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Thread: How is this anti-gun?

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    Regular Member possumboy's Avatar
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    Is it supposed to be anti-gun? My only objection is saying it's a privilege instead of a right.

    -ljp

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    Regular Member possumboy's Avatar
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    This is more about the artist being anti. Here is a link to a some of his other cartoons

    http://www.cartoonistgroup.com/bysub...8&sid=1911

    Most of them or very anti-gun. I think he believes this is a statement against guns, but I cannot figure out what the anti statement is...

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    Softening of a "right" to a "privilege". It's preemptive and made to bolster the anti's. A privilige can be taken away by law easier than a right can.

    There is a tremendous game of semantic chess going on these days. The MIAC, the DHS, painting conservatives as anti immigration instead of anti illegal immigration, anti stem cell research instead of anti embryonic stem cell research, assault weapons instead of machine guns, the list goes on. Just a little tweak in the wording to change the entire meaning.

    I think most folks will not see it as blatantly anti. I think it's a good try, but a lot of folks will take it pro gun. Maybe I'm reading too much into it.

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    State Researcher .40 Cal's Avatar
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    Looks like an average Joe scaring off a bad guy while envoking the 2nd A. I think maybe the artist is seeing the light. We'll get through eventually, one anti at a time. It behooves us to write to him and thank him for modifying his position. :celebrate

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    Regular Member AZkopper's Avatar
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    The questions are as follows:

    Does the cartoonist now feel that gun ownership is a valid form of protection against crime? If not, then what is the meaning of the cartoon?

    Is the "privelidge" vs "right" cartoon word bubble are veiled attempt to redefine the argument, or is the author just ignorant and making a semantics mistake?



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    We're barking up the wrong tree looking for rights to be recognized:
    http://www.cartoonistgroup.com/store/add.php?iid=7572

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    I smell a caption contest.

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    LOL...nice one, Longwatch.

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator longwatch's Avatar
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    Heres a blank for anyone interested.

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    longwatch wrote:
    Heres a blank for anyone interested.

    "All I did was tell himmy bother isPhilip Van Cleave."



    "All I said was that I grew up in Texas."



    "He suddenly remembered an appointment he had to keep. He asked me to pass along his compliments on the flower beds."



    "He asked if the lady of the house was in. I told him you were getting the shotgun."



    "He said he was a crow-bar salesman. I said I was gun salesman."

    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Well Marge, it looks like my Dirty Harry impersonation came in handy, after all.

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    Task Force 16 wrote:
    Well Marge, it looks like my Dirty Harry impersonation came in handy, after all.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    ...
    - What da hay?

    Keep Calm and Carry On

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    "Say hello to my little friend"

    "Go ahead, make my day!"

    I know, weak but it's early.:P

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    State Researcher .40 Cal's Avatar
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    "He told me to empty out my pockets."

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    Regular Member MetalChris's Avatar
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    .40 Cal wrote:
    "He told me to empty out my pockets."
    Win!

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    I think he found the obituary we cut out from the last armed robber.

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    Regular Member Johnny Stiletto's Avatar
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    ...

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    Regular Member sccrref's Avatar
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    .40 Cal wrote:
    "He told me to empty out my pockets."
    This would indeed make the caption of it being a privilege correct.

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    I realize you were just being humorous without doing a legal analysis, but your caption plays right into the anti's hands. It shows the homeowner would back-shoot the crook after the threat has passed. Press, police, and anti-gunners read this forum.

    If you decide to delete yours, let me know via PM so I can delete this post.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Regular Member Washintonian_For_Liberty's Avatar
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    Citizen wrote:
    I realize you were just being humorous without doing a legal analysis, but your caption plays right into the anti's hands. It shows the homeowner would back-shoot the crook after the threat has passed. Press, police, and anti-gunners read this forum.

    If you decide to delete yours, let me know via PM so I can delete this post.
    He's still on their property and knows where they live. He's a threat. If this took place in California... let him live and he can sue you.... and win.

    So no, I won't change it.Amasked man comesinto my house with a weapon at night and I'll make sure he's dead. And yes, a crowbar is a weapon.

    No matter what you do, the antigunners will almost always be antigun. They will not apologize for their views and neither will I. Just say you don't agree and be done with it.
    Associate with men of good quality if you esteem your own reputation; for it is better to be alone than in bad company. ~ George Washington

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    Washintonian_For_Liberty wrote:
    Citizen wrote:
    I realize you were just being humorous without doing a legal analysis, but your caption plays right into the anti's hands. It shows the homeowner would back-shoot the crook after the threat has passed. Press, police, and anti-gunners read this forum.

    If you decide to delete yours, let me know via PM so I can delete this post.
    He's still on their property and knows where they live. He's a threat. If this took place in California... let him live and he can sue you.... and win.

    So no, I won't change it.Amasked man comesinto my house with a weapon at night and I'll make sure he's dead. And yes, a crowbar is a weapon.

    No matter what you do, the antigunners will almost always be antigun. They will not apologize for their views and neither will I. Just say you don't agree and be done with it.
    OK. So, you don't wantto deny ammo to the anti's. Fine.

    Would you mind notmaking us look like law-breakers.The common law on justified lethal force includes that the justification for lethal force stops when the immediate threat stops. See In the Gravest Extreme by Massad Ayoob,perhaps the foremost self-defense expert witness in the country. Also, google AOJ (ability, opportunity, jeopardy)

    Nevermind the extensive discussions both on OCDO and in the armed self-defense world aboutshooting to stop instead of shooting to kill."Making sure he is dead", in your context, means to ensure that he dies. Doing soafter theimmediate threat stops may very well get you amanslaughter charge.

    For any guests reading this forum, we repudiate the above views of Washingtonian_For_Liberty on lethal force.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  24. #24
    Regular Member Washintonian_For_Liberty's Avatar
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    Citizen wrote:
    OK. So, you don't wantto deny ammo to the anti's. Fine.

    Would you mind notmaking us look like law-breakers.The common law on justified lethal force includes that the justification for lethal force stops when the immediate threat stops. See In the Gravest Extreme by Massad Ayoob,perhaps the foremost self-defense expert witness in the country. Also, google AOJ (ability, opportunity, jeopardy)

    Nevermind the extensive discussions both on OCDO and in the armed self-defense world aboutshooting to stop instead of shooting to kill."Making sure he is dead", in your context, means to ensure that he dies. Doing soafter theimmediate threat stops may very well get you amanslaughter charge.

    For any guests reading this forum, we repudiate the above views of Washingtonian_For_Liberty on lethal force.
    Ever heard of the First Amendment? The Antis want us to become self conscious about what we say and what we write. I refuse to give them the power to regulate what I say or write.

    First, the cartoon is not an exact representation of reality. As is with most comedy (and it's funny to me), it has elements of the truth in it. Are we going to be cowed into silence by the Stalinists who don't want us to have any views? I refuse to buckle to the threat of "oooo you might give the antis ammo" (could have made another joke out of that one as well). They take even our most well thought out arguments completely out of context and plaster their propaganda and lies everywhere they can. Political cartoons like the one we've been posting are a way of illustrating truths through exaggeration.

    As for my comments on making sure they're dead. If a masked man comes into my home at night with a weapon... I'm not going to try and wing him. Trying to wing him means I might miss. I'm going to put two shots to center mass and one to the head. I'm not going to play nice with robbers who break into my home when I have a wife and little daughter that could be hurt or killed if I don't neutralize the threat. If I shot the guy and he was running from my home, I would never shoot him unless he was running for his car.. I might shoot him as I would be afraid he might have a gun in his car. I will not wait to see if he does, only to get shot and leave my wife and daughter totally unprotected. I'm not without understanding of killing in self defense, and if they're masked, with a crowbar and in my house... I think I'm within my rights to kill them... or are we saying that guns are really just cool looking noisemakers that we're not supposed to ACTUALLY use?
    Associate with men of good quality if you esteem your own reputation; for it is better to be alone than in bad company. ~ George Washington

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    Regular Member sccrref's Avatar
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    Citizen wrote:
    <snip>For any guests reading this forum, we repudiate the above views of Washingtonian_For_Liberty on lethal force.<snip>
    Please do not speak for me. I may or may not agree with a posters view or choice of words. That is for me to comment on. Speak for yourself. The poster of the comment you refer to did not say that we would make sure he is..... He posted I would make sure he is.....

    I support the 1st as well as the 2nd and all of the other parts of the COTUS. I speak for myself on issues.

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