thefirststrike
Regular Member
imported post
(I originally posted this in another part of the forum, but I think it deserves its own spot here too. I wrote this in response to a CC question by vandal for when he goes to the Boise State University campus...except that I made a few minor changes and added the paragraph below to THIS posting for clarification).
As most of you are probably aware, in many states, even those where OC or CC is legal and/or they have preemption, it is still unlawful to OC or CC on a college or university campus. The way the state usually achieves this is by allowing the college or university to have an "exemption" to the law, which lets them make administrative rules barring the carrying of weapons for self defense, both by law abiding students and the law abiding public as well.
I have given this university exemption thing a lot of thought. My thinking also applies to the practice of barring law biding citizens from OC'ing or CC'ing on public school property (K-12), the post office, local libraries, and anywhere else that is supposedly "allowed" to have different rules. I would even say this includes the county and federal courthouses and their offices, as well as local and city offices.
But for now let's address college and university campuses. I am wondering how it is possible for them to get away with this, even with an exemption granted by the state. Here is my line of thinking, who agrees with me on this?
1) The first ten Amendments to the United States Constitution are collectively known as the Bill of Rights. These 10 amendments were specifically written to safeguard the INDIVIDUAL'S rights (as opposed to state's rights etc. in the remaining amendments) from being violated by the government (federal, state or local, doesn't matter).
2) The Constitution exists to safeguard our God given rights from being violated by the government (federal, state, local) OR its employees/representatives...ANY branch of ANY government, or ANY person or person's representing the government, it doesn't matter!!
3) A public university is a) public property, and as such it is technically owned by the taxpayers of the state it is located in and indeed by the entire citizenry of the United States; b) at least partially but often significantly funded by federal and state tax dollars, and; c) operated as an entity of the government by the state (why else are they called Boise State University, University of Idaho etc); and their employees (professors, administration, and support personnel alike) are state employees, receiving their pay and benefits from the state.
So...isn't a state university, even one with an administrative exemption, guilty of violating our federal and state Constitutional rights when they refuse to allow us to lawfully OC or CC our weapons on what is essentially OUR property...taxpayer property?? And for that matter, isn't a state which GRANTS such an exemption to their public universities ALSO guilty of violating our Constitutional rights? They are both entities of the government, and hence they are the very entities that the Bill of Rights were written to protect us against!!
So how is it that no one...no individual person or lawyer, no state AG or even the ACLU, the supposed watchdogs of our freedoms, (like they will ever do anything to help gun owners) has ever seen fit to challenge this in court?
Am I wrong in my thinking? I don't believe that I am.
Dave
(I originally posted this in another part of the forum, but I think it deserves its own spot here too. I wrote this in response to a CC question by vandal for when he goes to the Boise State University campus...except that I made a few minor changes and added the paragraph below to THIS posting for clarification).
As most of you are probably aware, in many states, even those where OC or CC is legal and/or they have preemption, it is still unlawful to OC or CC on a college or university campus. The way the state usually achieves this is by allowing the college or university to have an "exemption" to the law, which lets them make administrative rules barring the carrying of weapons for self defense, both by law abiding students and the law abiding public as well.
I have given this university exemption thing a lot of thought. My thinking also applies to the practice of barring law biding citizens from OC'ing or CC'ing on public school property (K-12), the post office, local libraries, and anywhere else that is supposedly "allowed" to have different rules. I would even say this includes the county and federal courthouses and their offices, as well as local and city offices.
But for now let's address college and university campuses. I am wondering how it is possible for them to get away with this, even with an exemption granted by the state. Here is my line of thinking, who agrees with me on this?
1) The first ten Amendments to the United States Constitution are collectively known as the Bill of Rights. These 10 amendments were specifically written to safeguard the INDIVIDUAL'S rights (as opposed to state's rights etc. in the remaining amendments) from being violated by the government (federal, state or local, doesn't matter).
2) The Constitution exists to safeguard our God given rights from being violated by the government (federal, state, local) OR its employees/representatives...ANY branch of ANY government, or ANY person or person's representing the government, it doesn't matter!!
3) A public university is a) public property, and as such it is technically owned by the taxpayers of the state it is located in and indeed by the entire citizenry of the United States; b) at least partially but often significantly funded by federal and state tax dollars, and; c) operated as an entity of the government by the state (why else are they called Boise State University, University of Idaho etc); and their employees (professors, administration, and support personnel alike) are state employees, receiving their pay and benefits from the state.
So...isn't a state university, even one with an administrative exemption, guilty of violating our federal and state Constitutional rights when they refuse to allow us to lawfully OC or CC our weapons on what is essentially OUR property...taxpayer property?? And for that matter, isn't a state which GRANTS such an exemption to their public universities ALSO guilty of violating our Constitutional rights? They are both entities of the government, and hence they are the very entities that the Bill of Rights were written to protect us against!!
So how is it that no one...no individual person or lawyer, no state AG or even the ACLU, the supposed watchdogs of our freedoms, (like they will ever do anything to help gun owners) has ever seen fit to challenge this in court?
Am I wrong in my thinking? I don't believe that I am.
Dave
Or does it mean that Virginia universities lack the courage of their convictions? :idea