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Thread: Point of impact issue

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    So, I am consistently pulling straight left on my shots. Both the initial double action and the later single action shots. Pretty much just completely left, no real up or down issue. I'm right handed shooting a S&W 45. Most of my shots today were the 7 yrd, prepping for my CCP class.

    What I can determine is that I am rolling my wrist over when I pull the trigger and forcing the barrel left at the end of the pull. If I really focus I can lessen it. Shooting 2 handed helps a bit. Does anyone know of an excercise or a way to work on this? Obviously practice, but anything in particular. Too much finger, not enough pad?

    Granted it's not the worst amount. I'm pretty consistently in the 9 ring at 7 yards, just tearing up the left side of it. MaybeI should just aim for the other side of the 9 and put them in the mid. I prefer to hit where I am aiming though. Thanks for any help!

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    Too little trigger finger

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    LEO 229 wrote:
    Too little trigger finger
    Before I pick up another bad habit some clarification. If I am using the pad of my trigger finger I would need to get closer in to the first joint? Is that what you were thinking? Lots of experience behind the trigger of a rifle, and I try to use the pad of my finger there. Handling a handgun, particularly trying to fire multiple shots, is still a work in progress. Thanks for the input!

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  5. #5
    Regular Member MSC 45ACP's Avatar
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    Most "malfunctions" in shot placement fall in the "anticipation" category. A proper trigger squeeze requires the hammer to fall without the sight allignment being disturbed.

    Finger placement: The middle of your fingerprint should be right in the middle of the trigger. No more, no less. This way, you have more "feeling" in your finger and can feel the pressure being exerted on the trigger.

    The Shot: You must be able to have a consistent trigger squeeze. This is much easier said than done.
    For your first double action shot: Slow, increasing pressure on the trigger until the hammer falls. When the hammer falls, you should be SUPRISED!

    How much do you dry fire? Most modern weapons can be dry fired without any damage being done to the hammer and other parts of the gun. .22's are an exception. DO NOT DRY FIRE a .22 on an empty chamber unless absolutely necessary. Quite often, the striker of a .22 will "ding" the side of the chamber of your weapon. You can stick a piece of empty brass in the chamber and drop the hammer on that. When you store your weapons, all springs should be in a "relaxed" condition. Same goes with ammo magazines... Don't keep them loaded for more than a month or 2 without rotating them to another magazine. If you do, you're likely to only get a couple shots off when you need them and the rest will literally fall out of your magazine when you eject it due to the compressed magazine spring, but I digress here; we were discussing trigger control...

    Dry Firing: Some people (Marines for one example) feel that for every round you put downrange, you should have dry fired 1,000 times. Think that is excessive? Try it. Dry firing WORKS!

    Method for pulling the trigger, making the hammer fall without disturbing the sight alignment: Slow, Increasing pressure until the hammer falls. Try visualizing the second hand of an electric clock. it doesn't slow down, stop or go backwards. As you visualize the sweep second hand of that clock, you are increasing the pressure on the trigger... a little more, a little more, a little more... then CLICK (or BANG), the hammer falls, the discharge suprises the @#% out of you and you don't even need to look at the target. if your sights were lined up when the weapon went off and the weapon truly suprised you, the ONLY place that shot cold possibly have gone is the center of the target.

    You do the same for follow up rounds in single action. if you're shooting an auto like a Beretta 92FS (Military M9), you will first need to take the SLACK out of the trigger before your trigger squeeze actually begins. I consider this part of the aiming in process. After you line the sights up, take the slack out of the trigger until you encounter resistance. By now you know where that point is on your pistol. After you have encountered resistance, take a deep breath and let it halfway out, then begin your trigger squeeze... If you need to take another breath before the hammer falls, then let the slack back out and start over from there. Breathing and shooting are NOT compatible. You may do one or the other, but not both at the same time! Other autos are the same way. Revolvers are different. You didn't clarify which you were shooting, so I assumed it was an auto.

    This is a lot of stuff to read and sometimes hard to pick up just by reading it. If you're interested in hands-on help, PM me and we'll meet at a range somewhere and do some shooting!

    Mike
    "If I know that I am headed for a fight, I want something larger with more power, preferably crew-served.
    However, like most of us, as I go through my daily life, I carry something a bit more compact, with a lot less power."
    (unknown 'gun~writer')

    Remington 1911 R1 (Back to Basics)
    SERPA retention or concealed...

    "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~Thomas Jefferson
    (Borrowed from "The Perfect Day" by LTC Dave Grossman)

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    Regular Member MSC 45ACP's Avatar
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    OOPS. I didn't pay attention to WHAT you were shooting. If you're doing that atonly 7 yards, you're jerking the #@$^ out of the trigger. Seek Professional Help. I am available, just let me know...
    "If I know that I am headed for a fight, I want something larger with more power, preferably crew-served.
    However, like most of us, as I go through my daily life, I carry something a bit more compact, with a lot less power."
    (unknown 'gun~writer')

    Remington 1911 R1 (Back to Basics)
    SERPA retention or concealed...

    "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~Thomas Jefferson
    (Borrowed from "The Perfect Day" by LTC Dave Grossman)

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    Click here to download your diagnostic target of choice.

    Shoot at it, and it will tell you the problem(s).

  8. #8
    Regular Member MSC 45ACP's Avatar
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    Pamiam wrote:
    Click here to download your diagnostic target of choice.

    Shoot at it, and it will tell you the problem(s).
    There is no replacement for a well-qualified marksmanship instructor.

    You can watch all the YouTube videos in the world, play all the interactive shooting games you want and read until you are cross-eyed, but the fact remains: If you want to improve your shooting skills, you should seekinstruction from a QUALIFIED (NRA or Military) Small Arms Instructor.


    "If I know that I am headed for a fight, I want something larger with more power, preferably crew-served.
    However, like most of us, as I go through my daily life, I carry something a bit more compact, with a lot less power."
    (unknown 'gun~writer')

    Remington 1911 R1 (Back to Basics)
    SERPA retention or concealed...

    "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~Thomas Jefferson
    (Borrowed from "The Perfect Day" by LTC Dave Grossman)

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    Thanks for all the help. I did some google searching and got some info too. It was inline with what you are saying MSC. I should have probably given a bit more info but did not want to muddy the response. I am shooting a S&W mod 457 45 auto. I was jerking the trigger on many of the shots. Partly due to the fact that I was practicing drawing, sighting, and taking a first shot. A few double taps too. I was also doing a lot of DAO shooting, to replicate the first shot. So I was not really setting at the line taking a lot of time to site, squeeze, and fire. It deffinately pointed out an issue with my form, so that is what I was interested in.

    In reality I could probably live with the results I was getting. All shots stayed on target just left of center and inch or two. At 7 yards you are probably getting on the far side of what a civilian defensive shooting would be. But the better your form the better you will perform under pressure. And I like to be as accurate as possible with my weapon, whether rifle or pistol. Looks like I'll be doing some dry firing practice, after I check, check, and check again that the pistol is unloaded.



  10. #10
    Regular Member MSC 45ACP's Avatar
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    That's awesome, Chief.

    Another way to improve is to get into IDPA. Its a little like IPSC, but you shoot stock or nearly stock carry guns, not space guns. Do a Google search for IDPA matches in your area. They're a LOT of fun to shoot.
    "If I know that I am headed for a fight, I want something larger with more power, preferably crew-served.
    However, like most of us, as I go through my daily life, I carry something a bit more compact, with a lot less power."
    (unknown 'gun~writer')

    Remington 1911 R1 (Back to Basics)
    SERPA retention or concealed...

    "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~Thomas Jefferson
    (Borrowed from "The Perfect Day" by LTC Dave Grossman)

  11. #11
    Regular Member Riana's Avatar
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    Pamiam wrote:
    Click here to download your diagnostic target of choice.

    Shoot at it, and it will tell you the problem(s).
    Thank you for posting that, Pamiam. I was trying to figure out how to reverse the right-handed target so I could use it for left-handed shooting. Now I don't have to.

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