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Thread: Fellow comrades? New guy here...

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    I can't even begin to say how happy I was to find this site. It answered questions I've had for years pertaining to oc. I'm currently residing in the city of Allen Park and was wondering how many individuals are near here? I think it would be great to throw a gathering come summer in the vicinity of here. I do have a question pertaining to cpl, I'll ask it and if anyone knows the answer it would be greatly appreciated. Also please introduce yourself so I know some people on here. The question I have and can't seem to clarify is: I wan't to get my cpl, I have a operating an ORV while impaired from 5 yrs ago and an operating a vehicle while impaired 3 yrs ago. Are these both first offense's or is the operating a vehicle a second? Do I need to wait 3 yrs or 8? Thanks for any help and thanks for a great site.

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    i dont remember off hand, but if you go in to get the CPL packet, i remember my information here in Midland listed all that in the packet.

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    I did read through the whole packet but it really wasnt clear. I would hate to go through the hassle to find out I was denied.

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    You should definately wait for one of the legal guys to chime in, but I BELIEVE that you will need to wait 3 years. Although they were both *UI Offences, they were charged differently - making neither of them a 'second offence'.

    Once again, you should definately wait for one of the more legal based guys to chime in.



    Ben

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    Thats what I was thinking too. But who knows the way our government works. Thanks for your reply

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    Yeah, for sure. Just because we read it that way doesn't mean our 'leaders' do..

    In any case, When you do get your CPL (and even before then when OCing), please do be careful. Alcohol + gun is never going to = good situation. I'm completely paranoid about guns + ANY alcohol.. I have to imagine that even if I was under the legal limit, A jury would not look favorably upon my having drank before having to defend myself or a loved one. Since starting to carry a gun about 6 years ago, I no longer drink at all.

    Good luck and be safe,
    Ben

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    Thanks for that, but I no longer drink either so I'm good to go

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    marshall1134, Welcome. Go to Michigan Gun Owners, www.migunowners.org and find the Legal Beagle section. There is an lawyer there that gives advice. See what he says.springerdave.

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    Welcome aboard.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    IANAL

    I would say that you have 5 more years to wait till the 8 years is up.

    There is an 8 year disqualifier of "Operating under the influence 2nd offense (257.625(1)(8)(b)"

    I hope I'm wrong.

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    Get copies of your tickets and see how they are written. Also, get a copy of your driving record, and see how it shows there.
    http://www.michigan.gov/sos/0,1607,7...1868--,00.html

    A lawyer will be able to tell you for certain then.
    "Fault always lies in the same place, my fine babies: with him weak enough to lay blame." - Cort

    Gun control is like trying to reduce Drunk Driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars.

    Sentio aliquos togatos contra me conspirare.

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    1776"

    With freedom comes much responsibility. It is for this reason so many are loathe to exercise it.

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    Hey guys thanks for the welcomes and also the links. Interesting thing happened to me today. I have three friends who are LEO'sand decided to ask them there opinion's on the whole oc thing. I though they would be cool on the whole subject because we're friends but all I got was negativity on the subject. They did inform me that it was legal and they had an internal meeting regarding the subject. One told me it would be smart to carry a copy of the law for refrence do to some of the rookie's in other cities not being familiar with the law, and that they would most likely be jerks about it. All three said that mostleo'sfrowned upon it, mostly stating that if you walk into a store or place of business there is a possibility of getting shot and also that there are strict laws involving person to person confrontation when a weapon is involved. (mostly there opinion) My opinion is that it pisses them of that others have the right to carry a gun and that brings them (LEO's) down to our level. The thrill of them being so superior isn't quite there as much.

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    Welcome to the site!

    I'm very much in favor of a meeting in Allen Park. If you know of a good place, please make a thread to arrange a meeting.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    Sounds like you might have sniffed out a trio of Opinion Enforcement Officers there laddy.springerdave.

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    Yep, the three amigos. lol

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    marshall1134 wrote:
    Hey guys thanks for the welcomes and also the links. Interesting thing happened to me today. I have three friends who are LEO'sand decided to ask them there opinion's on the whole oc thing. I though they would be cool on the whole subject because we're friends but all I got was negativity on the subject. They did inform me that it was legal and they had an internal meeting regarding the subject. One told me it would be smart to carry a copy of the law for refrence do to some of the rookie's in other cities not being familiar with the law, and that they would most likely be jerks about it. All three said that mostleo'sfrowned upon it, mostly stating that if you walk into a store or place of business there is a possibility of getting shot and also that there are strict laws involving person to person confrontation when a weapon is involved. (mostly there opinion) My opinion is that it pisses them of that others have the right to carry a gun and that brings them (LEO's) down to our level. The thrill of them being so superior isn't quite there as much.
    First off, all I can say is: what an ignorant post. I have been an LEO for almost 4 years now, and I can say that what you just mentioned is garbage. There is no "superiority complex". Most LEO's don't like seeing everyone with guns because there are a lot of crazy people that really shouldn't have guns. In order to get our gun and be able to carry it, we had to go through a ton of training, not to mention a strenuous background check, and a psychological exam. Some people, even if they're not crazy, shouldn't be able to carry a gun. Some people just might not be able to handle the responsibility of a firearm.

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    MEPDtoUSBP wrote:
    marshall1134 wrote:
    Hey guys thanks for the welcomes and also the links. Interesting thing happened to me today. I have three friends who are LEO'sand decided to ask them there opinion's on the whole oc thing. I though they would be cool on the whole subject because we're friends but all I got was negativity on the subject. They did inform me that it was legal and they had an internal meeting regarding the subject. One told me it would be smart to carry a copy of the law for refrence do to some of the rookie's in other cities not being familiar with the law, and that they would most likely be jerks about it. All three said that mostleo'sfrowned upon it, mostly stating that if you walk into a store or place of business there is a possibility of getting shot and also that there are strict laws involving person to person confrontation when a weapon is involved. (mostly there opinion) My opinion is that it pisses them of that others have the right to carry a gun and that brings them (LEO's) down to our level. The thrill of them being so superior isn't quite there as much.
    First off, all I can say is: what an ignorant post. I have been an LEO for almost 4 years now, and I can say that what you just mentioned is garbage. There is no "superiority complex". Most LEO's don't like seeing everyone with guns because there are a lot of crazy people that really shouldn't have guns. In order to get our gun and be able to carry it, we had to go through a ton of training, not to mention a strenuous background check, and a psychological exam. Some people, even if they're not crazy, shouldn't be able to carry a gun. Some people just might not be able to handle the responsibility of a firearm.
    and who decides who's "ok"? who sets the standards? who enforces them?

    SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!!!!

    some police officers are great, honest people trying to do a hard job.

    others are nothing but jack booted thugs.

    and then there's those who are in between. the "polite" opinion enforcement officers. those who DON"T KNOW the law, and REFUSE TO LEARN. these officers have a tendency to completely IGNORE the Constitution they are sworn to protect. these officers DO have a superiority complex, and they need to be straightened out.

    that being said, I'm very glad that most of them fall into the first category.

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    MEPDtoUSBP wrote:
    marshall1134 wrote:
    Hey guys thanks for the welcomes and also the links. Interesting thing happened to me today. I have three friends who are LEO'sand decided to ask them there opinion's on the whole oc thing. I though they would be cool on the whole subject because we're friends but all I got was negativity on the subject. They did inform me that it was legal and they had an internal meeting regarding the subject. One told me it would be smart to carry a copy of the law for refrence do to some of the rookie's in other cities not being familiar with the law, and that they would most likely be jerks about it. All three said that mostleo'sfrowned upon it, mostly stating that if you walk into a store or place of business there is a possibility of getting shot and also that there are strict laws involving person to person confrontation when a weapon is involved. (mostly there opinion) My opinion is that it pisses them of that others have the right to carry a gun and that brings them (LEO's) down to our level. The thrill of them being so superior isn't quite there as much.
    First off, all I can say is: what an ignorant post. I have been an LEO for almost 4 years now, and I can say that what you just mentioned is garbage. There is no "superiority complex". Most LEO's don't like seeing everyone with guns because there are a lot of crazy people that really shouldn't have guns. In order to get our gun and be able to carry it, we had to go through a ton of training, not to mention a strenuous background check, and a psychological exam. Some people, even if they're not crazy, shouldn't be able to carry a gun. Some people just might not be able to handle the responsibility of a firearm.
    No, in order to become a LEO you had to go through a ton of training, a background check and a psychological exam. In order to 'get your gun', you could have simply gone out, got a purchase permit, and bought one and carried it. That's Michigan law.

  19. #19
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    MEPDtoUSBP wrote:
    marshall1134 wrote:
    Hey guys thanks for the welcomes and also the links. Interesting thing happened to me today. I have three friends who are LEO'sand decided to ask them there opinion's on the whole oc thing. I though they would be cool on the whole subject because we're friends but all I got was negativity on the subject. They did inform me that it was legal and they had an internal meeting regarding the subject. One told me it would be smart to carry a copy of the law for refrence do to some of the rookie's in other cities not being familiar with the law, and that they would most likely be jerks about it. All three said that mostleo'sfrowned upon it, mostly stating that if you walk into a store or place of business there is a possibility of getting shot and also that there are strict laws involving person to person confrontation when a weapon is involved. (mostly there opinion) My opinion is that it pisses them of that others have the right to carry a gun and that brings them (LEO's) down to our level. The thrill of them being so superior isn't quite there as much.
    First off, all I can say is: what an ignorant post. I have been an LEO for almost 4 years now, and I can say that what you just mentioned is garbage. There is no "superiority complex". Most LEO's don't like seeing everyone with guns because there are a lot of crazy people that really shouldn't have guns. In order to get our gun and be able to carry it, we had to go through a ton of training, not to mention a strenuous background check, and a psychological exam. Some people, even if they're not crazy, shouldn't be able to carry a gun. Some people just might not be able to handle the responsibility of a firearm.
    If your a LEO then why are you even on this site? To start ****! I said it was my opinion and I certainly wasnt bashing anyone. 4 yrs on the force? Good for you ROOKIE. The fact that you say my opinon is ignorant shows how ignorant you are. I maid a general comment, I did not attack YOU in any way so take your **** elsewhere.

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    xd-40 wrote:
    MEPDtoUSBP wrote:
    marshall1134 wrote:
    Hey guys thanks for the welcomes and also the links. Interesting thing happened to me today. I have three friends who are LEO'sand decided to ask them there opinion's on the whole oc thing. I though they would be cool on the whole subject because we're friends but all I got was negativity on the subject. They did inform me that it was legal and they had an internal meeting regarding the subject. One told me it would be smart to carry a copy of the law for refrence do to some of the rookie's in other cities not being familiar with the law, and that they would most likely be jerks about it. All three said that mostleo'sfrowned upon it, mostly stating that if you walk into a store or place of business there is a possibility of getting shot and also that there are strict laws involving person to person confrontation when a weapon is involved. (mostly there opinion) My opinion is that it pisses them of that others have the right to carry a gun and that brings them (LEO's) down to our level. The thrill of them being so superior isn't quite there as much.
    First off, all I can say is: what an ignorant post. I have been an LEO for almost 4 years now, and I can say that what you just mentioned is garbage. There is no "superiority complex". Most LEO's don't like seeing everyone with guns because there are a lot of crazy people that really shouldn't have guns. In order to get our gun and be able to carry it, we had to go through a ton of training, not to mention a strenuous background check, and a psychological exam. Some people, even if they're not crazy, shouldn't be able to carry a gun. Some people just might not be able to handle the responsibility of a firearm.
    and who decides who's "ok"? who sets the standards? who enforces them?

    SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!!!!

    some police officers are great, honest people trying to do a hard job.

    others are nothing but jack booted thugs.

    and then there's those who are in between. the "polite" opinion enforcement officers. those who DON"T KNOW the law, and REFUSE TO LEARN. these officers have a tendency to completely IGNORE the Constitution they are sworn to protect. these officers DO have a superiority complex, and they need to be straightened out.

    that being said, I'm very glad that most of them fall into the first category.
    alright i think u guys aren't getting my point of view. I am a big fan of open carry. I was just stating why SOME cops feel the way they do about guns. I believe in the right to bear arms, as do most officers I know. However, not all officers know the OC law very well. It is never mentioned in the academy and not mentioned in the law books we learned. And it is not that easy for one of us to believe someone that says "this is legal...MI state law says I can do this"... frankly because people use that defense for a lot of criminal behavior...even if what they ARE doing is illegal. It sucks to say but you really just can't "take their word for it" anymore. When you're lied to everyday, you get a little apprehensive.

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    marshall1134 wrote:
    MEPDtoUSBP wrote:
    marshall1134 wrote:
    Hey guys thanks for the welcomes and also the links. Interesting thing happened to me today. I have three friends who are LEO'sand decided to ask them there opinion's on the whole oc thing. I though they would be cool on the whole subject because we're friends but all I got was negativity on the subject. They did inform me that it was legal and they had an internal meeting regarding the subject. One told me it would be smart to carry a copy of the law for refrence do to some of the rookie's in other cities not being familiar with the law, and that they would most likely be jerks about it. All three said that mostleo'sfrowned upon it, mostly stating that if you walk into a store or place of business there is a possibility of getting shot and also that there are strict laws involving person to person confrontation when a weapon is involved. (mostly there opinion) My opinion is that it pisses them of that others have the right to carry a gun and that brings them (LEO's) down to our level. The thrill of them being so superior isn't quite there as much.
    First off, all I can say is: what an ignorant post. I have been an LEO for almost 4 years now, and I can say that what you just mentioned is garbage. There is no "superiority complex". Most LEO's don't like seeing everyone with guns because there are a lot of crazy people that really shouldn't have guns. In order to get our gun and be able to carry it, we had to go through a ton of training, not to mention a strenuous background check, and a psychological exam. Some people, even if they're not crazy, shouldn't be able to carry a gun. Some people just might not be able to handle the responsibility of a firearm.
    If your a LEO then why are you even on this site? To start @#$%! I said it was my opinion and I certainly wasnt bashing anyone. 4 yrs on the force? Good for you ROOKIE. The fact that you say my opinon is ignorant shows how ignorant you are. I maid a general comment, I did not attack YOU in any way so take your @#$% elsewhere.
    Actually I read this forum all the time because before I worked in law enforcement I had a CCW and was a big advocate of guns. And I didn't bash you, I just stated I didn't agree with your post. You bashed ALL cops....saying we think we are superior. If you're going to act like that, then I won't come on here anymore. I thought some people might like to hear from an LEO on here every once in awhile but I guess not.

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    MEPDtoUSBP wrote:
    xd-40 wrote:
    MEPDtoUSBP wrote:
    marshall1134 wrote:
    Hey guys thanks for the welcomes and also the links. Interesting thing happened to me today. I have three friends who are LEO'sand decided to ask them there opinion's on the whole oc thing. I though they would be cool on the whole subject because we're friends but all I got was negativity on the subject. They did inform me that it was legal and they had an internal meeting regarding the subject. One told me it would be smart to carry a copy of the law for refrence do to some of the rookie's in other cities not being familiar with the law, and that they would most likely be jerks about it. All three said that mostleo'sfrowned upon it, mostly stating that if you walk into a store or place of business there is a possibility of getting shot and also that there are strict laws involving person to person confrontation when a weapon is involved. (mostly there opinion) My opinion is that it pisses them of that others have the right to carry a gun and that brings them (LEO's) down to our level. The thrill of them being so superior isn't quite there as much.
    First off, all I can say is: what an ignorant post. I have been an LEO for almost 4 years now, and I can say that what you just mentioned is garbage. There is no "superiority complex". Most LEO's don't like seeing everyone with guns because there are a lot of crazy people that really shouldn't have guns. In order to get our gun and be able to carry it, we had to go through a ton of training, not to mention a strenuous background check, and a psychological exam. Some people, even if they're not crazy, shouldn't be able to carry a gun. Some people just might not be able to handle the responsibility of a firearm.
    and who decides who's "ok"? who sets the standards? who enforces them?

    SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED!!!!

    some police officers are great, honest people trying to do a hard job.

    others are nothing but jack booted thugs.

    and then there's those who are in between. the "polite" opinion enforcement officers. those who DON"T KNOW the law, and REFUSE TO LEARN. these officers have a tendency to completely IGNORE the Constitution they are sworn to protect. these officers DO have a superiority complex, and they need to be straightened out.

    that being said, I'm very glad that most of them fall into the first category.
    alright i think u guys aren't getting my point of view. I am a big fan of open carry. I was just stating why SOME cops feel the way they do about guns. I believe in the right to bear arms, as do most officers I know. However, not all officers know the OC law very well. It is never mentioned in the academy and not mentioned in the law books we learned. And it is not that easy for one of us to believe someone that says "this is legal...MI state law says I can do this"... frankly because people use that defense for a lot of criminal behavior...even if what they ARE doing is illegal. It sucks to say but you really just can't "take their word for it" anymore. When you're lied to everyday, you get a little apprehensive.
    However, not all officers know the OC law very well.
    Likely because there is no law regarding OC.

    It is never mentioned in the academy and not mentioned in the law books we learned.
    Likely because law books and academy's generally focus on things that are illegal.

    I'm pretty sure that most officers do not know the law about carrying water-bottles, and I don't think the academy or law books cover it either.

  23. #23
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    I see your point. There alot of stupid mf out there who try to get away with murder and will find any loop hole to do so. But this law that has always been in effect should have been taught to all leo's in basic traing. If it were there would not be such a problem with it. The Controversy over this sickens me. I'm surprised this site only has 8000+ people, it should have 800,000+

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    Actually I read this forum all the time because before I worked in law enforcement I had a CCW and was a big advocate of guns. And I didn't bash you, I just stated I didn't agree with your post. You bashed ALL cops....saying we think we are superior. If you're going to act like that, then I won't come on here anymore. I thought some people might like to hear from an LEO on here every once in awhile but I guess not.
    Ok so you read it all the time but just decided to become a member weeks ago. I'm sure everyone thanks you for your support. Why don't you put an avatar up or the city your from?

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    marshall1134 wrote:
    I see your point. There alot of stupid mf out there who try to get away with murder and will find any loop hole to do so. But this law that has always been in effect should have been taught to all leo's in basic traing. If it were there would not be such a problem with it. The Controversy over this sickens me. I'm surprised this site only has 8000+ people, it should have 800,000+
    That's all I was trying to say. The training that we DO get on firearms pretty much only covers CCW's. We are almost even led to believe that you can't carry a gun unless you have a CCW. Nice to see someone from Downriver on here. I lived in LP for a long time, and worked for Melvindale PD before I came to work for the federal government.

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