Ten including shooter killed

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acrimsontide wrote:

suntzu wrote:

acrimsontide wrote:

suntzu wrote:

and the gun grabbers will use this tragedy, stepping on top of the bodies of the dead even as they do so, in order to push their agenda of more gun control--and in particular another "AWB"...and it just cuts against my grain to even use the term "assault weapon" when speaking of a semi-auto rifle...

police carry "Assault weapons", because they are select fire weapons..why not ban their "assault weapons" and put them on a level playing field with other people and leave the citizens alone and put them to using the same semi-auto rifles we have access to....

citizens do not own "assault weapons"--citizens own SEMI-AUTO rifles and handguns....there IS a difference....

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You really have something against LEOs don't you?

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actually, while it may sound I do--no I don't. I simply get sick and tired of the semi-auto rifles that the average citizen has access to being equated in the same breath with the select-fire weapons that the police use. The average, every day person does not own an "assault weapon". People should get their facts straight before intentionally trying to inflame the public against the Second Amendment.

I'm just don't like abuse of power, and never have. But personally--no, I have nothing against law enforcement. The only thing I have a problem with is when they abuse and mistreat the people and then hide behind a wall of silence and seek to cover it up--abuse is something everyone should have a problem with.

There are good police officers, I have never said otherwise--but the bad ones make it impossible to trust any of them. This is a sad truth in our world today.

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While I agree that there are some bad LEOs,(I have seen several myself who acted as if they were tougher than Navy Seals) most LEOs are just trying to do a difficult job. When I run into one of them who act as if they are above the rest of the world, I try to remember that there are good and bad school teachers, good and bad store clerks, good and bad sales people, well you get the idea. The people in LE are the same as other professions, there are good and bad people in all walks of life.

As for the "assault rifle" tag, I agree, most civilian do not own them. Most civilians on semi auto look alikes to assault rifles, not the real thing. I do not agree with the thinking that LEOs should not have them as they have many more opportunities to face danger than most of us, or should I say their odds are better of them having to face danger. For my, and most civilian, needs, the semis that we have are sufficient....besides with todays price of ammo many of us couldn't afford to shoot full autos anyway!!!! LOL

As for not trusting LEOs, when troubles do arise, we seem to trust them enough to call 911.

And for the record, I am not LEO

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While I understand what you are saying--there are fundamental differences between law enforcement and school teachers, janitors, and so on.

The biggest fundamental difference is this--the general public has not been known to shoot the general public and then toss down a knife, or plant narcotics on a person.

The general public could not beat the living :cussut of you and then claim you "resisted arrest"...

So while I understand your point--there is a major difference.

NOW, as for the "Assault rifle" thing. I made the statement that if the government wants to ban "assault rifles" then why not ban the REAL "assault rifle" and forbid the police from having them and make them resort to the semi-auto rifles that we have access too.....And I stand behind that 100%

You seem to think that law enforcement faces more threats than joe average citizen...I would bring up Virginia Tech, and this recent shooting in Alabama as but two examples to demonstrate to you that anytime violence happens--it happens to the average ordinary, every day person walking down the street, or into your local retailer, or into your local university...
The citizens are always the people on the front line when violence occurs--law enforcement is only reactionary, showing up after the violence is already over.

So I disagree that law enforcement has a job that is inherently dangerous, because it isn't. Everyone just wishes you to believe so.

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suntzu wrote:

So I disagree that law enforcement has a job that is inherently dangerous, because it isn't. Everyone just wishes you to believe so.

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I'm sure you are correct. How could anyone think that responding to a domestic violence call, or an armedrobbery, or a bar fight, or making a traffic stop and walking up to a car window not really knowing what you will find, or a drug bust is an inherently dangerous job?

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acrimsontide wrote:

suntzu wrote:

So I disagree that law enforcement has a job that is inherently dangerous, because it isn't. Everyone just wishes you to believe so.

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I'm sure you are correct. How could anyone think that responding to a domestic violence call, or an armedrobbery, or a bar fight, or making a traffic stop and walking up to a car window not really knowing what you will find, or a drug bust is an inherently dangerous job?

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I stand by what I said.

So here goes. Take the number of law enforcement killed since 2001 and then compare it with the number of American soldiers, and Marines killed in Iraq during the same time. THEN take the number of police wounded or injured in the line of duty and compare it with the number of American military who has been wounded in Iraq during the same time period.

Being a law enforcement officer is no more a dangerous job than working high rise construction. Law enforcement is no more a dangerous job than working in a coal mine.
Law enforcement is no more a dangerous job than working in the majority of other jobs in this country--firefighting, wilderness fire fighting, heavy equipment operating, construction, being a bouncer in a bar, working as a body guard, being a nurse in a hospital who faces the dangers associated with being constantly around those who may be carrying infectious disease, or working around the manufacturing of fireworks, or working in demolitions, and in any number of other occupations, including simply getting behind the wheel of your car to go to work in the morning--especially in a major city.

Yes they face dangers on the job--but no, the dangers they face are not any more of a serious threat than those faced by a soldier, or a fire fighter who rushes into burning buildings, or any number of other occupations.

I'm not anti-law enforcement, but I don't think they are not special simply because of work they do, and their job is no more dangerous than mine--most people are just lead to believe that they have one of the more dangerous jobs in society--and they don't.

Now can we get this thread back on topic please.

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acrimsontide wrote:

As for not trusting LEOs, when troubles do arise, we seem to trust them enough to call 911.

And for the record, I am not LEO

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I trust my acquaintances at the local PD in my town.

I'd call 911 so someone can come by to collect the body whether alive/cuffed or dead/cuffed. There is also the chance I might be wounded, so having an EMT take a look at my person is a good idea.

There is a chance the criminal might burst in to a ball a flames... you never know... best have the fire department there as well.

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My first reaction when there is a problem is to handle it myself. When I hear a noise outside the house at night, I grab my weapon and a flashlight and check it out.

Last time I called 911, it was because a driver was acting strangely. The guy came flying down west Lakeshore drive at 90mph plus, lost control, crossed over the median, went into the woods on the other side, came back out, jumped the median again and kept on going. Traffic was backed up at the traffic light so he had to stop, when he did he got out and started beating himself in the head and shouting and running around. By the time I explained where we were to 911, he was back in his car, the light had turned green and we were on our way. I could even see a patrol car sitting at the cross street waiting to turn. I got my permit shortly after. Police are there to keep the honest people honest. You have to handle problems yourself.

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suntzu wrote:

Now can we get this thread back on topic please.

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To each his own and yes, you can have your thread back.

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HNN reported it was an M-16.

Not one report revealing it was an non-assault weapon in the hands of a
citizen that stopped the rampage.:banghead:

If the non-assult weapons are banned he wouldn't have been stopped,
or stopped after more danger to others.

Why can't we have an Amber alert messging to gun owners, that
way when a nut is in your area, you get a text message to look out for him.

Course I would have to use a throw away phone for this service to avoid
back door gun registration.

This is a tragedy, we do not need to make it worse by compounding the
problems of the gun grabbers agenda.