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Thread: OpenCarry....Any Court Cases Prove It.....

  1. #1
    Regular Member MarlboroLts5150's Avatar
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    Here in the State of Hawaii open or concealedcarry of a firearm is expressly outlawed unless you can get a permit, which is next to impossible considering we are a "may-issue" state. I've been researching here on OCDO and the rest of the web for almost a month now. I'm looking for court case decisions that stated clearly that the open carry of a firearm in and of it self is not a crime, it is a right afforded us by the 2A, and cannot be restricted, require a permit, be outlawed....you get the point.

    Currently there are 2bills headed to commitee....SB327(concealed carry permit) and SB328(open carry permit) both change the wording from "may-issue" to "Shall-issue". At first I assumedthat SB328would be a good thing, a step forward, considering the laws in this state. But the more research I've done, I realize that this is a huge jump in the WRONG direction. Once it becomes a privledge, it becomes something that, as right now, can be disallowed by law, no longer a right.

    The wording in the State Constitution is IDENTICAL to 2A....

    "Section 17.A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. [Ren Const Con 1978 and election Nov 7, 1978]".....with the following case note attached...."Right to bear arms may be regulated by the State in a reasonable manner.82 H. 143, 920 P.2d 357."

    I need court case decisions to help in the fight here. I'm new to most of this, never been too political, so I'm on a STEEP learning here. I already have "Nordyke vs. King", "Heller", the AG memo in WI......I'd like more than just these, I don't want to bring "just enough" ammunition to the fight, I want to overwhelm to the point that they say "WE GIVE UP!!!" Any help at all is greatly appreciated. I'm posting this in theOpen Carry BrigadeForum as well. Thks.
    "My dedication to my country's flag rests on my ardent belief in this noblest of causes, equality for all. If my future rests under this earth rather than upon it, I fear not."

    -Leopold Karpeles, US Civil War Medal of Honor Recipient

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    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
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    shall not be infringed. [Ren Const Con 1978 and election Nov 7, 1978]".....with the following case note attached...."Right to bear arms may be regulated by the State in a reasonable manner.82 H. 143, 920 P.2d 357."

    The 'regulated' nonsense is in direct contradiction to 'shall not be infringed'. What is the definition of 'reasonable'? Who determines 'reasonable'?

    Rights are not granted by government. Rights are recognized, protected or DENIED. No right requires permit or license.

    Hawaii does whatever it wants. It's the most foreign place I've lived in the 'States. (I shipped over for orders to 'Nam just t get the hell outtaOahu in early '71.)


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    Well Hawaii is in the 9th Circuit and it just incorporated the Second Amendment, so you have that going for you! Don't give any ground. Open-carry is a right not a privilege!

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    Regular Member SAvage410's Avatar
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    MarlboroLts5150 wrote:
    Here in the State of Hawaii open or concealedcarry of a firearm is expressly outlawed unless you can get a permit, which is next to impossible considering we are a "may-issue" state. I've been researching here on OCDO and the rest of the web for almost a month now. I'm looking for court case decisions that stated clearly that the open carry of a firearm in and of it self is not a crime, it is a right afforded us by the 2A, and cannot be restricted, require a permit, be outlawed....you get the point.

    Currently there are 2bills headed to commitee....SB327(concealed carry permit) and SB328(open carry permit) both change the wording from "may-issue" to "Shall-issue". At first I assumedthat SB328would be a good thing, a step forward, considering the laws in this state. But the more research I've done, I realize that this is a huge jump in the WRONG direction. Once it becomes a privledge, it becomes something that, as right now, can be disallowed by law, no longer a right.

    The wording in the State Constitution is IDENTICAL to 2A....

    "Section 17.A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. [Ren Const Con 1978 and election Nov 7, 1978]".....with the following case note attached...."Right to bear arms may be regulated by the State in a reasonable manner.82 H. 143, 920 P.2d 357."

    I need court case decisions to help in the fight here. I'm new to most of this, never been too political, so I'm on a STEEP learning here. I already have "Nordyke vs. King", "Heller", the AG memo in WI......I'd like more than just these, I don't want to bring "just enough" ammunition to the fight, I want to overwhelm to the point that they say "WE GIVE UP!!!" Any help at all is greatly appreciated. I'm posting this in theOpen Carry BrigadeForum as well. Thks.
    I don't have any court cases to cite, but if you really need to do research, the best place to go is PACER.

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    I would cite DC v Heller. Pretty clear.
    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

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    Regular Member MarlboroLts5150's Avatar
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    OC4me wrote:
    Well Hawaii is in the 9th Circuit and it just incorporated the Second Amendment, so you have that going for you! Don't give any ground. Open-carry is a right not a privilege!
    True that. Myself as well as a few others here are jumping into a long fight thats been going on for a long time without much success. Got the Nordyke case as well as several others. Just gonna take some time to do this right the first time.
    "My dedication to my country's flag rests on my ardent belief in this noblest of causes, equality for all. If my future rests under this earth rather than upon it, I fear not."

    -Leopold Karpeles, US Civil War Medal of Honor Recipient

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    Regular Member MarlboroLts5150's Avatar
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    SAvage410 wrote:
    MarlboroLts5150 wrote:
    I don't have any court cases to cite, but if you really need to do research, the best place to go is PACER.
    Thanks, I'll check it out.
    "My dedication to my country's flag rests on my ardent belief in this noblest of causes, equality for all. If my future rests under this earth rather than upon it, I fear not."

    -Leopold Karpeles, US Civil War Medal of Honor Recipient

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    Regular Member MarlboroLts5150's Avatar
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    wrightme wrote:
    I would cite DC v Heller. Pretty clear.
    Got that one, too.
    "My dedication to my country's flag rests on my ardent belief in this noblest of causes, equality for all. If my future rests under this earth rather than upon it, I fear not."

    -Leopold Karpeles, US Civil War Medal of Honor Recipient

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    Founder's Club Member - Moderator Gray Peterson's Avatar
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    Hey guys,

    The Sykes case in California deals with handgun carry licenses there in terms of getting issuance of licenses on a shall-issue basis. If we win on the 9th CIrcuit court of appeal, we'll win the right in Heller.

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    The biggest question I guess would be why haven't the people of Hawaii stood up together before. Oh, wait, I know. everyone here believes in "living with Aloha" Tell that to the servicemembers, and regular citizens that have ended up in the Hospitals because they are not allowed to OC or CC. I love it here........:celebrate

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    I'm not a lawyer, but see Florida v. JL and US v. Ubiles. According to FL v. JL there's no firearms exemption to the 4th Amendment. Without RAS that you are or have committed a crime there's no legal basis for a Terry stop. Basically, carry if you want, but if you break the law and the cop sees it (barring the sight of your weapon) you'll need deep pockets and a good lawyer. Absent RAS for the stop you can easily get the rest thrown out. But it'll cost you money.

    A grand jury might easily indict, but if you're ever on a grand jury you can no-bill the charges and (eventually) overturn state law.

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