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Thread: School Zone Freedom of Information Act Requests

  1. #1
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    MPD has maps of the school zones in Milwaukee that are not released to the public. Attached is my non-lawyer written but hopefully sufficient FOIA request that I'll be sending to the MPD soon. Please post your requests to you friendly neighborhood police departments, the results (did they give you the run-around?), and any information you receive.

    Maybe now we'll have the information we need to avoid committing a felony!

    FYI I'll be sending mine to District 3 since that's where records are apparently kept.

  2. #2
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    Can't open the file, but thanks for getting it going for all of us.

    Watch, the map is all blacked out...

  3. #3
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    the file is in word 2007 - time to update your MS Office

    Also, in WI the law is called "Open Records" law instead of FOIA.

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    Yep, had to run an update for my (now old) office.

    The letter looks good to me. Any idea how long this kind of request should take?

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    The Wisconsin AG's office guidelines state 10 days.

    http://www.doj.state.wi.us/AWP/2007O...PR_Outline.pdf
    DOJ policy is that ten working days is generally a reasonable time for response, or, if the response cannot be completed within that time, a communication indicating that a response is being prepared.

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran Flipper's Avatar
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    When in danger you can dial 911 and hope for the police to arrive a few minutes later armed with guns.
    Why do police carry guns?

    The Joyce Foundation funded firearm control empire:
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...lFundingR1.png

    "Everything that we see is a shadow cast by that which we do not see." - Martin Luther King Jr.

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  11. #11
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    I think you have a typo in your return address. No?

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    Pointman wrote:
    1000' is actually 0.1894 miles. If you figure there are usually 10 blocks per mile, a two block radius should be enough. However, the older the city, the smaller the block size, typically. Milwaukee is an older city, so many sections will have 17 blocks per mile, meaning each block is 311', and 3 blocks would be 933'. There are some sections of the city with larger superblocks, so it's hard to calculate distance based on how many blocks away from something you are.

    Another thing you may notice is city blocks are often rectangular, so travelling three North-South blocks isn't the same distance as three East-West blocks in the same area.
    Careful.

    Around here it's 16 blocks to a mile, not 10. The "big streets" usually go every half a mile - 68th, 76th, 84th, 92nd, etc.
    - What da hay?

    Keep Calm and Carry On

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    Pointman, thanks for the great work. Is there a clearer copy of that map though?

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    SHAM-WOW. That's absolutely ludicrous, I had no idea it was that bad.



    Looks like we're gonna spend a lot of time downtown...

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    If I remember correctly the map that the officer had last saturday was in color.

    The map has significantly more detail when the streets are in yellow, which has been lost when it was replicated in black and white.

    was it given in color when you recieved it Pointman? or did they give you a photocopy?



    great work none the less! :celebrate

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    Even more confusing than I thought.

    Milwaukee is typically laid out with 16 blocks per mile east west, and 8 blocks per mile north south. Hahahha.
    - What da hay?

    Keep Calm and Carry On

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    Holy black dots Batman! This school zone statute has got to be unconstitutional since it prohibits the majority of the citizens of Milwaukee from exercising their constitutional right to protect themselve.
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 - "A wise man's heart inclines him to the right, but the fool's heart to the left."

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    The games played in this bulletin are interesting.

    First, note that the bulletin conveniently fails to mention that a school zone does not include private property. 948.605(2)(b)(1) Stats.

    Next, notice the completely dishonest attempt to try to expand the definition of a school zone. The bulletin states that the definition of a school for the purpose of identifying a school zone includes those areas described in 948.61(1)(c), however the school zone statute clearly and expressly includes ONLY those areas within a 1000' (not including private property) of places defined in 948.61(1)(b)-- and ONLY those places described in 948.61(1)(b).

    The training bulletin illegitimately includes areas within a thousand feet of "recreation area or athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated for school administration." If this ridiculous and unsupported expansion of the school zone definition was actually true then, as examples, school zones in Madison would include a thousand foot radius of the school district administration building on Dayton Street, even though there is no school and no children at that location, plus it would include a thousand foot radius around the Pflaum Road Madison School District kitchen facility where meals for the Madison schools are prepared even though the nearest school is at least 3/4's of a mile away.

    The Milwaukee PD bulletin is flawed, incomplete and deceitful. Is anyone surprised?

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    A patriotic MPD officer got in touch with me and gave me the official map!

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    Interesting...

    For purposes of defining school grounds or premises, it shall
    mean “any school building, grounds, recreation area or
    athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated
    for school administration”
    Contradicts state law. And there is a LOT of areas that are not school zones marked in that PDF.

    - What da hay?

    Keep Calm and Carry On

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    Pointman wrote:
    eleuthera wrote:
    Pointman, thanks for the great work. Is there a clearer copy of that map though?
    I'm sure there is a high--tax-dollar-recipient version, but I received the low-budget-tax-payerversion. That's the best quality providable for what I received. An MPD officer provided it immediately and at no cost, evidence there are definitely some good guys on the force [because they're not supposed to help us out, go figure].

    Here's the problem I've seen all throughout this: Government is actively working against law-abiding citizens on multiple levels. Often they claim it's a hassle to work with us and it's easier to deny rights, cuff and stuff, even though we're the taxpayer working to assist them in doing their job (kind of like a boss that not only pays you well but actively works to help you succeed). At the same time, the criminals they're paid to keep off the streets are given a few days jail time, no fine, and put back on the street. In essence, if you have money the government will take it, if you don't they won't.

    In this instance officers aren't supposed to give a copy of the map to people who want to remain within the law. The attitude from the top is cuff and stuff [at gunpoint]. It's blatant discrimination against law-abiding citizens.

    (New and Improved TOTAL RANT button activated)

    Now I ask: What are you doing about it? Complaining? Not going to the park while open carrying because it costs too much, andwaiting for someone else to do the job for you? That's the reason Wisconsin didn't have the ability to open carry until now, because nobody would step up and stand up. Two guys did it and they get a pat on the back and have to pay their own legal bills. Most OpenCarry members wouldn't even pony up one night of beer money (or their $35 NRA dues). Granted, a few OpenCarry members stepped up and really helped out when the court cases were happening, but what about the rest of us, and what about now?

    If you think they handled their case wrong and don't want to help out you now have the perfect opportunity to handle it the way you want to: go carry in a Milwaukee city park. People here will video you doing nothing but soaking up the sun, so there will be plenty of evidence. Heck, call the police chief a few days in advance and invite him. Bring a copy of the preemption statute with you. Do it the way you want, just do it. If you can't, or won't, help out those who did.
    Whats the penalty if I did? Just for curiosity sake.

  23. #23
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    If you think they handled their case wrong and don't want to help out you now have the perfect opportunity to handle it the way you want to: go carry in a Milwaukee city park.

    Hmmm is this the same pointman who said in another thread that he'd never goad someone into open carrying? dude... Dr. Jekyll Mr. Hyde? Who is it???

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    Teej wrote:
    Interesting...

    For purposes of defining school grounds or premises, it shall
    mean “any school building, grounds, recreation area or
    athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated
    for school administration”
    Contradicts state law. And there is a LOT of areas that are not school zones marked in that PDF.
    Not necessarily. The grounds will cover anything that is on it, and the grounds may contain any of those items. 1000' is from the edge of school property. However, a maintenance building by itself not on school property (say across the street) would not fall into this category since the building itself is not "commonly known as a school".

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