Federal "judge" overturns National Park guns rule

utbagpiper · Mar 19, 2009

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This is posted on the national forum at < http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum4/23320.html >. But have so many square miles of national parks here in Utah it is important to be aware and avoid becoming a criminal.

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=5904550

Court blocks rule allowing guns in national parks March 19th, 2009 @ 7:24pm By MATTHEW DALY, AP Writer WASHINGTON (AP) -- A federal judge has blocked a federal rule allowing people to carry concealed, loaded guns in national parks and wildlife refuges.
A decision issued Thursday by [Clinton appointed] U.S. District Judge Colleen Kollar-Kotelly overturns a rule issued in the waning days of the Bush administration.
The rule took effect Jan. 11 and allowed visitors to carry a loaded gun into a park or wildlife refuge as long as the person has a permit for a concealed weapon and the state where the park or refuge is located allows concealed firearms. Previously, guns in parks had been severely restricted.
The Obama administration had said it was reviewing the Bush rule but had defended it in court.

JoeSparky · Mar 19, 2009

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utbagpiper wrote:

This is posted on the national forum at < http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum4/23320.html >. But have so many square miles of national parks here in Utah it is important to be aware and avoid becoming a criminal.

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=5904550

Court blocks rule allowing guns in national parks March 19th, 2009 @ 7:24pm By MATTHEW DALY, AP Writer WASHINGTON (AP) -- A federal judge has blocked a federal rule allowing people to carry concealed, loaded guns in national parks and wildlife refuges.
A decision issued Thursday by [Clinton appointed] U.S. District Judge Colleen Kollar-Kotelly overturns a rule issued in the waning days of the Bush administration.
The rule took effect Jan. 11 and allowed visitors to carry a loaded gun into a park or wildlife refuge as long as the person has a permit for a concealed weapon and the state where the park or refuge is located allows concealed firearms. Previously, guns in parks had been severely restricted.
The Obama administration had said it was reviewing the Bush rule but had defended it in court.

So does this affect us in UTAH being a Federal DISTRICT court in Washington DC?

KBCraig · Mar 19, 2009

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JoeSparky wrote:

So does this affect us in UTAH being a Federal DISTRICT court in Washington DC?

The U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia rules for the entire federal government.

JoeSparky · Mar 19, 2009

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KBCraig wrote:

JoeSparky wrote:

So does this affect us in UTAH being a Federal DISTRICT court in Washington DC?

Click to expand...

The U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia rules for the entire federal government.

OUCH until we prevail.

fedup · Mar 19, 2009

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JoeSparky wrote:

KBCraig wrote:

JoeSparky wrote:

So does this affect us in UTAH being a Federal DISTRICT court in Washington DC?

Click to expand...

The U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia rules for the entire federal government.

Click to expand...

OUCH until we prevail.

are you planning something?

Citizen · Mar 19, 2009

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fedup wrote:

JoeSparky wrote:

KBCraig wrote:

JoeSparky wrote:

So does this affect us in UTAH being a Federal DISTRICT court in Washington DC?

Click to expand...

The U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia rules for the entire federal government.

Click to expand...

OUCH until we prevail.

Click to expand...

are you planning something?

I'm suresome legal counter-action mustalready in the works. This isn't something the pro-gun side is going to let go unchallenged.

utbagpiper · Mar 19, 2009

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Citizen wrote:

I'm suresome legal counter-action mustalready in the works. This isn't something the pro-gun side is going to let go unchallenged.

Not sure how the pro-gun side does anything unless they have managed to become parties to the suit. It is the feds who were defending the rule change.

Any bets on whether an Obama led Justice Department will appeal this to the current SCOTUS?

JoeSparky · Mar 19, 2009

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utbagpiper wrote:

Citizen wrote:

I'm suresome legal counter-action mustalready in the works. This isn't something the pro-gun side is going to let go unchallenged.

Click to expand...

Not sure how the pro-gun side does anything unless they have managed to become parties to the suit. It is the feds who were defending the rule change.

Any bets on whether an Obama led Justice Department will appeal this to the current SCOTUS?

How about "friend of the court AMICUS briefs?"

Not that I know how to do this.... OH, MIKE.......

utbagpiper · Mar 19, 2009

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JoeSparky wrote:

How about "friend of the court AMICUS briefs?"

Not that I know how to do this.... OH, MIKE.......

The amicus brief can only be used when there is an actual case before the court. As of now, there is not a case. Unless the feds (or some other party to the suit) appeal, there will be no case.

That is the problem.

UTOC-45-44 · Mar 31, 2009

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utbagpiper wrote:

This is posted on the national forum at < http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum4/23320.html >. But have so many square miles of national parks here in Utah it is important to be aware and avoid becoming a criminal.

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=5904550

Court blocks rule allowing guns in national parks March 19th, 2009 @ 7:24pm By MATTHEW DALY, AP Writer WASHINGTON (AP) -- A federal judge has blocked a federal rule allowing people to carry concealed, loaded guns in national parks and wildlife refuges.
A decision issued Thursday by [Clinton appointed] U.S. District Judge Colleen Kollar-Kotelly overturns a rule issued in the waning days of the Bush administration.
The rule took effect Jan. 11 and allowed visitors to carry a loaded gun into a park or wildlife refuge as long as the person has a permit for a concealed weapon and the state where the park or refuge is located allows concealed firearms. Previously, guns in parks had been severely restricted.
The Obama administration had said it was reviewing the Bush rule but had defended it in court.

So what you are saying is that as of RIGHT now.. IF I wanted to go to Zion's as a Permit holder I am violating Federal Rule?

I CANNOT as a Permit Holder carry in the National Park?

So when I drove to Az I drove thru a patch of Zion's I was in Violation of the Rule that just a few days ago was in OUR "favor"?

So we are back to where we were. Nothing different?

TJ

thx997303 · Mar 31, 2009

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it sure appears that way.

Kevin Jensen · Apr 7, 2009

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http://www.newwest.net/topic/article/crapo_introduces_bill_to_codify_national_park_gun_rule/C41/L41/

Crapo Introduces Bill to Codify National Park Gun Rule

Gun politics is getting very interesting. Will Congress record a vote on guns in national parks? Will the President sign it?

By Bill Schneider, 4-04-09

A lot of people might wonder why and how the national parks became a Second Amendment battleground, but nobody really thinks the war will end anytime soon. Now, Congress has decided to make sure the fight goes on.

On January 9, a Bush administration rule to allow loaded and concealed firearms in national parks and wildlife refuges went into effect, but the Brady Campaign and National Parks and Conservation Association sued to overturn it, successfully. On March 19, U.S. District Judge Colleen Kollar-Kotelly of Washington, D.C. granted the plaintiffs an injunction to prevent the Department of the Interior from implementing the rule. One day later, the National Rifle Association (NRA) appealed, but the judge has not ruled on the appeal.

Now, on April 2, Senator Mike Crapo (R-ID) introduced a bill (S.816) to codify the Bush administration rule to, according to a NRA alert, “restore the Second Amendment rights of visitors in national parks and wildlife refuges.”

Crapo’s bill is identical to H.R. 1684 introduced on March 24 in the U.S. House of Representatives by Congressman Doc Hastings (R-WA).

At least in the Senate, the national park gun rule is breaking down party lines. Crapo has four co-sponsors for his bill, including Montana’s Democratic senators Max Baucus and Jon Tester and Arkansas Democrat Blanche Lincoln, along with Utah Republican Bob Bennett. Hasting has 14 co-sponsors for his bill, all Republican.

Politically, this could get very interesting. The NRA has decided to make the national park rule a priority, and the Brady Campaign has decided to make stopping it a priority.

With Attorney General Eric Holder trying to get Congress to approve a so-called assault weapons ban and President Obama full of stingers from gun owners who claim he plans to renege on his campaign promises, what happens if Congress sends the national park gun rule bill to the White House? Will the President sign it?

Also, this bill will do exactly what many members of Congress, especially Democrats, are in a panic to avoid, making a recordable vote on a gun issue that’s sure to be a headliner in their next campaign.

JoeSparky · Apr 18, 2009

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And the interior dept is on the record as NOT appealing the injuction.

Why am I not suprised!:cuss::cuss::cuss::banghead::banghead::banghead:

Kevin Jensen · Apr 23, 2009

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http://www.nytimes.com/gwire/2009/04/23/23greenwire-western-republicans-mull-options-for-concealed-10642.html

House and Senate bills would codify a Bush-era rule to allow visitors to carry concealed firearms into national parks and wildlife refuges in states with concealed carry laws. A federal judge blocked the rule last month, siding with anti-gun and conservation groups that argued Interior failed to conduct an environmental assessment as required under the National Environmental Policy Act.

"This is not an environmental issue, this is a civil rights issue," said Rep. Rob Bishop (R-Utah), one of the co-sponsors of the House bill, H.R. 1684. "The Constitution trumps NEPA. Period."

JoeSparky · Apr 23, 2009

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SGT Jensen wrote:

http://www.nytimes.com/gwire/2009/04/23/23greenwire-western-republicans-mull-options-for-concealed-10642.html

House and Senate bills would codify a Bush-era rule to allow visitors to carry concealed firearms into national parks and wildlife refuges in states with concealed carry laws. A federal judge blocked the rule last month, siding with anti-gun and conservation groups that argued Interior failed to conduct an environmental assessment as required under the National Environmental Policy Act.

"This is not an environmental issue, this is a civil rights issue," said Rep. Rob Bishop (R-Utah), one of the co-sponsors of the House bill, H.R. 1684. "The Constitution trumps NEPA. Period."

Click to expand...

Since DOI has asked the the judge and she has aggreed to delay a final ruling until the Environmental assessment is complete, could the DOI just FAIL TO SCHEDULE OR NEVER DO THE ASSESSMENT and thereby have this legal entanglement just grow dust and NEVER RETURN TO US OUR RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS in the NATIONAL PARK SYSTEM?

LovesHisXD45 · May 23, 2009

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I thought I would give an update on this one..

Here is some good news.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2257136/posts

.......
"The credit-card bill was passed with an amendment that will allow people to carry loaded concealed weapons into national parks and wildlife refuges. Mr. Obama didn't mention the provision when trumpeting the merits of the new credit-card restrictions." .....

old dog · May 25, 2009

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Freedom - 1
Judge - 0

UTOC-45-44 · May 25, 2009

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LovesHisXD45 wrote:

I thought I would give an update on this one.. Here is some good news.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2257136/posts

.......
"The credit-card bill was passed with an amendment that will allow people to carry loaded concealed weapons into national parks and wildlife refuges. Mr. Obama didn't mention the provision when trumpeting the merits of the new credit-card restrictions." .....

I have failed to understand what date this is going into effect. Is from the day that it was signed ? If so......AWESOME!!!:celebrate

JoeSparky · May 25, 2009

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The Credit card reform bill stipulates that the bill and ALL amendments which do not state otherwise will be effective in Feb 2010.

The Firearm amendment DID NOT specify a different effective date so.....

We will have to wait until Late February 2010 to be able to LEGALLY exercise OUR 2nd amendment protected rights in National Parks or other areas managed by the NPS/DOI.

The delay frustrates me tooooooo!

UTOC-45-44 · May 25, 2009

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JoeSparky wrote:

The Credit card reform bill stipulates that the bill and ALL amendments which do not state otherwise will be effective in Feb 2010.

The Firearm amendment DID NOT specify a different effective date so.....

We will have to wait until Late February 2010 to be able to LEGALLY exercise OUR 2nd amendment protected rights in National Parks or other areas managed by the NPS/DOI.

The delay frustrates me tooooooo!

Can you direct me where you got the Date-info from so that I can read about it?

Please?

Federal "judge" overturns National Park guns rule

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