wrightme
Regular Member
imported post
Most likely, like the previous version, once published in the Federal Register.
Most likely, like the previous version, once published in the Federal Register.
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Senate passes bill to allow for National Park carry
- Thread starter Solar
- Start date
TFred
Regular Member
imported post
wrightme wrote:
According to Wikipedia, there is no mention of new laws being published in the Federal Register.
I'm inclined to believe that it takes effect as soon as the President signs it, but I'm no expert on the matter.
TFred
wrightme wrote:
Except that before, it was a change to a rule. This is a law, forbidding the NPS from enforcing any regulations about carrying firearms.
According to Wikipedia, there is no mention of new laws being published in the Federal Register.
I'm inclined to believe that it takes effect as soon as the President signs it, but I'm no expert on the matter.
TFred
imported post
Victory at Last
National Park Service Gun Ban Repealed!
]
http://gunowners.org/a052009.htm
Wednesday, May 20, 2009
Good news!
The U.S. House of Representatives passed a bill today that included an amendment to repeal the gun ban on National Park Service (NPS) land and wildlife refuges.
The amendment, sponsored by Senator Tom Coburn (R-OK) and attached to a credit card industry reform bill, passed the House overwhelmingly by a vote of 279-147.
For decades, law-abiding citizens have been prohibited from exercising their Second Amendment rights on NPS land and wildlife refuges, even if the state in which the land is located allows carrying firearms.
With some limited exceptions for hunting, the only way to legally possess a firearm anywhere in a national park is by having it unloaded and inaccessible, such as locked up in an automobile trunk. A Bush administration regulation partially reversed the ban, but that action was singlehandedly negated recently by an activist judge in Washington, D.C. The Department of Interior decided not to appeal that ruling.
Senator Coburn believes, like you do, that Americans should not be forced to sacrifice their Second Amendment rights when entering NPS land and wildlife refuges.
GOA worked with Coburn on an amendment that simply allows for state and local laws -- instead of unelected bureaucrats and anti gun activist judges -- to govern firearm possession on these lands.
The anti-gun leadership in both the House and Senate went berserk and fought to keep the Coburn amendment from being attached to the underlying bill. Sparks were flying on the floor of the House of Representatives today.
Anti-gun Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY) whined that a "very good" credit card bill had been "hijacked" by the Coburn amendment. To this, Rep. Rob Bishop (R-UT) pointed out that gun control is the policy of tyrants, as evidenced by the British attempt to confiscate firearms at Lexington and Concord in 1775.
Congressional leaders and entrenched bureaucrats have fought GOA over the NPS gun ban for the past eight years.
But your activism has finally broken through. The late Senator Everett Dirksen said, "When I feel the heat, I see the light!" Well, you have applied a lot of heat. Members of Congress know that they oppose your Second Amendment rights at their own peril.
As it stands today, both houses of Congress have now passed the Coburn amendment -- and President Obama is expected to sign the provision into law (only because it is part of a larger credit card bill that he really wants).
So, congratulate yourself for winning this long, hard battle. GOA was the leading, and often only, national gun group involved in this fight. Your involvement was absolutely vital to achieving this win.
Of course, many more battles lie ahead. President Obama continues to push for the Senate to ratify massive international gun control treaties. There is a battle over a Supreme Court nominee coming up. Anti-gun zealots in Congress are aggressively pushing to renew the Clinton gun ban and close down gun shows.
And as the health care debate picks up steam in the coming weeks and months, GOA is battling efforts to create a computerized national healthcare database. Such a database can be used to deny people their Second Amendment rights in the same way that so many veterans have lost their gun rights based only on the diagnoses of a doctor for things like combat-related stress.
GOA will be calling for action on these and other Second Amendment issues as they move through Congress.
In the meantime, have a safe Memorial Day as we remember those who gave the ultimate sacrifice so that America would remain "Land of the Free."
Victory at Last
National Park Service Gun Ban Repealed!
]
http://gunowners.org/a052009.htm
Wednesday, May 20, 2009
Good news!
The U.S. House of Representatives passed a bill today that included an amendment to repeal the gun ban on National Park Service (NPS) land and wildlife refuges.
The amendment, sponsored by Senator Tom Coburn (R-OK) and attached to a credit card industry reform bill, passed the House overwhelmingly by a vote of 279-147.
For decades, law-abiding citizens have been prohibited from exercising their Second Amendment rights on NPS land and wildlife refuges, even if the state in which the land is located allows carrying firearms.
With some limited exceptions for hunting, the only way to legally possess a firearm anywhere in a national park is by having it unloaded and inaccessible, such as locked up in an automobile trunk. A Bush administration regulation partially reversed the ban, but that action was singlehandedly negated recently by an activist judge in Washington, D.C. The Department of Interior decided not to appeal that ruling.
Senator Coburn believes, like you do, that Americans should not be forced to sacrifice their Second Amendment rights when entering NPS land and wildlife refuges.
GOA worked with Coburn on an amendment that simply allows for state and local laws -- instead of unelected bureaucrats and anti gun activist judges -- to govern firearm possession on these lands.
The anti-gun leadership in both the House and Senate went berserk and fought to keep the Coburn amendment from being attached to the underlying bill. Sparks were flying on the floor of the House of Representatives today.
Anti-gun Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY) whined that a "very good" credit card bill had been "hijacked" by the Coburn amendment. To this, Rep. Rob Bishop (R-UT) pointed out that gun control is the policy of tyrants, as evidenced by the British attempt to confiscate firearms at Lexington and Concord in 1775.
Congressional leaders and entrenched bureaucrats have fought GOA over the NPS gun ban for the past eight years.
But your activism has finally broken through. The late Senator Everett Dirksen said, "When I feel the heat, I see the light!" Well, you have applied a lot of heat. Members of Congress know that they oppose your Second Amendment rights at their own peril.
As it stands today, both houses of Congress have now passed the Coburn amendment -- and President Obama is expected to sign the provision into law (only because it is part of a larger credit card bill that he really wants).
So, congratulate yourself for winning this long, hard battle. GOA was the leading, and often only, national gun group involved in this fight. Your involvement was absolutely vital to achieving this win.
Of course, many more battles lie ahead. President Obama continues to push for the Senate to ratify massive international gun control treaties. There is a battle over a Supreme Court nominee coming up. Anti-gun zealots in Congress are aggressively pushing to renew the Clinton gun ban and close down gun shows.
And as the health care debate picks up steam in the coming weeks and months, GOA is battling efforts to create a computerized national healthcare database. Such a database can be used to deny people their Second Amendment rights in the same way that so many veterans have lost their gun rights based only on the diagnoses of a doctor for things like combat-related stress.
GOA will be calling for action on these and other Second Amendment issues as they move through Congress.
In the meantime, have a safe Memorial Day as we remember those who gave the ultimate sacrifice so that America would remain "Land of the Free."
demnogis
Regular Member
imported post
Once this is signed and takes effect, you can carry as state allows in National Parks and National Wildlife Refuges.
In CA, if the national park is in an unincorporated area you can LOC. If the park is in an incorporated area you can UOC. If National Park area overlaps or is within a State Park, you cannot possess an operable firearm.
Once this is signed and takes effect, you can carry as state allows in National Parks and National Wildlife Refuges.
In CA, if the national park is in an unincorporated area you can LOC. If the park is in an incorporated area you can UOC. If National Park area overlaps or is within a State Park, you cannot possess an operable firearm.
imported post
I love this statement about AK-47's. It just shows how out of touch this guy really is.
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics/AP/story/1058120.html
"Gun control groups said a new kind of danger would be lurking once the ban was overturned.
"Families should not have to stare down loaded AK-47's on nature hikes," said Paul Helmke, the president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence. He added that Obama "should not remain silent while Congress inserts reckless gun policies that he strongly opposes into a bill that has nothing whatsoever to do with guns.""
John
I love this statement about AK-47's. It just shows how out of touch this guy really is.
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics/AP/story/1058120.html
"Gun control groups said a new kind of danger would be lurking once the ban was overturned.
"Families should not have to stare down loaded AK-47's on nature hikes," said Paul Helmke, the president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence. He added that Obama "should not remain silent while Congress inserts reckless gun policies that he strongly opposes into a bill that has nothing whatsoever to do with guns.""
John
thorvaldr
Regular Member
imported post
It will be nice to have the right to open carry in national parks, but the import of this bill is much bigger than this. This bill has proven that we have a pro gun majority in the house and the senate. We can have reciprocity, BATFE reform, veterans rights, maybe not machine guns and silencers, but almost anything we want if we just get somebody to tack it onto a bill that Obama definitely will sign. We can see the Brady campaign driven before us and hear the laments of the MSM if we just reach out and take it.
It will be nice to have the right to open carry in national parks, but the import of this bill is much bigger than this. This bill has proven that we have a pro gun majority in the house and the senate. We can have reciprocity, BATFE reform, veterans rights, maybe not machine guns and silencers, but almost anything we want if we just get somebody to tack it onto a bill that Obama definitely will sign. We can see the Brady campaign driven before us and hear the laments of the MSM if we just reach out and take it.
Task Force 16
Campaign Veteran
imported post
jgregel wrote:
jgregel wrote:
Take note that Mr Helmke bolsters our opinion about Obamas' disdain for the 2A.
KBCraig
Regular Member
imported post
Oh, the beautiful irony of having it tacked onto one of Carolyn McCarthy's bills!
Oh, the beautiful irony of having it tacked onto one of Carolyn McCarthy's bills!
Task Force 16
Campaign Veteran
imported post
KBCraig wrote:
:lol::lol::lol:
KBCraig wrote:
oooooooohhhh..... that's really gotta bite. :lol:
:lol::lol::lol:Dispatcher
Campaign Veteran
imported post
Task Force 16 wrote:
Foaming.
:quirkyI mean honestly, who needs to protect themselves from a 10-foot tall grizzly bear running at them full speed that is only a few feet away. The nerve of some people!:quirky
:celebrate
Task Force 16 wrote:
She is foaming at the mouth.KBCraig wrote:oooooooohhhh..... that's really gotta bite. :lol:
Foaming.
:quirkyI mean honestly, who needs to protect themselves from a 10-foot tall grizzly bear running at them full speed that is only a few feet away. The nerve of some people!:quirky
:celebrate
Mark (IL)
Regular Member
imported post
One darker note:
Section 3 of H.R. 627 (the credit bill with the National Parks section) reads as follows:
SEC. 3. EFFECTIVE DATE.
This Act and the amendments made by this Act shall become effective 9 months after the date of enactment of this Act, except as otherwise specifically provided in this Act.
(There does not seem to be an "otherwise specified" for Parks carry... )
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=111_cong_bills&docid=f:h627enr.txt.pdf
(edited persistent URL)
One darker note:
Section 3 of H.R. 627 (the credit bill with the National Parks section) reads as follows:
SEC. 3. EFFECTIVE DATE.
This Act and the amendments made by this Act shall become effective 9 months after the date of enactment of this Act, except as otherwise specifically provided in this Act.
(There does not seem to be an "otherwise specified" for Parks carry... )
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=111_cong_bills&docid=f:h627enr.txt.pdf
(edited persistent URL)
Sonora Rebel
Regular Member
imported post
"Families should not have to stare down loaded AK-47's on nature hikes," said Paul Helmke, the president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.
Well... now the families may carry their own AK-47's... if AK-47's were legal. True AK-47's are not... as we know... Not w/o the CL III FFL. Why is it always the AK-47 arguement? Nobody's goin' to 'stare down' anything that's not pointed at them... and that's illegal anyway. Why is it always to the extremes with these people? I can see 'Eddie Bauer' matching familysets of AK's in the catalogs 'n stores coming soon.
There are places in the parks where two and four legged (or no legged) critters can, willand often do,ruin your day. 911 is worthless... even if you can get a signal.
Helmke is one of those hysterical Beta male metro-centrics with obvious hoplophobia.
I (and my neighbors) carry 'somethin' thru a Nat'l Park here every day... just gettin' back 'n forth. To do otherwise would require 'problems'. 'Ever dissassemble a Winchester lever gun... or shot gun or revolver? Not something ya want'a do just for 'passage'. No... we don't do it... Doubtful those living near Yellowstone or any of the other parks do either. It's silly. Not to mention being heeled in bear country. People like Helmke have never dusted their Gucci's or Birkenstocks in a Nat'l Park beyond the vistor center parking lots'n roadside picnic tables.
"Families should not have to stare down loaded AK-47's on nature hikes," said Paul Helmke, the president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.
Well... now the families may carry their own AK-47's... if AK-47's were legal. True AK-47's are not... as we know... Not w/o the CL III FFL. Why is it always the AK-47 arguement? Nobody's goin' to 'stare down' anything that's not pointed at them... and that's illegal anyway. Why is it always to the extremes with these people? I can see 'Eddie Bauer' matching familysets of AK's in the catalogs 'n stores coming soon.
There are places in the parks where two and four legged (or no legged) critters can, willand often do,ruin your day. 911 is worthless... even if you can get a signal.
Helmke is one of those hysterical Beta male metro-centrics with obvious hoplophobia.
I (and my neighbors) carry 'somethin' thru a Nat'l Park here every day... just gettin' back 'n forth. To do otherwise would require 'problems'. 'Ever dissassemble a Winchester lever gun... or shot gun or revolver? Not something ya want'a do just for 'passage'. No... we don't do it... Doubtful those living near Yellowstone or any of the other parks do either. It's silly. Not to mention being heeled in bear country. People like Helmke have never dusted their Gucci's or Birkenstocks in a Nat'l Park beyond the vistor center parking lots'n roadside picnic tables.
imported post
demnogis wrote:
I expect that Park Service LEOs will simply charge gun toters with brandishing, disorderly public conduct, and threatening laws.
This would be a Federal criminalcharge,meaning the trial would be heldin Federal Court (but with a Montana jury of gunowners).
Further, beginning in January 2009, under new rules from the U.S. Department of Justice, any person arrested in connection with any Federal crime must provide a DNA sample. (source - "Rules will Allow DNA samples from Federal Detainees." Los Angeles Times, Dec. 13, 2008).
demnogis wrote:
I personally don’t want to be the first to test the new law.
I expect that Park Service LEOs will simply charge gun toters with brandishing, disorderly public conduct, and threatening laws.
This would be a Federal criminalcharge,meaning the trial would be heldin Federal Court (but with a Montana jury of gunowners).
Further, beginning in January 2009, under new rules from the U.S. Department of Justice, any person arrested in connection with any Federal crime must provide a DNA sample. (source - "Rules will Allow DNA samples from Federal Detainees." Los Angeles Times, Dec. 13, 2008).
sprat
Regular Member
imported post
Augustin wrote:
you won't be the first to carry ina national Park, as many here carried in January when the original bill took affect and no one was arrested
on another thread I asked for clarification on the 9 month date to become law again, seems to have been answered thank you
sprat
Augustin wrote:
you won't be the first to carry ina national Park, as many here carried in January when the original bill took affect and no one was arrested
on another thread I asked for clarification on the 9 month date to become law again, seems to have been answered thank you
sprat
imported post
sprat,
Your user profile says that youa re from Florida, so I assume that by "here" you are referring to concealed carry in a Florida National Park, Preserve, or Monument. And I'm assuming that because open carry is illegal in Florida you are referring to concealed carry.
My prediction of arrests for brandishing or disorderly conduct was for folks openly carrying a rifle, not a concealed pistol. It doesn't surprise me that nobody was arrested for carrying concealed; as concealed is generally inconspicuous.
I carried my loaded Styer AUG .223 rifle in one of Alaska's National Parks many years ago as firearmsare not only allowed in Alaska's National Parks, it is encouraged that visitors are armed. When the day comes that I can openly tote my AUG in Yellowstone is the day I'll concede that the 2A is still alive. Till' then I'll stick to my guns that rifles in a lower-48 park will landone in the slammer.
sprat,
Your user profile says that youa re from Florida, so I assume that by "here" you are referring to concealed carry in a Florida National Park, Preserve, or Monument. And I'm assuming that because open carry is illegal in Florida you are referring to concealed carry.
My prediction of arrests for brandishing or disorderly conduct was for folks openly carrying a rifle, not a concealed pistol. It doesn't surprise me that nobody was arrested for carrying concealed; as concealed is generally inconspicuous.
I carried my loaded Styer AUG .223 rifle in one of Alaska's National Parks many years ago as firearmsare not only allowed in Alaska's National Parks, it is encouraged that visitors are armed. When the day comes that I can openly tote my AUG in Yellowstone is the day I'll concede that the 2A is still alive. Till' then I'll stick to my guns that rifles in a lower-48 park will landone in the slammer.
sprat
Regular Member
imported post
you post doesn't indicate or mention open or concealed carry,
alsoI am a snow bird( live in florida a majority of the year and spend summers in Pa)I am in Pa right now, where I have aLTCF to conceal and where open carry is legal
one can carry openly in Florida IF your are camping, fishing, coming & going to the range http://floridaconcealedcarry.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=3051
so if I decide to camp in a National Park in Florida, I can open carry if I choose
sprat
you post doesn't indicate or mention open or concealed carry,
alsoI am a snow bird( live in florida a majority of the year and spend summers in Pa)I am in Pa right now, where I have aLTCF to conceal and where open carry is legal
one can carry openly in Florida IF your are camping, fishing, coming & going to the range http://floridaconcealedcarry.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=3051
so if I decide to camp in a National Park in Florida, I can open carry if I choose
sprat
holeinhead
Regular Member
imported post
Glad this passed! The law previously was just dumb, criminalizing folks just because they cross an obscure line.
It does suck that it won't go into effect 9 months from now...
Glad this passed! The law previously was just dumb, criminalizing folks just because they cross an obscure line.
It does suck that it won't go into effect 9 months from now...
rpyne
Regular Member
imported post
I just got this message from my Representative:
I just got this message from my Representative:
Flintlock
Regular Member
imported post
Augustin wrote:
Augustin wrote:
You are right, there are a few National Parks that havealready allowed the carriage of arms for defense here in Alaska, but there were still a couple of them that were off-limits such as Denali National Park and Preserve and Gates of the Arctic National Park. Hopefully, in nine months, these infringements will sail off into history undeterred.
imported post
This ban must have been arbitrarily enforced all along. Consider that much ofthe state of Kentucky is technically part of Daniel Boone national forest. There are a lot of people living within or abutting the nominal border, and they certainly hunt and shoot there. I'm not aware of any legal problems arising from this, but it would be prefereble if they had specific legal protections.
-ljp
This ban must have been arbitrarily enforced all along. Consider that much ofthe state of Kentucky is technically part of Daniel Boone national forest. There are a lot of people living within or abutting the nominal border, and they certainly hunt and shoot there. I'm not aware of any legal problems arising from this, but it would be prefereble if they had specific legal protections.
-ljp