please support Assembly Member Knight's bill. Eliminate one more avenue for political corruption. Support the right of Californians to possess the means to be safe. Support fairness for the Citizens of California.



    Should you ever wish to speak with me on this topic I would be honored to do so.



    Thank you for your time and service,



    Respectfully yours,



    Grumpycoconut



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    not to be a buzz kill, but what does it mean to be a "shall" issue state?

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    poothrowingape wrote:
    not to be a buzz kill, but what does it mean to be a "shall" issue state?
    "May issue" means that if you fulfill all the requirements of the law, the Sheriff or Chief of Police has the option to issue a CCW. That means that if they are having a bad day, or don't like your hair, they can tell you to buzz off.

    "Shall issue" means that if you fulfill the requirements of the law, the Sheriff of Chief of Police must issue a CCW. They don't have an option.

    Shall issue would be a major advance for CA gun rights. Out here in CO we are a shall issue state and off the top of my head I can list about 30-40 people I know personally who have a CCW. And I live in a small town.

    I can't name one person from Cali who has one, and I lived there for 16(+/-) years. Not even my dad, who is an ex-deputy from CA.

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    well then that sounds very exciting. i have to wait a full year before i can get a ccw. i am only 20.

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    poothrowingape wrote:
    well then that sounds very exciting. i have to wait a full year before i can get a ccw. i am only 20.

    I never looked into it before, but a just took a quick re-peak at PC 12050- 12054. I don't see any age restrictions on the license. It does have language stating that you can't be a prohibited person, so I think that would cover ages 18+

    Did I miss anything or on this gentleman?


    edit: I also just noticed you are in Fresno...you might be able to apply right now if there isn't an age restriction I missed

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    welli am licensed to carry a firearm while working as a security guard but it all seems useless since i cant own a handgun until i am 21.

    however if what you say is true then i would go get one at the drop of a hat. my brother and mom are getting ccw's soon and i would love to go get one aswell.

    but yes i am in fresno and our sheriff Margret Mims is doing a great job with issueingCCW's. Ill be voting for her again.


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    I just sent an e-mail through the assembly website to my assembly person (Mr. DeVore). I'm unsure on his history, stance, etc but hopefully a few more like-minded individuals can send in e-mails as well to help garner support for our district.
    Gun control isn't about guns -- it is about control.

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    poothrowingape wrote:
    welli am licensed to carry a firearm while working as a security guard but it all seems useless since i cant own a handgun until i am 21.

    however if what you say is true then i would go get one at the drop of a hat. my brother and mom are getting ccw's soon and i would love to go get one aswell.

    but yes i am in fresno and our sheriff Margret Mims is doing a great job with issueingCCW's. Ill be voting for her again.
    Not sure, but you can OWN a handgun over the age of 18, you just can't BUY a handgun or ammo from a DEALER. No restrictions on private party buys though I believe.

    It would really suck if I couldn't own a handgun in Cali at age 20... since I currently have, um... let's see... 5 handguns. All bought private party, out of California.

    I don't exactly know how private party transfers work in CA, maybe some of the more senior members here could enlighten us?

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    fighting_for_freedom wrote:
    Not sure, but you can OWN a handgun over the age of 18, you just can't BUY a handgun or ammo from a DEALER. No restrictions on private party buys though I believe.

    It would really suck if I couldn't own a handgun in Cali at age 20... since I currently have, um... let's see... 5 handguns. All bought private party, out of California.

    I don't exactly know how private party transfers work in CA, maybe some of the more senior members here could enlighten us?
    wow well thank you for the clear up. my father actually is wanting to give me a gun so now i guess i legally can. and since its from child to parrent or grandparrent i can to it without an ffl too.

    My mother did that; when she bought us guns for christmas she found out all we have to do is fill out a form and send it in along with the19 dollar payment. When its accepted the DOJ will send you letter confirmation for hand guns, but not for long guns.

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    fighting_for_freedom wrote:
    Not sure, but you can OWN a handgun over the age of 18, you just can't BUY a handgun or ammo from a DEALER. No restrictions on private party buys though I believe.

    It would really suck if I couldn't own a handgun in Cali at age 20... since I currently have, um... let's see... 5 handguns. All bought private party, out of California.

    I don't exactly know how private party transfers work in CA, maybe some of the more senior members here could enlighten us?
    What exact law is it that states u only have to be 18 to own a hand gun? i cant find it for the life of me

    Edit: dissregard. i spoke to a police officer and he told me it was legal.

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    poothrowingape wrote:
    Edit: dissregard. i spoke to a police officer and he told me it was legal.
    Even if you got the answer you wanted, I would avoid using LE for legal advice.

    I'm not too well read on the transfer laws, but I think all handguns have to be PPT'd or at least DROS'd. I might be wrong on this, but I think you could probably find the answers on CalGuns.net. Anything posted by Librarian is pretty reliable, so maybe search for posts by him and then keyword search from there.
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    CA_Libertarian wrote:
    poothrowingape wrote:
    Edit: dissregard. i spoke to a police officer and he told me it was legal.
    Even if you got the answer you wanted, I would avoid using LE for legal advice.

    I'm not too well read on the transfer laws, but I think all handguns have to be PPT'd or at least DROS'd. I might be wrong on this, but I think you could probably find the answers on CalGuns.net. Anything posted by Librarian is pretty reliable, so maybe search for posts by him and then keyword search from there.
    Ya i was talking about doing it legally, meaning filling out the proper forms.

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    btw sorry to everyone for hijacking this thread, Where were we?

    Oh ya CCW's to be shall issued! woot!

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    Use the Intrafamilial Transfer Form on the CA DOJ website. It is 19 bucks and it is trough the mail.

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    I sent an email (similar to grumptycoconut's) to my assembly member (Curt Hagman), and I actually got a response in the mail!

    I urge the rest of you to do the same.

    Here's the text of the response:

    Dear <my name>:

    Thank you for contacting my office to express your support for AB357 which would give Californian's a license to carry a concealed firearm without having to establish "good cause." This law would extend the license availability to the majority of California's law abiding citizens.

    I support this bill and strongly support in the Constitutional right to bear arms. As a Vice-Chairman of the public safety committee, I will urge my colleagues to send this bill to the floor so that California's citizens can exercise their right to protect themselves and their families.

    Thank you for giving me this opportunity to serve you. Please do not hesitate to call me at 909-860-5560 should you have any questions or concerns. Thank you.

    Sincerely,

    Curt Hagman
    Assemblyman, 60th
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    ... loaded with Speer Gold Dot 124 gr

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