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Need some help w/ Crim. Jus. professor

hotrod

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Jul 24, 2008
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Union, Kentucky, USA
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KY Soldier wrote:
Sadly yes...I am. Why?
My nephew graduated in Dec. from the criminal justice program there and had difficulty with a prof that said some real stupid things and was clueless of Kentucky law. He lived in Ohio and new even less of theirs
 

smoking357

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Pierce is a Coward, ,
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KY Soldier wrote:
OK guys my Criminal Justice professor is absolutely convinced that OCing in KY with out a permitor anywhere for that matter is illegal. I've proved him wrong on numerous other occasions about gun laws in our state (thanks to this wonderful site) and now I need some help again. Does anyone know the exact law that ALLOWS OC? Or where is the law that DOES NOT prohibit it? If anyone can link me to the actual KRS statute that would be great and I will finally shut this guy up.

Thanks to all in advance!
In Germany, everything is prohibited, except that which is permitted.

In Italy, everything is permitted, except that which is forbidden.

In France, everything is permitted, especially that which has been forbidden.

My friend, we enter this world as free men, permitted to do everything under the Natural Law. The law only prohibits us from certain actions; we need not seek permission prior to acting.

Can you find the law that allows you to wear a coat?
 

v8shoguy

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, ,
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Here is what makes carry a RIGHT.

http://www.lrc.ky.gov/legresou/constitu/001.htm

In order for OC to become illegal, there would have to be a constitutional amendment. It should surprise me that a law professor hasn't read the state Constitution (and hasn't even tried, it's in the 1st section) but it doesn't.
 

BB62

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gutshot wrote:
[font="Univers, Arial"][font="Univers, Arial"]Holland v Commonwealth, [/font]Court of Appeals of Kentucky, [/font][font="Univers, Arial"]October 5, 1956[/font]
Nice cite!! I salute you sir (or madam)!

Especially since the prof can't be bothered with the concept of "rights", and thinks that laws must allow things, rather than disallow them...
 

Statesman

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Lexington, Kentucky, USA
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gutshot wrote:
[font="Univers, Arial"]OK guys my Criminal Justice professor is absolutely convinced that OCing in KY with out a permitor anywhere for that matter is illegal. I've proved him wrong on numerous other occasions about gun laws in our state (thanks to this wonderful site) and now I need some help again. Does anyone know the exact law that ALLOWS OC? Or where is the law that DOES NOT prohibit it? If anyone can link me to the actual KRS statute that would be great and I will finally shut this guy up.

Thanks to all in advance!
[/font]




[font="Univers, Arial"]Excerpted from[/font]
    • [align=center]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]Holland v Commonwealth[/font]
      [/align][align=center]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]Morton HOLLAND, Appellant[/font]
      [/align][align=center]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]V[/font]
      [/align][align=center]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]COMMONWEALTH of Kentucky, Appellee.[/font]
      [/align][align=center]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]Court of Appeals of Kentucky.[/font]
      [/align][align=center]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]October 5, 1956[/font]
      [/align]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]Prosecution of a deputy sheriff for carrying a concealed deadly weapon. The Circuit Court, Perry County, C.C. Wells, Judge, entered judgment of conviction and defendant appealed. The Court of Appeals, Moremen, Judge, held that where deputy sheriff went outside of the county in which he was appointed to locate an alleged offender for the purpose of offender’s arrest pursuant to a warrant which had been delivered to him, he had the right to carry a concealed deadly weapon.[/font]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]Judgment reversed with instructions that indictment be dismissed.[/font]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]MOREMEN, Judge.[/font]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]"……Section 1, subd. 7 of the Bill of Rights, which is concerned with inherent and inalienable rights, grants to all citizens:[/font]
      ‘[font="Univers, Arial"]The right to bear arms in defense of themselves and of the State, subject to the power of the General Assembly to enact laws to prevent persons from carrying concealed weapons.’[/font]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]The foregoing section is an exemplification of the broadest expression of the right to bear arms. Some states give the legislature the right to regulate the carrying of firearms; at least one state prohibits even the possession of firearms. See cases collected in the annotation of Pierce v State of Oklahoma, 42 Okl. Cr. 272, 275 P. 393, 73 A.L.R. 833.[/font]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]In our state the legislature is empowered only to deny to citizens the right to carry concealed weapons. The constitutional provision is an affirmation of the faith that all men have the inherent right to arm themselves for the defense of themselves and of the state. The only limitation concerns the mode of carrying such instruments. We observe, via obiter dicta, that although a person is granted the right to carry a weapon openly, a severe penalty is imposed for carrying it concealed. If the gun is worn outside the jacket or shirt in full view, no one may question the wearer’s right so to do; but if it is carried under the jacket or shirt, the violator is subject to imprisonment for not less than two nor more than five years. The heavy emphasis, we suppose, is upon the undue advantage given to a person who is able suddenly to expose and use a weapon, although the gun itself is the vicious instrument………."[/font]
      [font="Univers, Arial"]Emphasis supplied.[/font]
Can anyone provide a legitimate reference to this?
 

Riana

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Fairfax County, VA
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Mike wrote:
Why don't you invite your professor for some coffee off campus and you can show him open carry?
Better yet - someone needs to organize a local OC dinner/lunch, and invite a certain law professor. Someone else needs to bring the smelling salts for when the man keels over from the shock. :lol:
 

chris in va

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Louisville KY, ,
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My friend's daughter's boyfriend (got that?) has a CJ degree and is currently looking for work. We had him over a few months ago and he commented on my "arsenal of guns" laid out on the floor. It consisted of a Mosin, CZ Carbine, HiPoint carbine and shotgun.:?

I took him to the range. It was his first time shooting a handgun, having only fired a 22 rifle.

I did my best to 'reeducate' him on private firearm ownership. He too didn't understand the legality or need for concealed carry.
 

Task Force 16

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jul 20, 2008
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Lobelville, Tennessee, USA
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chris in va wrote:
My friend's daughter's boyfriend (got that?) has a CJ degree and is currently looking for work. We had him over a few months ago and he commented on my "arsenal of guns" laid out on the floor. It consisted of a Mosin, CZ Carbine, HiPoint carbine and shotgun.:?

I took him to the range. It was his first time shooting a handgun, having only fired a 22 rifle.

I did my best to 'reeducate' him on private firearm ownership. He too didn't understand the legality or need for concealed carry.
Does this mean he is pro-OC?
 

Statesman

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Lexington, Kentucky, USA
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chris in va wrote:
My friend's daughter's boyfriend (got that?) has a CJ degree and is currently looking for work. We had him over a few months ago and he commented on my "arsenal of guns" laid out on the floor. It consisted of a Mosin, CZ Carbine, HiPoint carbine and shotgun.:?

I took him to the range. It was his first time shooting a handgun, having only fired a 22 rifle.

I did my best to 'reeducate' him on private firearm ownership. He too didn't understand the legality or need for concealed carry.
Just show him this chart, and he will begin to understand. If anyone doesn't understand after some serious thought, then consider them a waste of your time.

[font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]JEWS FOR THE PRESERVATION
OF FIREARMS OWNERSHIP
[/font]


http://www.jpfo.org/filegen-a-m/deathgc.htm#chart[font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"][/font]
 

SlackwareRobert

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Jun 10, 2008
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Alabama, ,
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Hate to defend the prof.
But lets face it he has spent his entire life in gun free zones
(by fiat not law). So how would he know any better?
Just bad luck he never got mugged by the goons he says should
be walking the streets.

The very idea that a professor would keep up with his area
of expertise once they have tenure is laughable.

If he won't leave his little dream world, perhaps a nice
holster carry coffee in the student union would be more to
his liking. Just don't empty holster carry in the gym for a few days.:(
Have not seen one brady bunch interview calling for waiting period for gym bags.:banghead:
 

Decoligny

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Rosamond, California, USA
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gutshot wrote:
SlackwareRobert wrote:
Hate to defend the prof.
But lets face it he has spent his entire life in gun free zones
(by fiat not law). So how would he know any better?
Just bad luck he never got mugged by the goons he says should
be walking the streets.

The very idea that a professor would keep up with his area
of expertise once they have tenure is laughable.

If he won't leave his little dream world, perhaps a nice
holster carry coffee in the student union would be more to
his liking. Just don't empty holster carry in the gym for a few days.:(
Have not seen one brady bunch interview calling for waiting period for gym bags.:banghead:

He's supposed to be an educated man and his special area of study is criminal justice. It's not unreasonable to expect him to know a little about firearms law. Instead, he repeats propaganda and spews disinformation to his students while feeding from the public trough. From what was written it sounds like he attempts to belittle and intimidate those who disagree with him and try to educate him. This man is a arrogant buffoon.
As are the majority of the professors in today's liberal bastion of "free thought", unless of course your thought disagrees with the thought that is being spewed forth from the mouths of the ex-hippy professors.
 

sawhitt

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Aug 25, 2009
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Guston, ,
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*Assault weapon ownership: unrestricted, no permit or license required

Please define assault weapon. (You've got it covered in machine guns.)

Assault weapons by proper definition are select fire. That makes the Class 3 stuff.

What Congress called assault weapons are simply semi-automatic firearms. Definitely not assault weapons, unless one wishes to define any weapon used in a personal assault to be an assault weapon. That would make feather pillows assault weapons.
 

KY Soldier

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Feb 4, 2009
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Cold Springs, Kentucky, USA
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I can't believe this thread stayed alive this long but I am glad it did because once again I have to cite the info here to prove yet another "knowledgable" person completely wrong. The new issue is once again open carrying and a new one...hand gun ownership and acquisition if you are under the age of 21 (like myself.) Your gonna love who i'm proving wrong this time. He's a newly commisioned Lieutenant in my NG unit AND he's a KY State Trooper!! I am now afraid for all of us knowing that a State Trooper has no clue of the laws he is supposed to enforce. Comments, sources, cites,anyone?
 

KBCraig

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Granite State of Mind
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KY Soldier wrote:
I can't believe this thread stayed alive this long but I am glad it did because once again I have to cite the info here to prove yet another "knowledgable" person completely wrong. The new issue is once again open carrying and a new one...hand gun ownership and acquisition if you are under the age of 21 (like myself.) Your gonna love who i'm proving wrong this time. He's a newly commisioned Lieutenant in my NG unit AND he's a KY State Trooper!! I am now afraid for all of us knowing that a State Trooper has no clue of the laws he is supposed to enforce. Comments, sources, cites,anyone?

Wrong approach: the burden is on him to cite the law forbidding ownership, acquisition, and open carry under the age of 21.

If there is no law forbidding it, it is legal.
 

8th ID

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Good God! A KSP who doesn't know this info? We are all screwed! I'm not sure if they are taught and/or have to know every statute, BUT seems like this one would be one of the more important ones...:cuss:
 

Statesman

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Lexington, Kentucky, USA
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KY Soldier wrote:
I can't believe this thread stayed alive this long but I am glad it did because once again I have to cite the info here to prove yet another "knowledgable" person completely wrong. The new issue is once again open carrying and a new one...hand gun ownership and acquisition if you are under the age of 21 (like myself.) Your gonna love who i'm proving wrong this time. He's a newly commisioned Lieutenant in my NG unit AND he's a KY State Trooper!! I am now afraid for all of us knowing that a State Trooper has no clue of the laws he is supposed to enforce. Comments, sources, cites,anyone?
Maybe it's just me, but this doesn't surprise me. I would guess that education for LEO is focused on current needs, not on volumes of legal doctrine. With recent events covered on the news, and the activism with OCDO, I would be surprised to know that departments have not received at least a memo on open carry, and how to deal with the non-situation that it is.

However, if there are STILL departments that have refused to issue memos, or educational training on opencarry, there is some serious neglect or anti-gun political agendas going on.
 

KY Soldier

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Cold Springs, Kentucky, USA
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For the record the outcome with my professor last semester was fantastic. He was apalled at the lack of gun control in KY once his own research revealed I was correct. In the end I looked like a genius in front of the whole class and i pulled 10 bonus points away too :cool:
 
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