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Thread: (Off-Topic) Need advice.

  1. #1
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    So I've finally assembled some gun $$, need to buy something. All 3 of these I intend to eventually buy, so it's really a matter of what to get first! (I won't be able to buy again for at least 6 months to a year. bought a house, and that's expensive).

    Choice 1: CMMG AR-15, the works upper+lower about $1000 (I've done the research).

    Choice 2: Remington 11-87 Police or 870, specced, $600-850

    Choice 3: Concealed carry piece to complement my Glock 17, $300-750 (thinking Ruger LCP, Walther PPK/s)

    I'm leaning toward the first two, because I really want something for home defense.

    Things to consider: Cost/availability of ammunition, How fun it is to shoot. Other things too, just don't feel like listing.

    Thanks for your opinions!

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    What gun you should get in what order is up to you, but my advice on shotguns is that you get a 870 Express, or a Mossy 500. There is no need to get an auto loader, or to get a brutally tough police 870, unless you plan on butt stroking rioters and generally abusing the hell out of it. Out of the box, with a bead sight and a barrel of 21" or less, the pump action 12 gauge is the most formidable small arm available to us without extra ATFE paperwork. Getting a used one is the route I went, and the route I suggest you take. I got mine for 200 bucks.

    If you want cheap ammo, you need to reload it. And even that is getting harder. Getting a gun for ammo costs, other than a .22, is probably a mistake, unless you are getting a LOT of ammo right up front.

    On the topic of what would be best for HD, I think it depends most on how your house is constructed. There is a huge difference between brick walls and wood walls when it comes to penetration. The very first priority should be not risking hurting others in the process of defending your house.
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    Well, My first level is brick exterior, with wood framed interior. Upper level is wood frame. Aside from windows (obviously) the main floor is better at stopping things than the upper level, though obviously neither is bulletproof.

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    I've seen brick stop a x39 round, but I wouldn't want anything beyond a 9mm/40/45 with drywall, wood studs, plywood, and siding.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

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    Regular Member ISMOID's Avatar
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    Outdoor channel just had a show on Wed @ 7:30 "MidwayUSA's The Best Defense" and they were discussing wall penetration. They used a 9mm, .45ACP, 5.56, and 12g. They setup 5 walls, drywall on both sides, and fired through them to simulate shooting in the home and missing your intended target. They used birdshot and 00 in the 12g. The birdshot was stopped within the first wall, the 00 went further.

    Show Link: http://www.downrange.tv/bestdefense/...enetration.htm

    If your looking for HD, I would recommend a Maverick Security 88 12g. It is made by Mossberg, it accepts addons made for the 500 but it's only $250. I keep #6&7 shot in mine.

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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    I bought a "previously owned" 870 Express from a local pawnshop for $210 out the door.

    I think birdshot makes a lot of sense for home defense. I keep my 12 gauge loaded with two #4 birdshot rounds followed by 00 buck. Birdshot is much less likely to penetrate thin interior walls and kill innocent people on the other side, and has lower recoil than buckshot for faster follow-up shots. If you live in a solid house with a lot of land around, I would definitely choose buckshot instead. The stopping power of birdshot should not be under-estimated: at ranges out to thirty feet or so, birdshot is virtually a solid column of lead. I would choose any #4 or BB high brass lead hunting load. I like the Federal "Classic Lead Hi-Brass" #4 birdshot and Winchester "Super-X" #4 high brass birdshot , but there is little difference between the various choices.

    I would stay away from "magnum" loads; I've found the extra "omph" doesn't help out up to 25yards and, even if it did, the recoil is brutal and limits the ability to throw out some follow-up shots.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

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    As has been said, can't beat a shotgun for home defense. I have an 870 which seems to be the standard. The 870 has seen a lot of police and military action and has stood the test of time. Plus there are lots of add ons made for the 870 so modification can be done as you see fit.

    If you guys can pick a good used 870 for $200 bucks that's a great deal, most of the ones I see are $300 and up.
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    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    What do you guys think of the 870 as a backup hunting weapon? If we truly get to a SHTF scenario and there's no grocery stores, will this do the job about as good as a hunting 12-gauge?

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    Regular Member Jblack44's Avatar
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    The 870 is a very good all around gun. I've used mine to kill everything from small game, waterfowl, turkey, and deer. And this is your standard 2 3/4" chamber with an adjustable choke tube. This was my fathers gun, and he bought it used back in the seventies. It's got some wear and tear, but it has never failed. I also have a Mossberg 500 3" chamber combo that I picked up new for $250. It has a rifled barrel with a cantilever scope mount and a smooth bore barrel with three chokes. Again and all round weapon.
    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous. If you have a gun, what in the hell do you have to be paranoid for." Clint Smith, Director of Thunder Ranch

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    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    What do you guys think of the 870 as a backup hunting weapon? If we truly get to a SHTF scenario and there's no grocery stores, will this do the job about as good as a hunting 12-gauge?
    I would get the Remington 870 in 12 ga. You can buy different barrels for the gun. Deer hunting rifled barrels with iron sights and 12 ga. slugs will kill a moose (although you don't need a rifled barrel for this it does help with ballistics). You can use a regular barrel with bird-shot for hunting small game, squirrel, rabbits, birds, cats, dogs, (meats meat, right),etc. A shotgun is a great survival weapon. Just have a variety of ammo and two barrels (optional) and you're good to go.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Based on what I've read on other gun boards, the consensus is that the Remington is easier to field strip and clean then the Mossberg. I personally, do not know-I've owned neither.

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    Ended up buying the Rem 870 Combo smooth bore/rifled. Can take 2 3/4" or 3" shells.

    Next is my AR-15. )

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    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Ended up buying the Rem 870 Combo smooth bore/rifled. Can take 2 3/4" or 3" shells.

    Next is my AR-15. )
    Good choice. Next step a variety of ammo.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

  14. #14
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    Venator wrote:
    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Ended up buying the Rem 870 Combo smooth bore/rifled. Can take 2 3/4" or 3" shells.

    Next is my AR-15. )
    Good choice.* Next step a variety of ammo.
    Started on that too! haha picked up about 150 shells at Walmart (hate the company, love their prices.) for under $70

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    SpringerXDacp wrote:
    Based on what I've read on other gun boards, the consensus is that the Remington is easier to field strip and clean then the Mossberg. I personally, do not know-I've owned neither.
    I prefer the function of the Mossies, because you have what I find to be smoother ejection, and an easier to reach safety and slide release. But cleaning is definitely simpler with the 870, and the 870 is every bit as capable if you know how to use it. Can't really go wrong with either.
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    Michigander wrote:
    SpringerXDacp wrote:
    Based on what I've read on other gun boards, the consensus is that the Remington is easier to field strip and clean then the Mossberg. I personally, do not know-I've owned neither.
    I prefer the function of the Mossies, because you have what I find to be smoother ejection, and an easier to reach safety and slide release. But cleaning is definitely simpler with the 870, and the 870 is every bit as capable if you know how to use it. Can't really go wrong with either.
    Now that I think of it, I did own a new Remington 1100 12ga Slide-Action that I won in a raffle ($1.00) ata Lake Fenton Sportsman Club gun showabout 35 years ago as a teenager, LOL, but I don't recall details. Other than the 1100, all my shotguns were side by sides.

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    If your ever looking again at the ppk style check out the bersa thunder .380. Its a really nice gun, fits the hand well and is accurate out to 25 yards, it comes in many different configurations such as a 7+1, 9+1 and the 15 rounder deluxe model. Besides it costs a lot less than the walter or the ruger.

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    Regular Member dukenukum's Avatar
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    if I could own only one long gun it would either an 870 or Ithaca 37 I owned an 870 until some one stole it and sold it . and currently own three model 37's and would not hesitate to employ them for self defense .

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    Next thing I'm looking at buying is a bandolier sling for my Rem 870....

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    dukenukum wrote:
    if I could own only one long gun it would either an 870 or Ithaca 37 I owned an 870 until some one stole it and sold it . and currently own three model 37's and would not hesitate to employ them for self defense .
    I have a Ithaca 37 as well but its jammed on me in the field duck hunting standing in chest deep water with a flock of ducks overhead and while shooting clays so relying on it in a bad situation I'd rather get my super x 2. Who's to say my gun just isn't worn out though.

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