Milwaukee Cops on shooting rampage in Chicago

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http://www.state.il.us/Court/Opinions/AppellateCourt/2001/1stDistrict/September/Html/1991750.htm

Check this out you will be shocked!

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You know I had typed up a few examples of stories that I personally know to be true that are perfect examples of how police think they are above the law, and of officers that I've been friends with and witnessed them commit crimes ranging from reckless driving to discharging a firearm into the air out the door of a vehicle in an urban area and EVERYTHING in between.

After typing them out, I decided this isn't the forum to put them out on. We know most (if not almost all) cops think they are above the law. I'm not sure if examples of it promotes our cause of being able to freely exercise our rights. I'll save those stories for when me and any of you fellow OC'ers are hanging out having a beer.

I think the lesson to take away is that when one person has power over others, it goes to their head. We see evidence of this everywhere from local police, and every level of local, state, and federal government. Power concentrated in the hands of a few is never a good thing for freedom. That is why its so critically important that we take a stand for our rights. ALL of our rights. This forum is dedicated to one of them, the right to keep and bear arms. Though it is not the only right. In fact its one of an infinite number of rights our founding fathers recognized that were guaranteed to us as human beings. INALIENABLE rights. The right to keep and bear arms IS however one of a few rights that CURRENTLY and perpetually are on the frontline in the fight to maintain the freedom we deserve as human beings.

Freedom doesn't disappear in a flash, it erodes from the edges. The right to keep and bear arms is a breakwater right. It takes the hardest waves from the open waterof the sea of power hungry politicians and the sea of ignoranceof emotional reaction vs. logical thought.

Its critically important for all of us to continue to RIGHT NOW exercise this newly validified right. Van Hollen spoke loud and clear. And then he spoke loud and clear again. Rather than be mad at the police and tell stories of what hypocrites they are, lets do what we can do and EXERCISE our rights. Lets channel our frustration with police behavior which we can do little to alter into a behavior that we CAN make a change with by Open carrying at every opportunity we have to do so.

Please Open Carry at every legal opportunity to do so. It does make a difference.

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I understand your point. However, it is relevant. The Milwaukee Police Chief is trying to make his point that the average citizen carrying a fire arm is looking for trouble. I think Flynn should make more effort in policing his own. It is kind of a "practice what you preach" situation. While not all police officers act this way, there is no cause to take the firearms away from all of them. The same goes for the average citizens. Because one might act out and violate the law doesn't mean all citizens should lose their right to carry. There for I agree with you Hugh. Exercise your right at every legal opportunity and above all support opencarry.org and the rights of others to exercise their rights also.

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Police behavior is relevant. I just don't think we are going to change it on this forum and I want to give police the opportunity to be professionals and respect the rights of law-abiding citizens. If we turn this into a bitch-session about police behavior, its just going to motivate police to be more heavy-handed and "us vs. them"

We need to operate above the police. We are not breaking the law, we have civil and constitutional rights which they are NOT allowed to violate. In short "they can't touch us legally". When they do, they are breaking the law. Thats what we need to keep in mind.

Having said that J, I'd love to share with you my 'stories' sometime. We'd laugh and shake our heads in disgust at the same time.

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Just a few quotes, I love,from Abe Lincoln to put things in perspective...

Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.

The shepherd drives the wolf from the sheep's for which the sheep thanks the shepherd as his liberator, while the wolf denounces him for the same act as the destroyer of liberty. Plainly, the sheep and the wolf are not agreed upon a definition of liberty.

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if you wanna start a cop-bashing thread, lets use something a little newer like theyoung kid hired as acop in Crandon WI that decided to take out 6 or 7 his high-school friends with an AR-15 while they were eating pizza. At least hekilled himself later that same day.

I think that story is a little more relevant to police abusing their power, the kid was barely old enough to buy his own ammunition, had anger and power issues, but was hired by both the city and the county. We get alot of young ones up here, I wish I only had to deal with police within a decade youngerof my age or older.

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Nutczak wrote:

I wish I only had to deal with police within a decade youngerof my age or older.

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Exactly. Nutczak. There is a huge difference in attitude, maturity, wisdom, and just in general, away anyone handles "things" from 21 y.o. to 30 y.o.

So Mr. Gleason, as I see it, you are passing judgment on every single Milwaukee cop based onone cop's actions15 years ago?

The real fact is simple... alcohol and firearms do not mix no matter who you are or how long you have been shooting.

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I look forward to it hugh and many more conversations with you in the future.

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I used that article because it told of the officer basically performing a drive by shooting. The crandon incident was a different type of situation.

Maybe you all can answer a question for me. why is it that any time a new member posts something on here you are all quick to bash the person? What makes you think that because you have been a member longer than I have that you are better than I am or more informed than I am?

Let me be clear on something. I am a Sergeant for the D.O.C. and before that i worked as a bail enforcement agent for a bond company out of Minnesota. I open carried a fire arm for 10 years across every state in this country. Do any of you have that kind of open carry experience?

The reactions and comments on this forum make me want to move on and support another forum and I am sure I am not the only new member that feels that way.

So, with that in mind, tell me is this a limited member forum or can anyone post an opinion or information on this forum. Because now we are talking about the right of free speech!

Get over yourselves and stop treating new members as though they are the enemy or this movement will fail and you will have no one but yourselves to blame!

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The reactions and comments on this forum make me want to move on and support another forum and I am sure I am not the only new member that feels that way.

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There has been a time or two when I've seen a new member get jumped on. When I see it, I speak out against it.

Trite crap like people making a snarky comment about a double post is rediculous, an an instance or two otherwise that I can think of that irritated me too but as a whole.....

This is a forum with very principled people who are intent on disecting the law, ideas, issues. Don't confuse a healthy debate or having your ideas challenged as not being welcome. In fact, people challenging your idea in a way indicates inclusion and acceptance.

At the end of the day however, whats most important is that we promote our cause and if this forum isn't someplace where someone feels like socializing/pontificating/debating it shouldn't detract from that persons desire to fight for their rights in other ways. The truth is while we plan and discuss and learn on the internet, the real fight for freedom doesn't exist in cyberspace, it exists on the street as we go about our daily business and exercise our rights.

I think this forum is the best single source of information on the open carry issue in wisconsin.

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Mr Gleason,

I do think you will find many of the people who post regularly are very well trained and informed. I was, and still am,impressed when I learn more about some of the people out here. So the answer to your question about "experience" is yes for some no forothers and no matter what all of us still have something new to learn.

Keep in mind this is a open discussion forum and everyone will disagree with everyone else, at some point guaranteed, andsometimes purely for the sake of discussion. (Ok I wont lie, argument)

Anyway "baptism by fire"seems to beS.O.P. here but welcome.

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Again, maybe this forum should be called "the most righteous.org"

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Mr. Gleason,

Who are you so angry at? As far as theposters.

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As I said before, It is not who it is what! The way people are treated on this forum! Every time a relatively new member posts something the "Veteran" members jump all over them telling them how wrong they are simply because the new member cannot show a legal document pertaining to the information in his post, and if they do provide some documentation they get told it is "old news" or "that was already posted maybe you should read the forum before you post."

I am angry at those of you who are rude, egotistical and obnoxious! Those of you that think no one could possibly be right except for yourselves of course.

The object of this forum is to unite people for the same cause not chase them away with rude comments.

Sure I have open carried for years. Do I know everything....NO! and I don't pretend that I do.

Any information I may post here, I believe to be true and accurate to the best of my knowledge. If my information is wrong and someone knows the facts and can pass them on.... that's great! Just don't take me out back and shoot me like some lame gun control advocate! That I don't deserve and neither do any of the other new members!

2A Forever!!!!!!