imported post
I am not a lawyer.
I am going to opine that the law is unconstitutionally vague.
The word
stop is often used interchangeablywith
Terry-stop and detention. I've seen cops on this forum do it. But, I've also seen it used in the context of a consensual encounter by police on this forum, though less often.
I'm betting that 4th Amendment case law which sets out the standardsfor an involuntary encounter/detention/
Terry-stop overridethevagueness in the law. The US Supreme Court, even the state courts, have longheld the requirements fora detention aka
Terry-stop.The point upon which things hinge, I should think, is the voluntary nature of an encounter that is not a detention orarrest. It makes little sense thatstatutes could/would override the 4A during a consensual encounterwhere there is no safety issue for the officer as discussed in numerous4A court opinions ondetentions and traffic stops. Those opinions always reference officer safetyand only authorize weapon seizureafter the point the officer has RAS. Atleast the ones I've read.
Also, it would be unconstitutional to require a prohibited possessor to notify (5th Amendment). Next, it would tend to absurdity. For example, cop asks for a donation to a charity. "I am armed officer." Or, cop says hello at the coffee counter at 7-Eleven. "I am armed officer."
However, until it shows up in a court case, I imagine some cop or prosecutor somewherecould try to charge it for even a consensual encounter.
Also, certain cops like to play their cards close to their chest. May even change the story. "Oh, yes, your honor.I told him I was detaining him to investigate the stolen ice-cream. No, he did not notify me even then." We all know how some cops can be weasels about revealing whether a detention is occurring. "Am I being detained officer?" "I just need you to answer a few questions that it would be in your best interest to answer."
Don't overlook, as mentioned above, that the OCer will likely have no way to know for sure whether the cop has genuine RAS. Recall that the courts reserve to themselves the power to determine RAS whenever it is in question in a given case. Imagine thinking the cop had no RAS,but ajudge decides he did. Suddenly thechargefor failure to notify sticks? My personal rule of thumb is to never do anything I can be charged for based on my estimation of the LEOs RAS. Get it wrong and you could have an arrest for obstruction.
I might like to suggest a little legislative initiative for next year to get the law clarified by changing the word
stop to something that has fewer possible meanings, for example,
investigative detention or
Terry-stop.
In the meantime, I wonder how it would work to very quickly ask whether you are free to go and notify if you are not. Or notify if you feel you are not free to leave regardless of whether the officer answers the question.