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Thread: Gov. Huntsman signs HB 357

  1. #1
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    I've received word that Gov. Huntsman signed HB 357 into law today. This makes
    it legal for adults, aged 18 and older, to have a loaded handgun in their car
    WITHOUT needing a concealed weapons permit.

    It also allows persons to have a concealed firearm (long or short) in their own
    cars, in their own homes, and in businesses or other property under their
    control without needing a concealed weapons permit.

    Long guns may not be loaded in a vehicle (unless a person has a concealed
    weapons permit, is my reading, consult a lawyer for sure).

    This bill should go into effect 60 days after the session adjourned on March 12,
    or May 10 or May 11 if my counting is not too far off.

    Consult a lawyer before making any life altering decisions. This is not legal
    advice, and other such disclaimers.

    I note that SB 78, the bill to protect most employees from termination or other
    adverse employment action for having a legal gun locked in their private car
    parked in company parking lots has not been signed yet. If I'm not mistaken,
    the Governor has 20 days (excluding Sundays) from March 12 to either sign the
    bill into law, veto it, or have it become law without his signature. That
    deadline is about Saturday April 4th.

    Links to the full language of HB 357 S1, as well as status can be found at
    http://le.utah.gov/~2009/htmdoc/hbillhtm/HB0357S01.htm

    Status does not yet show as being signed. Give them a day or two to update that.

    Links to SB 78 S2 can be found at:
    http://le.utah.gov/~2009/htmdoc/sbillhtm/SB0078S02.htm


    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

  2. #2
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    WOOHOO! even when the dems have control over the country, they cant stop our progression

  3. #3
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    utbagpiper wrote:
    I note that SB 78, the bill to protect most employees from termination or other
    adverse employment action for having a legal gun locked in their private car
    parked in company parking lots has not been signed yet. If I'm not mistaken,
    the Governor has 20 days (excluding Sundays) from March 12 to either sign the
    bill into law, veto it, or have it become law without his signature. That
    deadline is about Saturday March 4th.

    Don't you mean APRIL 4TH?

  4. #4
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    tapehoser wrote:

    Don't you mean APRIL 4TH?
    Yes I do.

    Thank you.
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

  5. #5
    State Researcher Kevin Jensen's Avatar
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    The Governor has signed both HB 357 and SB 78! :celebrate

    http://le.utah.gov/~2009/status/hbillsta/hb0357s01.htm

    http://www.utah.gov/governor/news_me...l?article=2425



    Governor Signs 45 Bills
    Mar 30, 2009

    WHO: Governor Jon Huntsman

    WHAT: The Governor signed the following bills today:

    House Bills:
    HB0011 - Recodification of Natural Resources Provisions, John Mathis
    HB0014 - Material Harmful to Minors Amendments, Sheryl Allen
    HB0015 - Career and Technical Education Amendments, Ron Bigelow
    HB0032 - Amendments to Agency Rulemaking Regarding Criminal Penalties, Ben Ferry
    HB0050 - Firefighter Special Group License Plate Amendments, Ronda Menlove
    HB0052 - Insurance Code and Related Amendments, James Dunnigan
    HB0061S02 - Local Government Entity Changes, Kory Holdaway
    HB0078 - Utah Uniform Securities Act Modifications, Jim Bird
    HB0086S01 - Division of Real Estate Related Amendments, Gage Froerer
    HB0129 - Alcoholic Beverage Amendments Related to Minors, Curtis Oda
    HB0136S01 - Sex Offender Definition Amendments, Paul Ray
    HB0170 - Insurance and Life Settlement Amendments, James Dunnigan
    HB0250 - Revisor's Statute, Kevin Garn
    HB0253 - Motor Carrier Permit Fee Amendments, Todd Kiser
    HB0261 - Aviation Amendments, Wayne Harper
    HB0340S01 - Respite Care Assistance Fund, Jack Draxler
    HB0345 - Elected Officials - Restrictions on Lobbying, Brad Dee
    HB0346S03 - Campaign and Financial Reporting Requirements Amendments, Brad Dee
    HB0357S01 - Firearms Amendments, Stephen Sandstrom
    HB0364 - Border and Nonresident Student Amendments, Don Ipson
    HB0371S02 - Transportation Governance, Wayne Harper
    HB0383 - Water Rights Adjudication Amendments, James Gowans
    HB0384 - Public Lewdness Amendments, Don Ipson
    HB0389 - Applications for a Small Amount of Water, Patrick Painter
    HB0391 - Budgetary Procedures Act Revisions, Ron Bigelow
    HB0400S02 - Pete Suazo Utah Athletic Commission Amendments, Curtis Oda
    HB0432 - Higher Education Budget Authority Amendments, Kory Holdaway

    Senate Bills:
    SB0029S01 - Safe Drinking Water Act Amendments, Dennis Stowell
    SB0031S01 - Utah Residential Mortgage Practices and Licensing Act, Wayne Niederhauser
    SB0053 - Awarding of Attorney Fees, Stephen Urquhart
    SB0057 - Local Option Transportation Corridor Preservation Fund Amendments, Ralph Okerlund
    SB0066 - Highway Designation Amendments, David Hinkins
    SB0068S01 - Mining Protection Amendments, Sheldon Killpack
    SB0070 - Department of Environmental Quality Amendments, Margaret Dayton
    SB0076S03 - Energy Amendments, Curtis Bramble
    SB0078S01 - Protection of Constitutionally Guaranteed Activities in Certain Private Venues, Mark Madsen
    SB0102 - Share the Road Special Group License Plate, Wayne Niederhauser
    SB0140 - Financial Institutions Disclosure of Records, Margaret Dayton
    SB0169 - Gambling Amendments, Daniel Liljenquist
    SB0188 - Improvement District - Providing Electric Service, Dennis Stowell
    SB0192S01 - Corporation and Business Entity Related Amendments, Lyle Hillyard
    SB0205 - Community Development and Renewal Agency Amendments, Curtis Bramble
    SB0208S03 - Utah Public Notice Website Amendments, Stephen Urquhart
    SB0257 - Disaster Recovery Fund Funding Modifications, Lyle Hillyard
    SB0272S02 - Driver License Sanctions and Sentencing Requirements for Driving Under the Influence and Alcohol Related Offenses, Scott Jenkins

    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life." Robert A. Heinlein

  6. #6
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    AWESOME! :celebrate:celebrate

    Thank you for the great news.

    Again, I note that these bills become law on about May 10th or 11th if my counting is not too far off.

    I have not yet researched or studied to see how HB 357 interacts with Utah's gun free school zone. So those without Utah permits need to figure that out and be sure to comply with the law. I also note that SB 78 S2, requires the firearms to remain out of sight and inside your actual vehicle. So while it was the AOL case that prompted the bill, the exact actions of the three AOL employees remain conduct for which an employee can be legally fired. IE, do NOT transfer guns from one car to another in your employer's parking lot if your employer has a policy against doing so.

    Charles


    SGT Jensen wrote:
    The Governor has signed both HB 357 and SB 78! :celebrate

    http://www.utah.gov/governor/news_me...l?article=2425



    Governor Signs 45 Bills
    Mar 30, 2009

    WHO: Governor Jon Huntsman

    WHAT: The Governor signed the following bills today:

    House Bills:
    HB0011 - Recodification of Natural Resources Provisions, John Mathis
    HB0014 - Material Harmful to Minors Amendments, Sheryl Allen
    HB0015 - Career and Technical Education Amendments, Ron Bigelow
    HB0032 - Amendments to Agency Rulemaking Regarding Criminal Penalties, Ben Ferry
    HB0050 - Firefighter Special Group License Plate Amendments, Ronda Menlove
    HB0052 - Insurance Code and Related Amendments, James Dunnigan
    HB0061S02 - Local Government Entity Changes, Kory Holdaway
    HB0078 - Utah Uniform Securities Act Modifications, Jim Bird
    HB0086S01 - Division of Real Estate Related Amendments, Gage Froerer
    HB0129 - Alcoholic Beverage Amendments Related to Minors, Curtis Oda
    HB0136S01 - Sex Offender Definition Amendments, Paul Ray
    HB0170 - Insurance and Life Settlement Amendments, James Dunnigan
    HB0250 - Revisor's Statute, Kevin Garn
    HB0253 - Motor Carrier Permit Fee Amendments, Todd Kiser
    HB0261 - Aviation Amendments, Wayne Harper
    HB0340S01 - Respite Care Assistance Fund, Jack Draxler
    HB0345 - Elected Officials - Restrictions on Lobbying, Brad Dee
    HB0346S03 - Campaign and Financial Reporting Requirements Amendments, Brad Dee
    HB0357S01 - Firearms Amendments, Stephen Sandstrom
    HB0364 - Border and Nonresident Student Amendments, Don Ipson
    HB0371S02 - Transportation Governance, Wayne Harper
    HB0383 - Water Rights Adjudication Amendments, James Gowans
    HB0384 - Public Lewdness Amendments, Don Ipson
    HB0389 - Applications for a Small Amount of Water, Patrick Painter
    HB0391 - Budgetary Procedures Act Revisions, Ron Bigelow
    HB0400S02 - Pete Suazo Utah Athletic Commission Amendments, Curtis Oda
    HB0432 - Higher Education Budget Authority Amendments, Kory Holdaway

    Senate Bills:
    SB0029S01 - Safe Drinking Water Act Amendments, Dennis Stowell
    SB0031S01 - Utah Residential Mortgage Practices and Licensing Act, Wayne Niederhauser
    SB0053 - Awarding of Attorney Fees, Stephen Urquhart
    SB0057 - Local Option Transportation Corridor Preservation Fund Amendments, Ralph Okerlund
    SB0066 - Highway Designation Amendments, David Hinkins
    SB0068S01 - Mining Protection Amendments, Sheldon Killpack
    SB0070 - Department of Environmental Quality Amendments, Margaret Dayton
    SB0076S03 - Energy Amendments, Curtis Bramble
    SB0078S01 - Protection of Constitutionally Guaranteed Activities in Certain Private Venues, Mark Madsen
    SB0102 - Share the Road Special Group License Plate, Wayne Niederhauser
    SB0140 - Financial Institutions Disclosure of Records, Margaret Dayton
    SB0169 - Gambling Amendments, Daniel Liljenquist
    SB0188 - Improvement District - Providing Electric Service, Dennis Stowell
    SB0192S01 - Corporation and Business Entity Related Amendments, Lyle Hillyard
    SB0205 - Community Development and Renewal Agency Amendments, Curtis Bramble
    SB0208S03 - Utah Public Notice Website Amendments, Stephen Urquhart
    SB0257 - Disaster Recovery Fund Funding Modifications, Lyle Hillyard
    SB0272S02 - Driver License Sanctions and Sentencing Requirements for Driving Under the Influence and Alcohol Related Offenses, Scott Jenkins
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

  7. #7
    State Researcher Kevin Jensen's Avatar
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    utbagpiper wrote:
    I have not yet researched or studied to see how HB 357 interacts with Utah's gun free school zone. So those without Utah permits need to figure that out and be sure to comply with the law.
    From what I see, without a permit, the GFSZA still applies in K-12 schools, just like it did before.

    U.S.C. 18, 922 (2)

    (A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone. (B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm—

    ...

    (iii) that is—
    (I) not loaded; and
    (II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life." Robert A. Heinlein

  8. #8
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    Great News! - please remind me and John when the effective date comes so we can change the Travelers' Map color for Utah!

    Next goal ought to be removing need for permit to conceal to load your openly carried gun outside the vehicle.

  9. #9
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    You should also check State law as it includes schools not included in the federal law. I don't remember whether it includes preschools, but I know it includes higher ed, including tech and trade schools. Sorry, no time for me to research it today.

    My PERSONAL opinion is that the feds are not likely to try to enforce the federal GFSZA as it was ruled unconstitutional the last time they tried in Lopez. I doubt the current court would rule any more kindly with the recent additions of Roberts and Alito.

    The real value (to the gun grabbing feds) of the federal GFSZA is that every State has identical or similar laws at the State level. Those laws do not suffer from the defect that overturned the federal GFSZA. Indeed, nothing short of a direct 2nd amendment (or State RKBA consttutional provision) challenge will overturn the State GFSZA laws.

    I'd love to see the Utah GFSZA brought into conformity with the federal law, and then eventually elimianted altogether (at least for adults).

    Always something to work on.

    Charles


    SGT Jensen wrote:
    utbagpiper wrote:
    I have not yet researched or studied to see how HB 357 interacts with Utah's gun free school zone. So those without Utah permits need to figure that out and be sure to comply with the law.
    From what I see, without a permit, the GFSZA still applies in K-12 schools, just like it did before.

    U.S.C. 18, 922 (2)

    (A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone. (B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm—

    ...

    (iii) that is—
    (I) not loaded; and
    (II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

  10. #10
    State Researcher Kevin Jensen's Avatar
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    Yeah, the state law regarding school zones and HB 357 will prove to be confusing. :?

    I was just pointing out that it will have no bearing on K-12 schools without a permit.

    Also, I am sure there are thousands of people who breakthe federallaw every day, by not keeping guns in locked containers.

    At face value, it appears that if you have a loaded or unloadedhandgun in your vehicle without a permit, open or concealed, you would be just fine around non K-12 schools, like Universities. If you have a permit, do as you please.



    76-10-505.5. Possession of a dangerous weapon, firearm, or sawed-off shotgun on or about school premises -- Penalties.
    (1) A person may not possess any dangerous weapon, firearm, or sawed-off shotgun, as those terms are defined in Section 76-10-501, at a place that the person knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is on or about school premises as defined in Subsection 76-3-203.2(1).
    (2) (a) Possession of a dangerous weapon on or about school premises is a class B misdemeanor.
    (b) Possession of a firearm or sawed-off shotgun on or about school premises is a class A misdemeanor.
    (3) This section does not apply if:
    (a) the person is authorized to possess a firearm as provided under Section 53-5-704, 53-5-705, 76-10-511, or 76-10-523, or as otherwise authorized by law;
    (b) the possession is approved by the responsible school administrator;
    (c) the item is present or to be used in connection with a lawful, approved activity and is in the possession or under the control of the person responsible for its possession or use; or
    (d) the possession is:
    (i) at the person's place of residence or on the person's property;
    (ii) in any vehicle lawfully under the person's control, other than a vehicle owned by the school or used by the school to transport students; or
    (iii) at the person's place of business which is not located in the areas described in Subsection 76-3-203.2(1)(a)(i), (ii), or (iv).
    (4) This section does not prohibit prosecution of a more serious weapons offense that may occur on or about school premises.

    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life." Robert A. Heinlein

  11. #11
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    I just sent an e-mail to the governor thanking him for signing the bills. I have a question for you fine people. I have a friend that doesn't have a ccw and was wondering if he can put the gun in his glovebox while he is driving around. Previous law said he couldn't, but I couldn't find anywhere in the new law that said anything about it.................. Thanks

  12. #12
    State Researcher Kevin Jensen's Avatar
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    The glove box or console box appears to be just fine as long as the vehicle is in your possession, or you haveconsent from the person who is in possession of the vehicle.

    Please see http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum52/23828.htmlfor all of the changes.
    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life." Robert A. Heinlein

  13. #13
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    SGT Jensen wrote:
    The glove box or console box appears to be just fine as long as the vehicle is in your possession, or you haveconsent from the person who is in possession of the vehicle.

    Please see http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum52/23828.htmlfor all of the changes.
    And do be sure to wait for the bill to become law and go into effect on May 11.
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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    awesome!!! (now all we have to do is get the governor to activate our sovreignty like 21 other states have)

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    Excellent. Thanks for your comments. I will let my friend know. I did tell him that he needs to wait until May 11th.

  16. #16
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    b1ack5mith wrote:
    awesome!!! (now all we have to do is get the governor to activate our sovreignty like 21 other states have)
    A fine idea, but under the Utah Constitution, not possible.

    Article I, Section 3. [Utah inseparable from the Union.]
    The State of Utah is an inseparable part of the Federal Union and the Constitution of the United States is the supreme law of the land.

    Following the war between the States, the feds starting requiring this kind of thing to join the union. So we'd FIRST have to repeal this, and probably argue the "equal footing" doctrine (which would also argue for the State taking control of most federal land in Utah) .

    But Utahns are simply not nearly as willing to rebel as others. While other, liberal States have declared themselves "sanctuary cities" where immigration laws would not be enforced, for example, Utah adopted a host of laws and practices that made us a de facto sanctuary State even as those adopting such laws continued to parrot the "honor, obey, and sustain the law of the land" and "supporting and defending the constituion" lines that are required culturally here.

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

  17. #17
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    so, youre telling me that UT can NOT secceed? i think we can...

    i had always thought UT was a more rebellious state... sad to think it isnt!

  18. #18
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    Ha! What's to stop them from doing something unconstitutional?
    They've all been doing it for years.

    Of course if they were to do something like that, I would prefer they go through the proper procedure.

    Let's not let em trample on any constitution anymore.

  19. #19
    State Researcher Kevin Jensen's Avatar
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    One more thing about HB 357 and SB 78. The NRA seems to get most of the credit for backing these bills.

    The real kudos need to belong to GOUtah and The Utah Shooting Sports Council.

    For the past four years, they have remained vigilant in getting the employee parking lot bill passed, as well as other pro-gun legislation! :celebrate

    http://goutahorg.org/

    http://www.utahshootingsports.com/


    "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life." Robert A. Heinlein

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