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Thread: Open Carry at Jiffy-Lube today

  1. #1
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    This morning I followed my usual procedure of loading up my truck with general stuff; Laptop, tools, shotgun and 10 rounds...but then took a side trip to Jiffy Lube for a very overdue oil change. I transport the shotgun in the back window between the head rests and the glass, with 5 rounds rubber-banded together on the dashboard. As I pulled into their lot, a guy directed me is and had me do the usual pop the hood and answer a few quick questions. As I slid out of the truck, I grabbed my camera and the 5 rounds in one hand, the reached back and took out the shotgun. I followed the service guy into the customer service area where several other people awaited their lube jobs. It got me looked at pretty good. I sat down and kept the shotgun between my legs and fiddled with my camera until the service manager called me up to go over the service program. I grabbed the gun and leaned it against the counter as he methodically went through each line on the computer. When it was done, i returned to my seat again, placing the shotgun against the back wall by the chair. at this point, one service woman said it scared her at first glance as she went through another customers paperwork. A woman next to me said she understood why i wouldn't want to leave it in the truck while they worked on it. When the work was done, I went up and paid the bill, again leaving the shotgun leaned against the counter. I then followed the guy who performed the work out to the truck taking the gun with me, and then he went through all that they had done bit by bit. they then drove the truck out, and I walked out gun in hand, and at that time there was some comments by two of the service persons, but I couldn't through all the noise of that diesel engine. They were smiling though, so I believe it was all positive. I then stuck the gun in its' place in the back window, and mosy'ed off.

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    FARKING WIN! You have given me even more inspiration!

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    State Pioneer ConditionThree's Avatar
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    Man, we really need to get you some accessories.

    1) A window mounted gun rack. (either that, or a locking vertical mount like the po po use.) My concern is that with your firearm nestled between the head rests and the glass, I can see you busting out your rear window if you had a sudden stop or were rearended by someone distracted by your hardware.

    2) A bandolier sling/Stock cuff.Having to carry your ammunition in a wad, wrapped in a rubberband is a little clumsy. Case law has already made it clear that ammo stored this way is not a 12031 violation as it is not in a position to fire.

    3) A shotgun sling. Yes I said it again. If I was inclined to carry a long gun, the only circumstances where it wasnt in my immediate possession and control would be while a 12031 (e) check was being conducted. I dont think I would set it anywhere, even if it was right next to me.

    4) A belt holster. For your 9mm, so you dont have to rely solely on your truck gun.
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    Fun story!!
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

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    nice story, i had been planning on taking the ar 15 out and open carry it but i think that would cause more problems than anything. especially what i am picturing to be a field shotgun, am i correct on that? either way that is awesome, im glad to see people actually open carrying a long gun. BRAVO!

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    Hey! there is no money for more hardware or accessories right now. I do have a sling for it, but it's not quite comfortable in a chair. A sling with ammo pockets would be nice though; If not for anything but when I am on foot. You're right about the glass being a poor backstop, but these new trucks just don't accomodate gun racks anymore. Putting it in the front lacks the same display quality that you get in the back glass. That just says "I still have the right" and "yes, it's legal, and I'm proud to wear it".



    The gun is basic mossberg with the short barrel on.

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    Here's a couple of pics

















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    AyatollahGondola wrote:
    Here's a couple of pics
    Far less threatening than my 870 Express in the synth black, folding stock and sling. . . I don't think I would have gotten away with it. . .

    As for the window gun rack, I would be concerned that it would not qualify for a 626.9 container. Remember, it is against the law for them to see the gun!

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    I believe 626.9 doesn't apply to longuns in transport

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    But only if it is being lawfully transported.

    I have heard of people being arrested for possession of long guns.

    And the knowledge of the law may not prevent someone from being scared and calling the cops.

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    Side Saddle ammo carrier. Case law legal.

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    Theseus wrote:
    But only if it is being lawfully transported.

    I have heard of people being arrested for possession of long guns.

    And the knowledge of the law may not prevent someone from being scared and calling the cops.
    Legally transported?

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    AyatollahGondola wrote:
    Theseus wrote:
    But only if it is being lawfully transported.

    I have heard of people being arrested for possession of long guns.

    And the knowledge of the law may not prevent someone from being scared and calling the cops.
    Legally transported?
    Yeah, one of those things like...if you are actually going to a place to shoot...

    The case I knew of was a guy that had been kicked out of his house by his wife. He was then sleeping in his truck with his shotguns, I believe the shotgun was in the bed of his truck. He was arrested and cited because he was not transporting.

    If you cease to be transporting you will be subject to 626.9 BUT IANAL!

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    Theseus wrote:
    If you cease to be transporting you will be subject to 626.9 BUT IANAL!
    626.9 does not apply to long guns - at all... ever. You don't have to meet any 'transporting' exemption since the statute doesn't apply in the first place.

    I'd be interested to hear exactly how your friend was cited, and if he fought it or not.
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    I know some people have "determined" that 626.9 does not include long guns, but I disagree.

    It specifically states


    626.9(b) Any person who possesses a firearm in a place that the person knows, or reasonably should know, is a school zone, as defined in paragraph (1) of subdivision (e), unless it is with the written permission of the school district superintendent, his or her designee, or equivalent school authority, shall be punished as specified in subdivision (f).



    (e) As used in this section, the following definitions shall apply:

    (2) "Firearm" has the same meaning as that term is given in Section 12001.

    12001(b) As used in this title, "firearm" means any device, designed to be used as a weapon, from which is expelled through a barrel, a projectile by the force of any explosion or other form of combustion.
    It clearly states the intent to include all firearms, not only ones capable of being concealed.

    Some people have read this and concluded it doesn't effect 626.9:


    (2) When the firearm is an unloaded pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed on the person and is in a locked container or within the locked trunk of a motor vehicle.

    This section does not prohibit or limit the otherwise lawful transportation of any other firearm, other than a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed on the person, in accordance with state law.


    I disagree. This only exempts long guns if they are otherwise legally transported.


    IANAL, but to believe that 626.9 does not regulate long guns as well is not advisable. It is clearly illegal to possess long guns in a school zone UNLESS it is being legally transported, an exemption not given to handguns or firearms capable of being concealed.

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    But then 626.9 doesn't apply on private property which Jiffy Lube is.



    +1 for shotgun carry:



    photo by oleg volk:

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    We aren't talking about private property, I was arguing about if he were to use a gun rack and what that might mean for 626.9.

    I myself didn't think about the transportation exemption for long guns. . . I think I might install a vertical shotgun holder so that when OC I can simply ALWAYS lock the handgun when going place to place and not having to worry about school zones...

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    so the question is "is open carrying / driving / walking" transporting?

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    So lets think. . . what defines "transporting" and what PC's restrict how a firearm can and can not be "transported" and for what purposes?

    From my understanding the real limitations are always on handguns. By making 626.9 exempt long guns while being otherwise legally "transported" it leaves us a wide range of berth.

    The argument might be made that whenever the shotgun is in the car and not removed it is in a constant state of being "transported".

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    Theseus wrote:
    This section does not prohibit or limit the otherwise lawful transportation of any other firearm, other than a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed on the person, in accordance with state law.
    I disagree. This only exempts long guns if they are otherwise legally transported.
    Look at this without the confusion of the rest of the statute cluttering the scene.

    "...otherwise lawful transportation..." simply means you aren't violating any other statutes, such as 12031.

    So, I was incorrect when I said 626.9 "never" applies to long guns. It would apply if (and only if) you were to violate any other law with a long gun while in a 'gun free school zone."

    As for the 'stay in motion or you're no longer transporting' argument... give me a break! Imagine if that were applied to all the 'transportation' exemptions for 12025. You'd be committing a misdemeanor by stopping at a stop light.

    (We've had this discussion on this forum before, and we're on the verge of threadjacking. If you want to discuss this further, I ask that you post a new thread. I'd be glad to pound sense into you elsewhere. )
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    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter bigtoe416's Avatar
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    Theseus makes an interesting point. The law does say that 626.9 applies to "firearms" and that it doesn't apply to unconcealable firearms being lawfully transported. So if I'm walking past a school with a long gun, that wouldn't fall under 626.9 since I'm transporting it. Same goes for all other forms of transportation.

    But what if I'm walking across the state and I get tired and need to take a break? I stop within 1000' of a school and eat some food and give my legs a rest. At this point am I violating 626.9? One could argue it either way; I'm not in motion so I'm not transporting the long gun, but I'm also still in the process of making a long journey, so I am still transporting it to my final destination.

    Another interesting point is that the law doesn't say what path we must take to qualify as transporting, nor does it say if we even have to be going anywhere. An extreme example of this is transporting a long gun one foot away from my current location. The law doesn't say I can't walk around the block to get there. The law also doesn't say that we can't get lost or give up and return to where we started, nor does it say we can't stop for gas, stop because we are tired, or any other reason. I believe this allows us ample room to dodge the requirement that we must be transporting in order to avoid 626.9.

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    bigtoe416 wrote:
    But what if I'm walking across the state and I get tired and need to take a break? I stop within 1000' of a school and eat some food and give my legs a rest. At this point am I violating 626.9? One could argue it either way; I'm not in motion so I'm not transporting the long gun, but I'm also still in the process of making a long journey, so I am still transporting it to my final destination.
    If you accept that interpretation of transporting, just make sure you don't park on the street. Private property is exempt from 626.9.

    The statute doesn't state that you have to be going directly to or directly from any place, so you can walk circles around the school if you want. So long as you aren't violating any other law, 626.9 doesn't apply to transportation of long guns.
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    CA_Libertarian wrote:
    Look at this without the confusion of the rest of the statute cluttering the scene.

    "...otherwise lawful transportation..." simply means you aren't violating any other statutes, such as 12031.

    So, I was incorrect when I said 626.9 "never" applies to long guns. It would apply if (and only if) you were to violate any other law with a long gun while in a 'gun free school zone."

    As for the 'stay in motion or you're no longer transporting' argument... give me a break! Imagine if that were applied to all the 'transportation' exemptions for 12025. You'd be committing a misdemeanor by stopping at a stop light.

    (We've had this discussion on this forum before, and we're on the verge of threadjacking. If you want to discuss this further, I ask that you post a new thread. I'd be glad to pound sense into you elsewhere. )
    :shock: Lets just hope it is the only thing you "pound"! Haha! Yeah! I went there. . .

    Seriously though, I am learning quite quickly that these punks will use every unreasonable argument and hang on the definition of every word in their pursuit to get you with something.

    I myself would think that a shotgun rack like in a cops car and a locker for my pistol. That way I would always be within the law without a means to defend myself.

    As for thread jacking. . . I thought it was prudent, but this is the last I will say on it.

    My DA is trying to get case law that would make private property exemption only applicable to the OWNER of the property as in 12025/12026.

  24. #24
    Regular Member demnogis's Avatar
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    If your DA is successful that means if you rent property you cannot OC on the property, nor possess a firearm that could be concealed on the property if within the magical 1500' "school zone" because you're renting... not owning the property.

    Essentially you would have to keep your firearms in a perpetual non-functioning state, or locked up.

    With all of these changes coming to the penal codes applied to possessing a firearm [PC §626.9, PC §12025 & PC §12026], we need to get on the defensive and strike down these changes; possibly getting the help of the NRA-ILA, Calguns, GOA, etc. These changes will negatively effect ownership and possession, directly infringing on our 2A rights. Legislators and whacko anti-rights activists need to learn that passing more laws outlawing an otherwise lawful act only creates more criminals, instead of preventing crime.

    But IMHO The cities and counties want more and more laws passed to create more crimes, to which they can get more revenue. They operate as a business always seeking more streams of income, and they have the power to pass laws enforcing those revenue streams.

    Theseus wrote:
    :shock: Lets just hope it is the only thing you "pound"! Haha! Yeah! I went there. . .

    Seriously though, I am learning quite quickly that these punks will use every unreasonable argument and hang on the definition of every word in their pursuit to get you with something.

    I myself would think that a shotgun rack like in a cops car and a locker for my pistol. That way I would always be within the law without a means to defend myself.

    As for thread jacking. . . I thought it was prudent, but this is the last I will say on it.

    My DA is trying to get case law that would make private property exemption only applicable to the OWNER of the property as in 12025/12026.
    Gun control isn't about guns -- it is about control.

  25. #25
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    demnogis wrote:
    If your DA is successful that means if you rent property you cannot OC on the property, nor possess a firearm that could be concealed on the property if within the magical 1500' "school zone" because you're renting... not owning the property.
    Uhm... minor correction-that's 1,000 feet, not 1,500 feet.
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    CL SUBJ IN COMPLIANCE WITH LAW


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