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Thread: A thought and a question

  1. #1
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    I've been reading extensively (the pamphlets, forms, laws etc) on califoriniaopencarry.org and have one question. I may be visiting california this summer and would like to UOC. Do I have to register the pistol prior to UOC or is it not required.

    While thinking about UOC and trying to minimize the time required to get a round in battery in the shortest amount of time if necessary I had a thought. Here in VA, I OC and use a Blackhawk Serpa holster. With this holster, with my HK USP, I am able to carry the pistol with the slide locked back, while locked in the holster. There are some disadvantages to this (catching your arm on the sharp points of the slide is one), but the advantage is a quicker load, and easier for the LEO to verify unloaded.



    Thoughts?

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    Regular Member Decoligny's Avatar
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    Reverend73 wrote:
    I've been reading extensively (the pamphlets, forms, laws etc) on califoriniaopencarry.org and have one question. I may be visiting california this summer and would like to UOC. Do I have to register the pistol prior to UOC or is it not required.

    While thinking about UOC and trying to minimize the time required to get a round in battery in the shortest amount of time if necessary I had a thought. Here in VA, I OC and use a Blackhawk Serpa holster. With this holster, with my HK USP, I am able to carry the pistol with the slide locked back, while locked in the holster. There are some disadvantages to this (catching your arm on the sharp points of the slide is one), but the advantage is a quicker load, and easier for the LEO to verify unloaded.



    Thoughts?
    No you do not have to register your firearm here in California as you are only visiting.

    Carrying with the slide locked back is simply advertising, to those who haven't studied the law, that you are carrying an unloaded weapon. I would thing that about 90% of the populationwon't know that it is unloaded if there is an empty magazine in the mag well and the slide is forward. Carrying with the slide locked back defeats any deterrant effect that open carry provides.

    It takes me about 1 - 2 seconds maximum to do the following:draw weapon, drop empty mag, insert mag, rack slide.

  3. #3
    Regular Member demnogis's Avatar
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    Reverend,

    I hope you will enjoy your stay here in CA

    As Decoligny said you do not have to register your firearm in CA. If the police here do stop you to check your firearm and they do run the serial number it should come back with nothing, unless the firearm originated from here or has been reported stolen.

    I would not recommend keeping your firearm holstered with the slide open. It could be quite uncomfortable catching yourself on it, sitting, walking etc. There is no requirement in CA to lock the slide open, but you may if you wish to.

    It is also a good idea to keep an empty magazine in the mag well. If you are stopped an officer may aggressively argue that it gives "the appearance" of being loaded. Assure and reaffirm with them that it is NOT loaded. You don't have to tell them, but they are authorized to inspect it. Appearances are not fact, just assumptions by a third party. If/when they ask "How is someone supposed to know?", let them know that they could always ask.

    They may also try to argue that a violation of PC 12025 (if you have ammunition in a magazine with you), 12026 (if in your vehicle) or 12031 (if you have ammunition in proximity to the firearm). 12031 (g) specifically is an issue, because they may try to argue (with a drop holster) that the magazine is attached to the firearm OR mags on your belt are attached to your holster, attached to your firearm. These are not valid inflammatory points for any detaining LEO to use so long as you follow the law because in 1996 the court ruled in The People v. Clark that for a firearm to be loaded you "must have a round in a position from which it can be fired." In a magazine, not inside the firearm does not meet this qualification.

    If you do get stopped by any LEO expect a lot of brow beating, a lot of argumentative behavior and hostility. Most (NOT ALL) LEOs are not right with the idea of citizens citizens being armed. If the officer just does the 12031 (e) check and lets you on your way, be sure to compliment the officer, thank them for their time and continue about your business. Good, lawful conduct by an officer is to be reinforced!

    What part of CA are you visiting?
    Gun control isn't about guns -- it is about control.

  4. #4
    Regular Member Decoligny's Avatar
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    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum12/8457.html

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum12/11495.html

    Here are two pamphlets, one about Open Carry, and one about whether or not a gun is loaded.

    Read them, read the actual Penal Codes and Case Law that they discuss, and carry them with you when Open Carrying in CA.

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    DO NOT, AND I REPEAT, DO NOT INFORM THE OFFICER HE HAS THE LEGAL RIGHT TO INSPECT YOUR FIREARM.

    If he does not know he can inspect it I would not volunteer that information.

    They are not your friend and I would suggest that you try to keep the encounter as short as possible by asking if you are being detained. Don't show ID, don't volunteer your gun and keep asking if you are free to go. As soon as they say you are get out of town.

  6. #6
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    Other draw-backs of carrying with the slide locked open:

    • When drawing, you are much more likely to snag on clothing, etc.
    • You're leaving your breach open to foreign objects, which may cause a jam in the rare instance you need to load.
    I think it's far more prudent to just improve your loading time through practice.
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  7. #7
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    Let me be clear, I do not carry with the slide locked open. I carry fully loaded here in VA:P I was just thinking to myself about how the best way to UOC would be and the thought crossed my mind. I agree with all the disadvantages posted. I will not be carrying like that in California.



    If I come I will be up near Monterey. I'd actually be stationed there, but my residency will be maintained in FL. I'm not sure if I'll have to register the guns I have or not, I'll have to investigate that. Thanks for all the helpful information, it is much appreciated.

  8. #8
    Regular Member Decoligny's Avatar
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    Reverend73 wrote:
    Let me be clear, I do not carry with the slide locked open. I carry fully loaded here in VA:P I was just thinking to myself about how the best way to UOC would be and the thought crossed my mind. I agree with all the disadvantages posted. I will not be carrying like that in California.



    If I come I will be up near Monterey. I'd actually be stationed there, but my residency will be maintained in FL. I'm not sure if I'll have to register the guns I have or not, I'll have to investigate that. Thanks for all the helpful information, it is much appreciated.
    If you are Military, and being stationed in California, you are exempt from the personal importer rule, and as such you do not need to register any handguns.

    Thing to know about handguns in CA:

    1. No threaded barrels - this makes the handgun an "Assault Weapon" under CA law.

    2. No magazines that will hold more than 10 rounds.

    Things to know about "Evil Black Rifles" (EBR) in CA:

    1.If you are going to bring in any long guns that fall into the CA definition of "Assault Weapons" you need to be sure that you get a Military "Assault Weapon" permit from DOJ before you bring those particular weapons into the state.

    2. Check out CalGuns.net for more information on "Assualt Weapons".

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