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Thread: Open Carry Downtown Milwaukee

  1. #1
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    I am planning on open carrying in downtown Milwaukee this Saturday afternoon. Several of my friends, including Jake (the guy who made the cool open cary tshirt) will be coming with. I'm planning on Wisconsin Ave and Grand Ave mall. Anyone who'd like to come with, consider yourself invited. PM me for my cell number.

    Also, rumor has it that Jesus G. may be coming with us....

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    I would love to go. Have to work though.Bring a tape recorder!

  3. #3
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    i asked a LEO and he said i can still get arrest for OC in milwaukee county. What time you going? i might come too..

    may i ask what the sole purpose of this is? i'm guessing to see if we'll all get arrested and charge eh? i'm down for it if i aint alone..

    give me more info and i'll see if i can make it

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    Any officer can arrest anyone for any random thing. The officer and police department can also face a federal civil rights lawsuit and have to have their insurance coverer shell out millions of dollars as a result of said arrest.

  5. #5
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    Is that why my insurance payments are so high!? lol j/k If I don't have work to do on saturday I hope to join you guys. Will report back when I know.

    Ben

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    I'm down. (town)




  7. #7
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    So I figure I should say a bit about organization.

    -People with video cameras, please bring them. If you are bringing a gun, for your own sake please bring a voice recorder.

    -People with a problem with police officers, please do not come. My father is an LEO and the sooner we make friends with law enforcement, the sooner we can practice our rights in peace. Conflict sucks. They just need education to understand that we're on their side.

    -Bring a smile if you're coming with. We will have fun, we will be responsible, we will be patriots who appreciate both private citizens who own shops and police who help keep our city safe.

    -I will post very soon the time and location of our meet. The game plan is for wisconsin ave and grand avenue mall, but anyone who wants to double-check my research and verify where our limits are as far as the oppressive "school zone" law are would be much appreciated :-)

    Plan on 12pm Saturday, and maybe 4-5pm sunday, depending on how many of us are oppressed on saturday.

    Comments and feedback always welcome.

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    Better check out the malls and make sure some university or community college isn't leasing store space for classrooms. Wouldn't want to get tripped up by any surprises.

  9. #9
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    Task Force 16 wrote:
    Better check out the malls and make sure some university or community college isn't leasing store space for classrooms. Wouldn't want to get tripped up by any surprises.
    Only grades 1 - 12 count as schools in our school zone law. We cannot enter the food court in grand ave mallas it is an area marked in a class B license. Wisconsin avenue is actually clear of school zones (I overestimated the reach of the school zone when I was there last time), so walking to the lake is possible.

    eleuthera wrote:
    They (police)just need education to understand that we're on their side.
    They already have all the education required from the AG opinion. In Milwaukee, policeare ignoring it on purpose. Expect to be"misunderstood" if you try to explain to them that your on their side. They have been ordered tonot get into philosophical conversations with us so they will not even try to understand you.

    Best to say nothing at all and try to go about your lawful business, if they shouldinterfere you should either; A) give your name and address, then cooperate, B)give name and address thenask whether you are free to go, or C) and this may get you arrested for contempt of cop, but remain silent,refuse consent to everythingand state you do not wish to speak with officers of the law.

    Option A may get you arrested if you talk too much, so I suggest option B if you don't want to be arrested. I am an option C man myself. I may or may not be able to make it on Sunday (Mother's Day), but Saturday I will be there.

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    If the MPD honors the memo sent out by the chief of MPD, you guys should not have a problem if you open carry lawfully. Read the memo again and it would not hurt to print it and have it on you. http://media.journalinteractive.com/...s/bulletin.pdf

  11. #11
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    They are still going to perform what might amount to an illegal seizure during their Terry stop. If I'm approached, I would immediately ask if I am free to go. If I am not free to leave, the next words out of my mouth would be that I do not concent to a search of my person or to the seizure of my possesions. The act of seizing my property for a Terry stop should be a violation of my constitutional rights. I think that civil rights case will bring into alignment the state's LEO response should they be punished monitarily.
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 - "A wise man's heart inclines him to the right, but the fool's heart to the left."

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    pvtschultz wrote:
    They are still going to perform what might amount to an illegal seizure during their Terry stop. If I'm approached, I would immediately ask if I am free to go. If I am not free to leave, the next words out of my mouth would be that I do not concent to a search of my person or to the seizure of my possesions. The act of seizing my property for a Terry stop should be a violation of my constitutional rights. I think that civil rights case will bring into alignment the state's LEO response should they be punished monitarily.
    I think the best approach right now is to play ball with consensual encounters - if you are being relatively discreet and going about your business, it is not likely there will be any police response in the first place, or alternatively, you will be gone before the police arrive. This is new to everybody folks, so let's not try to get into confrontations

    And watch out for those school zones!

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    Questions: Do colleges count as schools? I thought the law only said k-12, but it's determined by tax indentification, correct? Where can we check to see if these orgs are considered schools? Churches and colleges may be licensed as schools...we need to look into this.

    and please tell me these places aren't considered schools:

    http://www.thespeechcarecenter.com/

    milwaukeeturners.org



    Here is my first set of limitations on our walkabout. Obviously it's not perfect, and I'm open to revisions:

    4th street on the west

    Clybourne for the southern border

    Wells to the north

    River on the east.

    Parabellum, I know where you're coming from on the issue of cops ignoring the law. How I see it islike Abraham Lincoln said: "When I make them my friends, do I not destroy my enemies?" Some cops are going to be jerks, some cops are just gonna listen to their boss, some are going to root us on. The sooner cops figure out the truth (which is that we're law-abiding patriots not looking for trouble or attention), the sooner they'll be just as sick and tired of MWAG's as we are.

    I'm looking forward to the day that a cop walks up and says "hey man, some wuss called complaining that you have a gun. The boss is making me come down here for no good reason. So how about them Packers?"

    Your advice on not arguing the law is legit. I'm just saying my strategy will be: be friendly, keep quiet.

    :-)

  14. #14
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    eleuthera wrote:
    Questions: Do colleges count as schools? I thought the law only said k-12, but it's determined by tax indentification, correct?
    What does the statute say - as an activist, you should be able to look it up and explain it to others.

  15. #15
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    Only K-12 institutions count in the 1000' school zone in WI.
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 - "A wise man's heart inclines him to the right, but the fool's heart to the left."

  16. #16
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    pvtschultz wrote:
    Only K-12 institutions count in the 1000' school zone in WI.
    Let's watch the misinformation. Kindergarten is NOT included.

    948.61(1)(b)
    (b) "School" means a public, parochial or private school which provides an educational program for one or more grades between grades 1 and 12 and which is commonly known as an elementary school, middle school, junior high school, senior high school or high school.
    - What da hay?

    Keep Calm and Carry On

  17. #17
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    948.605 Gun−free school zones. (1) DEFINITIONS. In this
    section:
    (a) “Encased” has the meaning given in s. 167.31 (1) (b).
    (ac) “Firearm” does not include any beebee or pellet−firing
    gun that expels a projectile through the force of air pressure or any
    starter pistol.
    (am) “Motor vehicle” has the meaning given in s. 340.01 (35).
    (b) “School” has the meaning given in s. 948.61 (1) (b).
    (c) “School zone” means any of the following:
    1. In or on the grounds of a school.
    2. Within 1,000 feet from the grounds of a school.
    (2) POSSESSION OF FIREARM IN SCHOOL ZONE. (a) Any individual
    who knowingly possesses a firearm at a place that the individual
    knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone is
    guilty of a Class I felony.
    (b) Paragraph (a) does not apply to the possession of a firearm:
    1. On private property not part of school grounds;
    2. If the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so
    by a political subdivision of the state or bureau of alcohol, tobacco
    and firearms in which political subdivision the school zone is
    located, and the law of the political subdivision requires that,
    before an individual may obtain such a license, the law enforcement
    authorities of the political subdivision must verify that the
    individual is qualified under law to receive the license;
    3. That is not loaded and is:
    a. Encased; or
    b. In a locked firearms rack that is on a motor vehicle;
    4. By an individual for use in a program approved by a school
    in the school zone;
    5. By an individual in accordance with a contract entered into
    between a school in the school zone and the individual or an
    employer of the individual;
    6. By a law enforcement officer or state−certified commission
    warden acting in his or her official capacity; or
    7. That is unloaded and is possessed by an individual while
    traversing school grounds for the purpose of gaining access to
    public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school
    grounds is authorized by school authorities.
    8. By a person who is legally hunting in a school forest if the
    school board has decided that hunting may be allowed in the
    school forest under s. 120.13 (38).
    (3) DISCHARGE OF FIREARM IN A SCHOOL ZONE. (a) Any individual
    who knowingly, or with reckless disregard for the safety of
    another, discharges or attempts to discharge a firearm at a place the
    individual knows is a school zone is guilty of a Class G felony.
    (b) Paragraph (a) does not apply to the discharge of, or the
    attempt to discharge, a firearm:
    1. On private property not part of school grounds;
    2. As part of a program approved by a school in the school
    zone, by an individual who is participating in the program;
    3. By an individual in accordance with a contract entered into
    between a school in a school zone and the individual or an
    employer of the individual; or
    4. By a law enforcement officer or state−certified commission
    warden acting in his or her official capacity.
    History: 1991 a. 17; 1993 a. 336; 2001 a. 109; 2005 a. 290; 2007 a. 27.

    948.61 Dangerous weapons other than firearms on
    school premises. (1) In this section:
    (a) “Dangerous weapon” has the meaning specified in s.
    939.22 (10), except “dangerous weapon” does not include any
    firearm and does include any beebee or pellet−firing gun that
    expels a projectile through the force of air pressure or any starter
    pistol.
    (b) “School” means a public, parochial or private school which
    provides an educational program for one or more grades between
    grades 1 and 12 and which is commonly known as an elementary
    school, middle school, junior high school, senior high school or
    high school.
    (c) “School premises” means any school building, grounds,
    recreation area or athletic field or any other property owned, used
    or operated for school administration.
    (2) Any person who knowingly possesses or goes armed with
    a dangerous weapon on school premises is guilty of:
    (a) A Class A misdemeanor.
    (b) A Class I felony, if the violation is the person’s 2nd or subsequent
    violation of this section within a 5−year period, as measured
    from the dates the violations occurred.
    (3) This section does not apply to any person who:
    (a) Uses a weapon solely for school−sanctioned purposes.
    (b) Engages in military activities, sponsored by the federal or
    state government, when acting in the discharge of his or her official
    duties.
    (c) Is a law enforcement officer or state−certified commission
    warden acting in the discharge of his or her official duties.
    (d) Participates in a convocation authorized by school authorities
    in which weapons of collectors or instructors are handled or
    displayed.
    (e) Drives a motor vehicle in which a dangerous weapon is
    located onto school premises for school−sanctioned purposes or
    for the purpose of delivering or picking up passengers or property.
    The weapon may not be removed from the vehicle or be used in
    any manner.
    (f) Possesses or uses a bow and arrow or knife while legally
    hunting in a school forest if the school board has decided that hunting
    may be allowed in the school forest under s. 120.13 (38).
    (4) A person under 17 years of age who has violated this section
    is subject to the provisions of ch. 938, unless jurisdiction is
    waived under s. 938.18 or the person is subject to the jurisdiction
    of a court of criminal jurisdiction under s. 938.183.
    History: 1987 a. 332; 1991 a. 17; 1993 a. 336; 1995 a. 27, 77; 2001 a. 109; 2005
    a. 290; 2007 a. 27.
    Pellet guns and BB guns are dangerous weapons under this section. Interest of
    Michelle A.D. 181 Wis. 2d 917, 512 N.W.2d 248 (Ct. App. 1994).

  18. #18
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    My in-laws are in town, so i'm not sure I can make it. Dont count me out yet though. I will be checking back to look for updates to the meeting time/place.

    As preiously mentioned, Professionalism is key. Haircuts, clean shaven etc MAY help, but definitely will not hurt.

  19. #19
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    As preiously mentioned, Professionalism is key. Haircuts, clean shaven etc MAY help, but definitely will not hurt.

    A good friend once told me "you shouldn't have to look a certain way to exercise your constitutional rights" I agree.

    Come as you are, just be polite and respectful of your fellow man. As a matter of principle police need to learn to recognize illegal behavior, not judge based on appearance.

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    *

  21. #21
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    If you're coming with, please make sure to read Fuhrer Flynn's code of conduct guide for his "troops."

    http://media.journalinteractive.com/...s/bulletin.pdf



    Like I said though, I believe our best course of action will be to identify ourselves, wish them a good day, and thank them for their service. If they illegally take our guns, even for a second, they've got a lawsuit coming.



    We're seeking NORMALIZATION: if cops anticipate a confrontation every time they respond to a MWAG call, it will feed conflict. If we cooperate (within reason) and make their lives easier, they will eventually reciprocate.



    And if good old fashioned friendliness doesn't win them over, the coming civil rights lawsuits will :-D

    Plan on meeting on the corner of 2nd and Wisconsin. And be careful that where you park isn't inside a school zone! Lastly, can someone please verify the boundaries I listed above? Can't hurt to double check :-)



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    we are a go for noon today! See everybody there :-)

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    eleuthera wrote:
    we are a go for noon today! See everybody there :-)
    Good luck. Be safe.

  24. #24
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    Security called police. My gun was seized illegally but eventually returned. I was interviewed by the news and I will on Channel 12 ~5pm. Whole thing audio recorded, I wasn't charged with anything. Jesus G. tried to met up with us today but we didn't have each others' phone numbers. Mike, I asked the reporter to call you to get your opinion on all this - I'm not sure if he'll follow through.

    THEY HAVE A MAP OF SCHOOL ZONES! Can someone please FOI that bad boy?


    More details and pictures will come soon.

    Anyone up for an open carry tomorrow?



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