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Thread: 711 and hats

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    I went to my local 711 yesterday and while I was OCing my Glock 21, I was also wearing a tan ballcap with the American flag on it and the woman behind the counter, while she said nothing about the .45 on my hip, said that in all local (Hampton Roads area) 711s now require all hats, scarfs, etc. be removed before entering the store. I didn't have a problem with it, so I said "Okay." and took it off.

    I did check the door after I left and couldn't find anything that was posted, but I thought I'd let everyone know that if you go to a 711 with a hat, you might be asked to remove it...

    Also, this had nothing to do with the fact I had a weapon.



    What is the world coming to when I have to remove my hat to buy a bottle of water and some gummy worms??? :shock:


    -adam

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    Regular Member Neplusultra's Avatar
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    Zero4910 wrote:
    I went to my local 711 yesterday and while I was OCing my Glock 21, I was also wearing a tan ballcap with the American flag on it and the woman behind the counter, while she said nothing about the .45 on my hip, said that in all local (Hampton Roads area) 711s now require all hats, scarfs, etc. be removed before entering the store. I didn't have a problem with it, so I said "Okay." and took it off.

    I did check the door after I left and couldn't find anything that was posted, but I thought I'd let everyone know that if you go to a 711 with a hat, you might be asked to remove it...

    Also, this had nothing to do with the fact I had a weapon.



    What is the world coming to when I have to remove my hat to buy a bottle of water and some gummy worms??? :shock:


    -adam
    They want a clear video shot of your face? Might be a good crime fighting tool.... Of course the BG would just ignore it and walk right in with his hoodie on. Dummies.

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    Maybe if they ask nicely the BG with remove his/her hoodie before possibly killing the attendant for the $43.76 in the cash register.

    I dont think this 711 had any cameras...not that i saw at least and I go there several times a week.



    -adam

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    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
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    Hat control. Because only criminals wear hats.

    TFred


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    Yeah, that's going to stop the criminals....

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    Regular Member virginiatuck's Avatar
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    Look up 'hat etiquette'. Like most salutations and customs, they have evolved over many generations. Less so now, but it used to be rather disrespectful to wear a hat indoors.

    I generally don't consider a public store to be one of the places I must remove my hat, but I do in restaurants, visiting people's homes, and when I'm visiting a client's office. In my own office, I sometimes leave my hat on.

    It may be that the owner is feebly trying to restore some order and a sense of respect in his community.

    And not all thieves who enter the 7-11 are confrontational. If 7-11 in fact wants a nice picture for the camera, they could be looking for shoplifters and not just armed robbers.

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    A local branch of NFCU has the same policy. No hats, sunglasses, or other garment (hood) that obscures the face or head may be worn inside.
    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

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    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
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    wrightme wrote:
    A local branch of NFCU has the same policy.
    I believe they all do.
    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
    The easiest ex. but probably the most difficult to grasp for gun owners is that fool permission slip so many of you have, especially if you show it off with pride. You should recognize it as an embarrassment, an infringement, a travesty and an affront to a free person.


    ~Alan Korwin

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    Founder's Club Member Hawkflyer's Avatar
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    At a 7-11! More likely she just didn't like your flag.
    "Research has shown that a 230 grain lead pellet placed just behind the ear at 850 FPS results in a permanent cure for violent criminal behavior."
    "If you are not getting Flak, you are not over the target"
    "186,000 Miles per second! ... Not just a good idea ... It's the law!"

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    I've seen the "no hoods worn in store" signs, but never "no hats".

    This was at a small truckstop in Jennings LA.

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    Regular Member Neplusultra's Avatar
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    virginiatuck wrote:
    Look up 'hat etiquette'. Like most salutations and customs, they have evolved over many generations. Less so now, but it used to be rather disrespectful to wear a hat indoors.

    I generally don't consider a public store to be one of the places I must remove my hat, but I do in restaurants, visiting people's homes, and when I'm visiting a client's office. In my own office, I sometimes leave my hat on.
    I never did understand the reasoning behind this social custom. My father once got angry with me because I didn't take of my baseball cap inside a Chesapeake Bay Seafood restaurant. I said, "Dad, look around". There was at least 7 or 8 others wearing their caps too.

    What's the deal with taking off your hat?

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    Neplusultra wrote:
    I never did understand the reasoning behind this social custom. My father once got angry with me because I didn't take of my baseball cap inside a Chesapeake Bay Seafood restaurant. I said, "Dad, look around". There was at least 7 or 8 others wearing their caps too.

    What's the deal with taking off your hat?
    $0.02 -- manners

    When I was a cadet at Virginia Tech, it was extensively drilled into us that you always wear your cover (hat) when armed.
    ---

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    Regular Member Neplusultra's Avatar
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    rlh2005 wrote:
    Neplusultra wrote:
    I never did understand the reasoning behind this social custom. My father once got angry with me because I didn't take of my baseball cap inside a Chesapeake Bay Seafood restaurant. I said, "Dad, look around". There was at least 7 or 8 others wearing their caps too.

    What's the deal with taking off your hat?
    $0.02 -- manners

    When I was a cadet at Virginia Tech, it was extensively drilled into us that you always wear your cover (hat) when armed.
    Why would taking your hat off inside be considered "manners"? It just seems to me to be social "custom" and not pertaining to anything that might offend someone. That's what manners and gentlemanliness is about, not giving offense. How does my hat being on indoors offend?

    Really about the cadets? Interesting. I'll have to use that argument the next time since I'm always armed :^). Was there a reason given as to why you were so instructed?

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    Neplusultra wrote:
    Why would taking your hat off inside be considered "manners"? It just seems to me to be social "custom" and not pertaining to anything that might offend someone. That's what manners and gentlemanliness is about, not giving offense. How does my hat being on indoors offend?
    Back in the day, it was customary for a gentleman to wear a hat as part of being properly dressed. It was also customary to remove your hat when indoors and to tip your hat as a sign of respect to a woman that you encountered.

    Times have changed.

    Back in the day, an undershirt was a shirt worn under your regular shirt. An undershirt was a garment that only your wife saw you wear in the privacy of your bedroom. Today, its common to see certain segments of society walking around in the white undershirts and/or "wifebeaters" as they are known on the street.

    Times have changed.

    Back in the day, your underwear was kept hidden in your pants. Now people wear their pants slung down their asses and they show off their boxer shorts.

    Times have changed.


    James Reynolds

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    Neplusultra wrote:
    Why would taking your hat off inside be considered "manners"? It just seems to me to be social "custom" and not pertaining to anything that might offend someone. That's what manners and gentlemanliness is about, not giving offense. How does my hat being on indoors offend?

    Really about the cadets? Interesting. I'll have to use that argument the next time since I'm always armed :^). Was there a reason given as to why you were so instructed?
    Why is it considered good manners? For the same reason, it's considered good manners to use sir or ma'am, hold the door for women, etc. It's just good manners.

    Yes, they were very serious about wearing you cover while armed. Granted our Springfield '03s didn't have firing pins and had plugged barrels. I did many a pushup because of a fellow cadet not having a cover on. As for why you wear a cover while under arms, that's the regulation. It's the military (or military training in this case); you follow the regs or you get punished.
    ---

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    Neplusultra wrote:
    Why would taking your hat off inside be considered "manners"? It just seems to me to be social "custom" and not pertaining to anything that might offend someone. That's what manners and gentlemanliness is about, not giving offense. How does my hat being on indoors offend?
    Think about the reason you are wearing a hat. Is it to keep the sun out of your eyes? To keep from getting your scalp sun-burnt? Is it to keep your hair from blowing in the wind?

    Indoors there is not usually sun or wind. If there is no obvious reason to wear your hat, then you may be hiding something; so why should someone trust you? Removing your hat simply assures everyone that you are not hiding; so you are not, or less of, a threat. It puts people at ease. And that is also why the custom dictates a man should remove his hat when talking to a woman or when a woman is in his presence.

    If you remove your hat for a national anthem or a funeral, in spite of being outside in the sun or the rain, you are acknowledging that there is something more important than yourself or your personal needs. Again, this lets everyone around you feel more at ease that you are not a threat and that you do not have contempt.

    It's like how offering your empty strong arm to someone shows that you are not raising a weapon to them; so you are not, or less of, a threat.

    It's a small thing, but removing your hat just may help some people feel more at ease with you carrying a gun. Whether or not they even know what good manners are, I think people can recognize good manners on a subconscious level. If they observe your good manners, they may not worry so much about your intentions.

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    ProShooter wrote:
    Back in the day, it was customary for a gentleman to wear a hat as part of being properly dressed. It was also customary to remove your hat when indoors and to tip your hat as a sign of respect to a woman that you encountered.
    As it should still be for anyone who considers himself a gentleman. To many it is no different than standing when a woman gets up or arrives at the supper table, pulling out her chair or holding the door. Courtesy and etiquette beget polite society.

    Back in the day, an undershirt was a shirt worn under your regular shirt. An undershirt was a garment that only your wife saw you wear in the privacy of your bedroom. Today, its common to see certain segments of society walking around in the white undershirts and/or "wifebeaters" as they are known on the street.
    I think I see where this is going

    Back in the day, your underwear was kept hidden in your pants. Now people wear their pants slung down their asses and they show off their boxer shorts.
    Yep... now I get it...

    Times have changed.
    And NOT for the better.
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
    And the newest slavery is to keep the people poor, and stupid
    Novos ordo seclorum ~ Mustaine

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    while I agree that a BG won't remove his hat while commiting the robbery, there was a cases recently nearby where the man walked into theABCstore, walked out and returned 4 minutes later to rob it. I would assumerobbers stake out a store prior to robbing it, if they have to remove their hats on the initialvisit, they could be Identified later. It's their property, their rules. My hat wearing ability also does not affect the security of a free state.

    ETA: recent story, note how he put a hat on for the initial visit:

    http://hamptonroads.com/2009/02/man-...-store-robbery

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    For reatuarants, offices, and private residences of people you are not familiar with, removing your hat is a sign of respect and courtesy.

    You may not "get" this custom, but you could ask the same question about most customs. Why do we wear clothes when it's hot outside, for instance? Well, it's rude to show the world your flabby ridiculousness, and it's unsanitary to boot. (No, I won't sit down on the Metro seat you've just vacated, I prefer to stand for this train ride, thank you.)

    7-11, of course, is just a convenience store, and along with bars, is the kind of place where this hat custom doesn't really count. Like someone above said, it's probably a security camera thing, and it's about as useless as banning guns.

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    Regular Member virginiatuck's Avatar
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    ProShooter wrote:
    Back in the day, your underwear was kept hidden in your pants. Now people wear their pants slung down their asses and they show off their boxer shorts.
    It's awefully difficult to perform any sort of manual labor dressed like that. And most office jobs have a dress code. Wearing pants like that probably means that they don't have an f'ing job. <period>

    Hmm, now to tie this to OC somehow.... oh, without a job they won't be "buying" their guns. That style of dress really limits their gun carrying abilities, too. Mexican-style carry is probably out of the question unless they've got some really tight boxers; their only options would be garter, ankle, or shoulder holsters.

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    wylde007 wrote:
    Times have changed.
    And NOT for the better.


    Agreed! +1000
    James Reynolds

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    rlh2005 wrote:
    As for why you wear a cover while under arms, that's the regulation. It's the military (or military training in this case); you follow the regs or you get punished.
    I wonder if the military rules of wearing a cover while under arms is not involved in the issue of having both hands free in case you need to use those arms. I would guess that the rule dates back to when men pretty much always wore a hat outdoors so there would be a preliminary assumption that a man has a hat in his possession to start with and if it isn't on his head it is very likely in his hands.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

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    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
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    I didnt' read all of this, but here might be a good start:

    http://www.fashion-era.com/hats-hair...on_history.htm

    TFred (who doesn't really wear hats by the way, unless he's in the sun all day)

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    While eating breakfast at the local diner I noticed an eldery black gentleman came in and the first thing he did when he sat down was remove his hat. When I finished I walked over to him and said that I noticed his courtesy and wanted to thank him for letting me know that good manners were not completely forgotten by everyone. I paid for his breakfast and walked out.

    It may be old fashioned but the removal of you hat while indoors is still a courtesy that should be shown. This is even more for these teen agers that are only wearing one for the fashion. Where is that 711 so if I am in that area I can shop there.

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    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    I always take my hat off at the table... even at home (most of the time).

    Either rest it on the seat next to me (if I'm seated in a booth) or over my knee. The other night the wife and I had supper at my parents' house and I forgot to take it off immediately.

    Mom gave me a crooked look and wouldn't let dad bless the meal. That was all it took, I knew what she meant!
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
    And the newest slavery is to keep the people poor, and stupid
    Novos ordo seclorum ~ Mustaine

    Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

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