CZ52 for open carry?

imported post

So what do you guys and gals think of the CZ52 in 7.62x25mm for open carry? I really, REALLY want to start open carrying, but I'm not rich enough to go out and buy a nice high end pistol and a case of high end defensive ammo. You see CZ52s for like $250-300 on Gunbroker, and a case of surplus FMJ ammo works out to half of what a case of new production FMJ 9mm or 45 costs. Am I just asking for trouble by carrying such a small caliber? Is there any good defensive ammo in the 7.62x25mm caliber?

BTW: I'm in California, where our only option is unloaded open carry. So the mags would have to be in a separate pouch on my belt anyways. Bummer. But the reason I want to OC is more to educate people than anything else. Obviously there's not much of a defensive advantage to be gained by openly carrying an unloaded gun. I just want to educate people on their rights and let the general public know, YES YOU CAN carry a gun :exclaim::exclaim:

imported post

I don't see why a CZ52 wouldn't work perfectly well for you.

7.62x25 may be relatively small in diameter, but it propels the bullet pretty fast so it is actually not all that weak.

Much of the military surplus ammunition is corrosive, which means you will need to wash your gun soon after firing to prevent the salts from corroding it.

As far as defensive ammunition, I think practically any ammunition would get the job done, but not many manufacturers make 7.62x25 hollow points if that is what you are asking.

Read the FBI's PDF at http://www.firearmstactical.com/hwfe.htm if you want to know the best information there is on terminal ballistics. It dispels a lot of myths.

imported post

I am a huge fan of the 7.62x25 round... its fast and with over 500 ft lbs ofenergy it reminds me of a mini sized 357 sig....lol...

the cz 52 is a fun gun to shoot... my advise to u is be careful...

I havent confirmed what gun it was , (either a cz 52 or markarov) was dropped by a co worker of mine and it discharged and now she is paralyzed from the waist down and still in the hospital.. they found her 5 hours after the gun discharged.

it happened like two weeks ago in idaho.

imported post

The CZ52 is a wonderful pistol. The 7.62x25 cartridge is a little TOO hot for personal defense carry....UNLESS....you can get some other than military ammo. Or you are totall fimiliar with what it can do.

The firing pin is VERY brittle and you should have another on standby. Do *NOT* dryfire.

You can carry cocked and locked. But.....do *NOT* trust ---> any <--- decocker.

Make sure you are familiar and comfortable with that weapon. Know what that bullet will do. AND......yessir.....enjoy it. I have carried and will carry one in the future.

The ammo is *HOT*.....just remember that mostly.:dude:



Watch a night time fire ball from it. WOW!

imported post

I believe some of the after market firing pins are also a lot more durable than the ones that come with the guns too.

imported post

You can still get Wolf 7.62x25mm hollow points as well which should help some in over penetration.

imported post

I do not recommend the CZ52 for carry purposes. It's an old gun with no modern safety mechanisms. The round itself is much too hot and is much more likely to simply pass through the intended target rather than expand and stop. Standard ball ammunition has been tested topunch through a kevlar GI helmet.

Look elsewhere for a carry firearm. Even a Makarov would be better, or a KelTec 9mm.

imported post

Hiredgun30 wrote:

I havent confirmed what gun it was , (either a cz 52 or markarov) was dropped by a co worker of mine and it discharged and now she is paralyzed from the waist down and still in the hospital.. they found her 5 hours after the gun discharged.

Click to expand...

I had a similar incident with a CZ52 that I used to own. To make a long story shorter, I had it with the hammer down, safety on, and a round in the chamber. It fell to the ground, landed on the hammer, and fired. The bullet went straight through the thickest part of my tibia, through a cement firewall and 2 stucco walls, and bounced off my neighbors ceiling, landing in her sink. When EMS came to pick me up, the cops found the bullet in my neighbors sink. It had not noticeably mushroomed, and looked pretty much ready to be reloaded.

Funny thing was, it happened in Arizona, so the police were reluctant to take my request of having the damn thing destroyed. They basically asked me "are you sure you want to surrender a firearm? Isn't that kind of immoral?"

I am glad it is gone. This was about 8 months ago. 8 months ago I could run just over a 5 minute mile, and just last week I finally managed to do a mile in under 10 minutes before my knee started hurting and I had to stop. But hey, I'm lucky not to be dead or paralyzed.

What I can tell you for sure is that the decocker can't be trusted, because we've all heard about how they will cause the things to fire. You can't trust the safety, because look what happened to me and hiredgun's coworker. You can't carry it cocked and locked, because you could unintentionally hit the decocker. I know you are in the PRK anyway, but at home or on private property I'm assuming your guns would have rounds in them.

If you do get one, PLEASE keep the chamber empty unless you are actually shooting it at the shooting range or something. Even then, I would probably use a wrist lanyard on the damn thing. And take it from a guy who's actually been shot by one, they are ineffective manstoppers, and they are extremely dangerous to whatever might be beyond your target because of the over penetration.

If you are on a budget, I would suggest a hi point. Not that I've ever owned one, and not that I know that they are drop safe, but people say they are reliable, and they are available in major calibers which don't have the same flaws as the old Tok. A revolver might also work, there are affordable and reliable revolvers out there. If ammo price is a concern, you should reload. You should never get a gun based on ammo availability unless you plan to quickly buy massive amounts of ammo. That goes double for an obsolete round used by lots of transferable subguns.

imported post

I love my CZ, but have to admit that it can discarge accidentally, espescially right after use. When the gun is dirty from the range, GSR can keep the slide from coming all the way forward. That happened to me one night. I had a round in the chamber and "decocked' it to be safe. Yeah.... the thing went off and the bullet travlled laterally through 6-7 feet of lathe & plaster wall, in & out of a dresser, and lodged 1/2 inch deep in solid walnut base board. If you do carry it, get the hollow points, unless you plan on shooting assailants through car doors or something. (FYI-Educated LEO's know that it will go through a vest. that usually does not make you their friend)

imported post

I just got a CZ-52 and took it to the range today.

It was really fun and awesome.

I keep reading about the decocker being garbage and untrustworthy. It should be noted that when the Warsaw Pact Nations and China transitioned from the 7.62 Tokarev to the 9mm Mak that the round remains popular in the Russian Special Forces and is also extremely popular with the Chinese Police. The surplus ammo may be cheap, but I don't think shooting ball ammo in urban environments is very safe so while the surplus stuff is great for practicing at the range, getting a box or two of Wolf JHP is a much better option for actually everyday carrying.

For the same price range you can get C&R eligble CZ-82 which come in double stacked 12 round magazines for the 9mm MAK which meets the 12in pentration recomendation for stopping human targets and is a little bit smaller and the nice black holsters you can get them with are a little more sexier than the saddle holsters you get with the cz-52.

Czechs definatly know a little bit about making nice pistols, albeit in smaller calibres mostly.

I agree that the CZ-52 is definatly not the best pistol in the world to trust your life with, but I would rather be armed than disarmed when you need something to trust peices of lead at high rates of speed at people.

imported post

I have a Tokarev TT-33, also in the same caliber. Both types of ammo available in 7.62x25 have their strong points. Applying the KISS principle, my rules for carryng this caliber -- in a CZ52 or Tokarev -- are simple:

1. Carry a magazine IN the gun of Wolf HPs for soft targets.

2. Carry a SPARE magazine of FMJs (Wolf or other current production ammo...or milsurp -- I use the Romanian milsurp myself) for hard targets (orcarry two spare mags, one of HPs and one of FMJs).

The situation (and your tactics) will decide which you use, but you'll have have anything covered because you'll be carryingboth ammo types.

Doesn't get any simpler than that.

-- John D.

imported post

I sure hope it doesn't degenerate to the point were armed criminals are running around with kevlar vests. you can always aim for the T zone then, I suppose.

imported post

I just heard on the TV news that lots of "unaccounted for" vests went to Mexico.

-- John D.

imported post

CZ 52 is a great vest penetrator. I love mine.

At the range it belches fire and gets everybodies attention.

It is a gun that can also reach out andhurt you. Be extra careful with it or you will be writing about your ND.

imported post

So is it considered dangerous to have the weapon carried with the hammer back and a round chambered in the holster?

imported post

Yes, the "half-cock" or "cocked and locked" safety arrangements arenot recommended for these commie .30-cals. Their safeties aren't much (Tokarev especially - not so sure about the CZ), and were retro-fit to make them importable per the ATF regulations. Those rounds will penetrate just about anything also. Know your target and what is beyond it. Absolutely right.

-ljp

imported post

I will say this again for comrade, they are not safe to carry cocked and locked, because you could accidentally bump the dangerous decocker. Nor are they safe to carry hammer down, chamber loaded, and safety on, because look at what happened to me.

For all intents and purposes, I have come to believe they are terrible carry guns that should ONLY be carried with an empty chamber, but preferably not at all.

imported post

I carry it condition 3 all the time now, since its the only pistol I have.

imported post

Carryinga CZ-52 (or any semi-auto) with an empty chamber (therefore requiring you to rack the slide) is not a deal-breaker to me, partly because your "situational awareness" should alert you to trouble in time enough to draw and do that if you have to. If you're not being aware of your surroundings, then you're in trouble no matter what you carry or what stage of readinessthe gun isin.

But I also think the "minimalist" Tokarev is a safer gun than the CZ52 due tothe 52's"iffy" decocker. Besides, the 1933 designed Tokarev was carried with round in the chamber and at half cock as per routine and regulation so I do not see any problem with carrying a Tokarev this way today.

So if someone wants to carry a CZ-52 with an empty chamber I would say go ahead and do so, just be aware it will take a couple of seconds more to get it into action. If that sounds too much time, remember that a gun on you is a whole lot faster thana gunleft in the car or at home...2 seconds vs. maybe 5 minutes to go back out to the car or 30 minutes to go back home!

-- John D.

imported post

I was looking into this safety thing. I'm examining my CZ-52 and I'm quite convinced on the safety mechanism. The hammer won't even fully depress when using the decocking mechanism and the striker doesn't depress to hit the firing pin.
also I dropped it with the hammer back (without a round in the chamber) and it didn't even depress. It actually seems fairly hardy and unlikely to give on safe in this circumstance.

With all this evidence mounting, I'm starting to think that this paranoia about negligent discharges may be unfounded.

Obviously especially with older firearms each one is unique and the wear and tear is always different.

I don't know if this "Fear the CZ-52!" is indeed founded.

obviously I'm not saying anyone else should try it. if you're not comfortable with your firearm that's a personal relationship between you and your weapon.