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Thread: GeorgiaCarry.org sues MARTA over detainment of (accidental) open carrier

  1. #1
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    MARTA employees alleged to have acted like casino goons and essenitally kidnapped gun owner and sequestered him in some dank back office dungeon.

    And violated Section 7 of the Federal Privacy Act by demanding his SSN.

    --

    http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/stories/2009/03/05/guns_on_MARTA.html?cxntlid=homepage_tab_newstab

    Man with gun sues MARTA after being detained
    By BILL RANKIN

    The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

    Thursday, March 05, 2009


    A man detained after entering a MARTA station wearing a holstered firearm sued the transit agency Thursday, accusing it of illegal search and seizure.

    The federal lawsuit was filed on behalf of Christopher Raissi and the gun-rights group, GeorgiaCarry.org.

    Raissi was detained by MARTA police as he entered the Avondale station Oct. 14 with his firearm, the lawsuit said. The handgun was inside Raissi’s T-shirt and must have been exposed when he dropped his MARTA fare card and bent down to pick it up, said his lawyer John Monroe.
    MARTA officers surrounded Raissi, seized the weapon and demanded to know why he was carrying a gun, the suit said.

    Raissi showed the officers his Georgia firearms license and driver’s license and, at their request, gave them his Social Security number. He was escorted to another building, held about 30 minutes and released with his gun.

    The officers had no probable cause or reasonable suspicion Raissi was committing, or about to commit a crime, the suit said. It noted the Georgia Legislature last year passed House Bill 89, which decriminalized the carrying of firearms on public transit.

    MARTA does not comment on pending litigation, spokeswoman Cara Hodgson said.

    Last summer, MARTA notified its customers about the new law. It also said the law requires anyone carrying a firearm on public transit to have a valid firearms license. MARTA police will strictly enforce all provisions of the law, the transit agency said.

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    I hope he cleans their clock. Did he also bring action against the individual officers?

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    Guy in Norfolk with similar circumstances, got gun suit dismissed but prevailed on the SSN issue$$$$$$$$$$$$$
    "Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18

    Guns Save Lives. Paramedics Save Lives. But...
    Paramedics With Guns Scare People!

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    $$$$$ is something everyone understands -- especially if it is outgoing.

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    This is open and shut. The government entity not only violated his rights, but also Georgia state law. I hope he gets enough money from the suit for a chauffeured limo for the rest of his life.

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    He should get enough for both.

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    Would a march/demonstration be helpful? What was the experience in Virginia ad Pennsylvania? I live near enough to Atlanta to participate.

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    Well it's good to know that all those fired drug enforcement officers found
    gainfull employment breaking laws on MARTA now.

    Did they grab him on the other side of the turnstile after they took his money?
    Could also be breach of contract if they took his money then didn't let him take
    the train.

    I used to mess with the DC subway by leaving through the handicap exit,
    and then entering normal with the card. It couldn't comprehend entering
    because the card never exited. At least once a month the card reader would
    just give it up and reject my valid card.





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    SlackwareRobert wrote:

    "I used to mess with the DC subway by leaving through the handicap exit,
    and then entering normal with the card. It couldn't comprehend entering
    because the card never exited. At least once a month the card reader would
    just give it up and reject my valid card."



    And the purpose of this behavior?











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    HariCarry wrote:
    SlackwareRobert wrote:

    "I used to mess with the DC subway by leaving through the handicap exit,
    and then entering normal with the card.* It couldn't comprehend entering
    because the card never exited.* At least once a month the card reader would
    just give it up and reject my valid card."

    *

    And the purpose of this behavior?

    Because it is cool to mess with the system. One should always be looking for the angles
    *







    *

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    Don't fuss when the system uses CLEO 229 to 'mess' back.

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    SlackwareRobert wrote:
    I used to mess with the DC subway by leaving through the handicap exit,
    and then entering normal with the card. It couldn't comprehend entering
    because the card never exited. At least once a month the card reader would
    just give it up and reject my valid card.
    weird - I have always alternated between the normal DC Metro Train entrance and exit gates - which ever was open - and never had a problem. At least in nteh modern era, the paper ticket or SmarTip card does not distringuish.

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    ATLANTA (MyFOX ATLANTA) - A pro-gun organization took aim at MARTA Saturday. The group and one of its members said transit police stopped him unlawfully when they realized he had a gun inside a train station.

    Gun laws have come under scrutiny in recent weeks. On Thursday, a federal appeals court upheld a judge's decision to toss a lawsuit seeking to allow licensed gun owners to carry weapons in parts of the world's busiest airport.

    The decision prompted gun rights advocates to renew their push for a legislative remedy to the court battle.

    U.S. District Judge Marvin Shoob had dismissed the lawsuit last year on grounds that GeorgiaCarry.org failed to prove that a new Georgia law would allow weapons into unsecured areas of Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport. A three-judge panel of the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals issued a two-page decision that found an appeal of that ruling was "meritless."

    The legal feud erupted when a new state law took effect in July that allows people with gun permits to carry guns into restaurants and state parks and on public transportation.

    Atlanta officials quickly declared the airport a "gun-free zone" and warned that anyone carrying a gun there would be arrested. GeorgiaCarry.org sued the city and the airport, claiming the airport qualifies as public transportation under the new state law.

    The law's supporters said they would resume exploring other legal options, but signaled the fight will likely shift to the Georgia Legislature.

    Gun rights advocates argued that the Legislature intended the law to allow residents with permits to take their guns into airport terminals, parking lots and other unsecured areas.

    In a 14-page ruling, Shoob sharply rejected the gun group's claims. The ordinary definition of "public transportation" does not include airports, he wrote, and there's no clear evidence that Georgia legislators intended the law to apply to airports.

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    That's why in every law that comes out, you have to SPELL OUT/DEFINE EVERYTHING POSSIBLE in simple, clear and unambiguous language since common sense isn't common anymore, and you have to explain the simple/obvious to way too many people nowadays...ESPECIALLY "the authorities" who are supposed to KNOW better.

    Close the "loopholes" and remove any gray areas the anti-gun people (or the simply ignorant) use to continue their PC liberal anti-gun agenda.

    In this case, "airports" needed to be included...give no room for other "interpretations."

    -- John D.


    (formerly of Colorado Springs, CO)

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    Doug Huffman wrote:
    ATLANTA (MyFOX ATLANTA) - A pro-gun organization took aim at MARTA Saturday. The group and one of its members said transit police stopped him unlawfully when they realized he had a gun inside a train station.

    Gun laws have come under scrutiny in recent weeks. On Thursday, a federal appeals court upheld a judge's decision to toss a lawsuit seeking to allow licensed gun owners to carry weapons in parts of the world's busiest airport.

    The decision prompted gun rights advocates to renew their push for a legislative remedy to the court battle.

    U.S. District Judge Marvin Shoob had dismissed the lawsuit last year on grounds that GeorgiaCarry.org failed to prove that a new Georgia law would allow weapons into unsecured areas of Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport. A three-judge panel of the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals issued a two-page decision that found an appeal of that ruling was "meritless."

    The legal feud erupted when a new state law took effect in July that allows people with gun permits to carry guns into restaurants and state parks and on public transportation.

    Atlanta officials quickly declared the airport a "gun-free zone" and warned that anyone carrying a gun there would be arrested. GeorgiaCarry.org sued the city and the airport, claiming the airport qualifies as public transportation under the new state law.

    The law's supporters said they would resume exploring other legal options, but signaled the fight will likely shift to the Georgia Legislature.

    Gun rights advocates argued that the Legislature intended the law to allow residents with permits to take their guns into airport terminals, parking lots and other unsecured areas.

    In a 14-page ruling, Shoob sharply rejected the gun group's claims. The ordinary definition of "public transportation" does not include airports, he wrote, and there's no clear evidence that Georgia legislators intended the law to apply to airports.
    The video is different from the typed text.

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    baseballguy2001 wrote:
    This is open and shut. The government entity not only violated his rights, but also Georgia state law. I hope he gets enough money from the suit for a chauffeured limo for the rest of his life.
    Marta denies everything and claims the right to stop anybody seen with a firearm.

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    Anybody know how the case with this is going?
    I was recently stopped under similar conditions for sloppily CCing, and am eagerly awaiting a ruling from a federal court on whether simple knowledge of a CCed weapon is RAS.


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    cynicist wrote:
    Anybody know how the case with this is going?
    I was recently stopped under similar conditions for sloppily CCing, and am eagerly awaiting a ruling from a federal court on whether simple knowledge of a CCed weapon is RAS.
    This case is in discovery. Motions have been filed pertaining to the violation of the Privacy Act (over demanding his social security number), but no motions or trial has been conducted on the Fourth Amendment issue yet.

    You may want to read this federal court order in another recent Georgia case, however. Please note it plainly states that open Mexican carry is not illegal and does not constitute probable cause or arguable probable cause (although the opinion goes on to state that "manipulating" the gun can constitute arguable probable cause, but not probable cause, for disorderly conduct and thereby shield the officers from the lawsuit). http://www.georgiacarry.org/cms/2009...enies-damages/

    And then you should review the federal cases cited in this GPDO thread.

    http://www.georgiapacking.org/forum/...pic.php?t=6332

    They are from several jurisdictions and address the issue you raised.



    Also, see this consent order entered in a federal case in Georgia.

    http://www.georgiacarry.org/cms/2008...a-gun-lawsuit/ It cites much of the same case law as that thread.

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    Marta is now trying to say that they are not a 'Governmental Agency'; because, they do not recieve Tax Dollars in the same way as do most other Mass Transit Agencies throughout the Country.

    However, as decided under MetropolitanAtlanta Regional Transportational Authority v. Boswell 261 Ga. 427 (1991) The Georgia Supreme Court concluded that MARTA is a 'Governmental Istrumentality'. MARTA denied these findings, but they were conclusive against MARTA. However, interestingly,MARTA argued under its appelate brief, before the same Court,that it was a 'Governmental Agency' established under The Georgia General Assembly to work...[with an agency of the Local Government]... [an Agent of The City of Atlanta and neighboring DeKalb County]... for the purposes of securing 'Governmental Immunity' for its own functions.

    It seem to me that MARTA only wants to get what it wants..., but when it is wrong they turn back ON THEIR OWN WORDS... to try to get out of things.

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    It seems to me the MARTA is a rogue agency that thinks it can do as it pleases. I hope there is a judicial smack down in the near future.

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    aadvark wrote:
    Marta is now trying to say that they are not a 'Governmental Agency'; because, they do not recieve Tax Dollars in the same way as do most other Mass Transit Agencies throughout the Country.
    I would find this very encouraging. Tells me they know without a doubt they can't win on the merits of the case, so they are trying to outlast the resources of the plaintiff.

    Someone should invent a "shot clock" for litigants.

    TFred


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    My favorite ir MARTA claiming that their transit system is SO DANGEROUS, they must stop and detain ANYONE they see with a gun.

    Would think MARTA Police had better things to do than have several officers spend 30 minutes harrassing someone with a permit and go prevent a crime somewhere.



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