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Thread: Concealed Weapon Badge

  1. #1
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    Guys I know this topic has been beat to death, many times. But, I just want to throw out there something concerning the "Concealed Weapons Badge" many of you have expressed opinions on.

    If licensed to carry, I think it prudent to carry concealed, Why would you want to draw attention to yourself, from anyone for any reason. You have lost the element of surprise, if needed. Besides the very first word on the CCW badge is "Concealed". I believe that concealed means concealed. Why would you want to carry it on your belt for others to see that you have conceal a weapon. Why not print the word armed on the back of your jacket.

    A CCW badge has no rank, priviledges or esteem assigned to it. It's my understand that this badge may aid you and the LEO when late at night,if youencounter a self defense situation. Upon the entry of the LEO's to the scene, your weapon should be in it's holster. Holding this badge up high facing the officers may defuse some of the tension of the moment. This will not excuse you from being questioned and maybe even taken in for questioning, but hopefully will keep you alive long enough to provide your license and ID. I have a nephew who is a state trooper, many friends in law enforcement and have a high regard for their positions. At the end of the day, all they wish is to go home safe, just as you and I do. I have a CCW badge, but no one has ever seen it, and hopefully never will. I have it neatly inside my wallet,so it's not seen when I open my wallet to show ID or make change. It's there for that occasion when it may be helpful to ease a LEO's mind when quickly arriving at the scene of a geat deal of tension to help put their mind at ease. Holding this high over your head shouldhelp prevent the misfortune of having it mistaken as a weapon when a flashlight is shown on it in the night. Following the officers instructions you will be given the opportunity to produce ID and the concealed weapon permit.

    What I think would be a better alternative to the CCW badge is something nationally recognized by law enforcement and other licensed to carry individuals. LegallyArmed.com has a reflective tape they recomment in a pouch that they sell for about 15.00, but I am not sure that this is nationally recognized. I do not think the badge is the right approach, but until something better comes along, I am keeping mine "concealed" in my wallet for that late night need, which I hope never comes. I have discussed this with my nephew, but he does not feel threatened when making a traffic stop and finds a legally armed individual. As we all know, to be legally armed, we have passed the best background checks, and he is at peace with this. My concern with quick recognition is during that period when adrenalin is running and you need to quickly erase some tension for all.

    If anyone has a better idea or knows of something nationally recognized, please advise.



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    We don't need no stiiiinkin' badges!

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    It is not wise to carry a badge for two reasons:

    1. You might be accused of impersonating a police officer.

    2. Open carry philosophy is that of armed citizenry: citizens, not police, bearing arms. Through this we preserve Liberty in its true form.

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    Regular Member MSC 45ACP's Avatar
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    Task Force 16 wrote:
    We don't need no stiiiinkin' badges!
    AMEN!

    A Concealed Carry Badge?

    Isn'tit the same ashaving aConcealed Carry Permit???

    That's almost the silliest idea I've ever heard. That's right up there with screen doors on a submarine!
    "If I know that I am headed for a fight, I want something larger with more power, preferably crew-served.
    However, like most of us, as I go through my daily life, I carry something a bit more compact, with a lot less power."
    (unknown 'gun~writer')

    Remington 1911 R1 (Back to Basics)
    SERPA retention or concealed...

    "Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~Thomas Jefferson
    (Borrowed from "The Perfect Day" by LTC Dave Grossman)

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    There are few, if any, legitimate reasons to have a CCW badge. Police don't need to see it during a traffic stop. If anything, they only need to see the CCW itself. I don't tell police I have a permit during a traffic stop unless required by law, and I'm not so required in my home state. Other innocent people have no reason to see such a thing. Bad guys could care less. The only reason you are considering this CCW badge, is the unlikely, but conceivable, scenario where you find yourself holding one or more bad guys at bay and need to figure out how to maintain control and successfully pass these bad guys off to police when they arrive. This isn't something a civilian (like you and me) have any training for. But it could happen.

    You have a very low post count, like 2. Assuming you're really asking an honest question, here's my 2 cents. If you ever need to hold a bad guy at bay awaiting police, you're going to have lots on your mind. A CCW badge is the least of your worries. Assuming you're able to call 911 for help, and that's a big if (gun in one hand, cell phone in the other? paying full attention to the bad guy(s) while doing so, and not squeezing the trigger while dialing on the cell phone??), you're in a heap of trouble. because all of this is very hard to do, even for trained police. Tell them you're holding x bad guys at bay with a handgun and that they were committing such and such a crime and to PLEASE tell responding officers you are the one with the x colored shirt and y colored pants and that you're the good guy, and could they kindly tell the officers not blast your sorry behind to a zillion pieces as they arrive on the scene.

    If you must and are able, just hold your wallet, open to your CCW permit, high above your head (don't squeeze the trigger with one hand while grabbing your wallet with the other hand). I have my permit in a window wallet for just this reason. A badge is just confusing and a distraction and has no legal weight. It will be hard enough to just get through the police arriving on the scene thing without everything going down the drain. And if other people have been calling 911 and, ignorant of details, are telling police YOU look like the bad guy because you have a gun and the upper hand, well this might not end well.

    Books could, and probably have, been written on just this situation. Even after police arrive, the encounter is far from over. Police need to be directed to evidence (bad guy's weapons, spend shell casings, etc.) They need to know who else witnessed this event. If you fired shots, particularly if you wounded or killed anybody, then you're in a real pickle as you need to tell enough so that evidence in your favor isn't overlooked or destroyed, but not so much as you incriminate yourself. Although some advocate saying nothing, I'm not sure this is the best avenue in all cases. Maybe some of the LEO's on the site have better advice.

    A CCW badge is the last thing you need with all of this going on. Forget it. Put your CCW in a window wallet if you must, but don't go any further than that.

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    My badge is the weapon on my belt.
    Associate with men of good quality if you esteem your own reputation; for it is better to be alone than in bad company. ~ George Washington

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    Regular Member MarlboroLts5150's Avatar
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    If you want to carry a badge, join the police or other agency. If you ever showed a "CCW badge" to anyone, you run a SERIOUS risk of being accused of impersonating a law officer. Period.
    "My dedication to my country's flag rests on my ardent belief in this noblest of causes, equality for all. If my future rests under this earth rather than upon it, I fear not."

    -Leopold Karpeles, US Civil War Medal of Honor Recipient

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    Regular Member VAopencarry's Avatar
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    Or, in lieu of a badge, don't have a gun in your hand and do as Officer Friendly tells you.

    You are right, concealed does mean concealed and Open means Open.
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson

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    CCP badge make NO sense.

    If you display the badge in the open, they you have just divulged that you have a gun, which defeats the entire purpose of concealed carrying!

    Secondly, why show a badge to an officer when you are required to carry the permit itself with you at all times in most places if you are concealing? It's a waste of money and time.

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    I have read all the posting and feel that all have missed the point. Maybe I have not clearly stated the intent of the CCW badge that I do have in my wallet.

    No one other than my wife has ever seen this badge, and hopefully never will. As I previously stated, it has no rank, stigma or priviledges assigned. Nor do I assume it has any. When I open my wallet to show my ID or make change, the badge is hidden and not seen my anyone.

    If in the darkness I encountered a situation where a weapon was used, I feel that having this badge held high above my head for the arriving LEO's to clearly see, tensions would be eased for them. Our state does not issue a license like many have. It is nothing more than a piece of paper. If needed, I can easily open my wallet and display the badge without much effort. My total intent is to simply put the LEO's mind a little more at ease, until they have total control of the situation.

    I completely agree that communication with the dispatcher is very important. Telling them that you are the one with a red shirt and blue jeans would also be a very good aid in identification. I am not in favor of carrying a badage on your belt as many do, I am not in favor of it being show for any reason other than that mentioned above. It's unlikely a situation would ever arise like the one mentioned above, but just in case, I want to put the officers mind at easy and be identified as quickly as possible. How a badge is used would clearly divulge intent. In no way am I trying to convey that I have any authority. The badge is something that LEO's can identify with since all I have for a CCW license is a piece of paper, until I can provide the ID and paper license.

    A license as many of you have, similiar to your drivers license, makes more sense, but I don't have this. Maybe states need to unify the form of license issued. This would be something recognizable to all. Currently for me, a recognizable badgecould ease tension until I can get a piece of paper out for the LEO. As I previously mentioned in the original post, legallyarmed.com has an ID pouch that when displayed shows reflective tape. I like this opposed to a badge, but not sure that all LEO's would recognize what this was.

    Guys I simply am searching for a solution to what could maybe be an issue, but I hope never happens. Because all I have is a small piece of paper, I maybe have a unique situation to you guys who have a regular ID card. I would like to see something that was used nation wide for this identification that was uniform to all.





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    Regular Member Alexcabbie's Avatar
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    When confronted by Law Enforcement in a tense situation here is how to avoid getting shot or otherwise seriously injured:

    (1) Do EXACTLY as the LEO tells you to do and

    (2) Do it WHEN he tells you to do it.

    The cops have adequate training in rolling up on a situation where they can't tell the good guys from the bad guys (It is one of the first things you learn) and basically the formulaa is "neutralize everbody, cuff everybody, and then sort them out" The BGs give themselves away often by being slow to respond or balking, so instead of holding up a badge, just do what yoou are told to do when you are tol to do it and you will be just fine.

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    This is one count on which I completely sympathize with the police. If you ever watch a stop in Cops, say, and they order someone to turn off the car, exit the vehicle, turn around, put their hands on their head, and to stoop down on their knees, there is a base 100% chance that the person stopped will fail on multiple counts to perform these acts as instructed. It is astounding. I would end up shooting people for being too god-damned stupid to understand and/or perform simple things like that, irrespective of their innocence or guilt otherwise.

    As for the OP, I say no to the badge idea. There's no real benefit that I can see, and there is a potential liability in being mistaken for a cop.

    -ljp

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    Wellrounded wrote:
    I have read all the posting and feel that all have missed the point.
    Perhaps it's you who miss the point?

    Wellrounded wrote:
    Guys I simply am searching for a solution to what could maybe be an issue, but I hope never happens.
    It seems like you are searching for a problem for your proposedsolution. I think you are going to have a hard time convincing anyone here that a badge is a good idea for them. IF it works for you, knock yourself out.

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    Regular Member Alexcabbie's Avatar
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    Legba wrote:
    This is one count on which I completely sympathize with the police. If you ever watch a stop in Cops, say, and they order someone to turn off the car, exit the vehicle, turn around, put their hands on their head, and to stoop down on their knees, there is a base 100% chance that the person stopped will fail on multiple counts to perform these acts as instructed. It is astounding. I would end up shooting people for being too god-damned stupid to understand and/or perform simple things like that, irrespective of their innocence or guilt otherwise.

    -ljp
    Legs, the idiots cant even understand why I tell them to enter and exit ion the curb side ONLY. Tell me folks. WHY DOES THE TAXI DRIVER TELL YOU TO GET IN OIN THE RIGHT AND OUT ON THE RIGHT?????

    I tell ya, the one thing you DO NOT WANT TO SAY TO ME if you are getting in is to instead keep yanking on the left door handle and say, "WHY? Is this dore broken?" Do THAT, and I will just pull away from you. Know why?

    Because if you open the door INTO TRAFFIC another car could damage my door. Not to mention YOU, and I won't, because you're niot gettin out on either side till you've paid me.

    But these people cannot understand a simple thing like that, and the funn thing is back in my day we all knew not to open the door into the street, taxi, family car, whatever. I wonder if the fact that Virginia stopped sterilizing imbeciles in 1977 is a contributing factor? That would explain the Obama election too.


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    If in the darkness I encountered a situation where a weapon was used, I feel that having this badge held high above my head for the arriving LEO's to clearly see, tensions would be eased for them.
    Tensions won't be eased for them. Anyone can buy a stupid badge. You don't even need a permit to buy a concealed carry permit badge. Anyone can buy a badge online.

    Children buy fake badges all the time at stores even.

    Further, I'd say its a good chance you'd agitate them and they'd get P.O.ed that someone is trying to pretend to be a cop.

    Only on TV I would think, do undercover cops simply flash their badge at 15 yards away and the uniformed cops decide not to investigate them and not to tell them to lower their weapon.

    Now, if they should by chance temporarily be convinced your a cop, that just might be reason to arrest you for impersonation I would think.

    If you feel the need to be quickly identified and tell the dispatcher about something identifying, I would find something else distinguishable, other than a badge.

  16. #16
    Regular Member Statesman's Avatar
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    "A CCW badge has no rank, priviledges or esteem assigned to it. It's my understand that this badge may aid you and the LEO when late at night, if you encounter a self defense situation. Upon the entry of the LEO's to the scene, your weapon should be in it's holster. Holding this badge up high facing the officers may defuse some of the tension of the moment."
    CCDW "badges" are a BAD idea, period. There's NOTHING good about them, other than they make the manufacturer money in a free market. Flashing a badge with no legal authority behind it will likely be interpreted to be impersonating LEO, which is illegal everywhere in the U.S. Flash your government permission card to conceal, when asked to do so. Don't buy them, and if you do, stick it on your wall at home.

    I'm not LEO, but in my opinion, this diffusion you speak of is highly unlikely. In such a situation, If I were LEO, and I saw someone reaching to their back pocket to pull something out, I'd be expecting a gun. If it's on your belt, and you rip it off, and hold up a non-state issued badge at a distance, I'd probably think you were crazy, and consider arresting you for impersonating a police officer.

    "If anyone has a better idea or knows of something nationally recognized, please advise."
    Not trying to be antagonistic here, but the 2nd amendment is nationally recognized. Nothing else is needed here.

    "If licensed to carry, I think it prudent to carry concealed""As we all know, to be legally armed, we have passed the best background checks, "
    This is absolutely FALSE. You can be legally armed, and "open" carry without a background check, because "carrying" a firearm in the open is a protected right in many states. You are referring to concealed carry, which is highly regulated.

    "Why would you want to draw attention to yourself, from anyone for any reason. You have lost the element of surprise, if needed. "
    The concern of losing the "element of surprise" whilist OCing has not been substantiated. IMHO, OCing has a significant deterrent effect that negates the need for the element of surprise. Please see this thread on the subject. fullauto223cal nails it quite nicely, I must say.


    What I think would be a better alternative to the CCW badge is something nationally recognized by law enforcement and other licensed to carry individuals.
    My concern with quick recognition is during that period when adrenalin is running and you need to quickly erase some tension for all.
    I'm not sure why we even need to worry about quick recognition, or flashing anything during an encounter with LEO. If you are being detained and searched, they will find the firearm, and ask for your government permission card to carry concealed. That is the de-facto standard in a LEO encounter, from my understanding.

    I really don't like the idea of nationalized anything with respect to dispensing privileges. If you can grant permission on a nationwide basis, you can revoke it as well. This is a state issue, and we already have a system in place to handle recognition of CCDW holders. We also have reciprocity agreements with various states, subject to differences in state laws in carrying, which reflects the constituents views on concealed carry in that state.

    What need is present to change this system?

  17. #17
    Campaign Veteran XD-GEM's Avatar
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    Wellrounded wrote:
    I have read all the posting and feel that all have missed the point. Maybe I have not clearly stated the intent of the CCW badge that I do have in my wallet.

    No one other than my wife has ever seen this badge, and hopefully never will. As I previously stated, it has no rank, stigma or priviledges assigned. Nor do I assume it has any. When I open my wallet to show my ID or make change, the badge is hidden and not seen my anyone.

    If in the darkness I encountered a situation where a weapon was used, I feel that having this badge held high above my head for the arriving LEO's to clearly see, tensions would be eased for them. Our state does not issue a license like many have. It is nothing more than a piece of paper. If needed, I can easily open my wallet and display the badge without much effort. My total intent is to simply put the LEO's mind a little more at ease, until they have total control of the situation.

    I completely agree that communication with the dispatcher is very important. Telling them that you are the one with a red shirt and blue jeans would also be a very good aid in identification. I am not in favor of carrying a badage on your belt as many do, I am not in favor of it being show for any reason other than that mentioned above. It's unlikely a situation would ever arise like the one mentioned above, but just in case, I want to put the officers mind at easy and be identified as quickly as possible. How a badge is used would clearly divulge intent. In no way am I trying to convey that I have any authority. The badge is something that LEO's can identify with since all I have for a CCW license is a piece of paper, until I can provide the ID and paper license.

    A license as many of you have, similiar to your drivers license, makes more sense, but I don't have this. Maybe states need to unify the form of license issued. This would be something recognizable to all. Currently for me, a recognizable badgecould ease tension until I can get a piece of paper out for the LEO. As I previously mentioned in the original post, legallyarmed.com has an ID pouch that when displayed shows reflective tape. I like this opposed to a badge, but not sure that all LEO's would recognize what this was.

    Guys I simply am searching for a solution to what could maybe be an issue, but I hope never happens. Because all I have is a small piece of paper, I maybe have a unique situation to you guys who have a regular ID card. I would like to see something that was used nation wide for this identification that was uniform to all.




    If you tried this in Louisiana, you would be arrested for impersonating a police officer and for violation of the "badge" laws here. There are too many of them to quote, so you may search for them and read them yourself by going to the following web site, clicking on the "Search Louisiana Laws" heading on the left side of the page,and enetering "badge" in the search box. Be sure to check the "all of the above" check box to search every area of state law.

    http://www.legis.state.la.us/






  18. #18
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    If in the darkness I encountered a situation where a weapon was used, I feel that having this badge held high above my head for the arriving LEO's to clearly see, tensions would be eased for them.
    You've watched too much TV.

    I can tell you that my LEO training says someone waving a shiny flashy thing in my direction in the dark, is probably waving a weapon, and should be treated as such until ascertained otherwise.

    My training also says that if I'm ever in an off-duty altercation where I have drawn a weapon, the first thing I will do when responding officers arrive, is put my gun down and my hands up, and follow their orders while they sort out who's who.

    When trying to defuse a hostile situation, you want to eliminate as many variables as possible. If you're waving a badge around like Serpico, you're introducing variables, not reducing them. I doubt you're going to get shot, but the responding officers are going to be more stressed than usual, you're going to be the cause of that extra stress, and you're going to be treated worse as a result.


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    Alexcabbie wrote:
    When confronted by Law Enforcement in a tense situation here is how to avoid getting shot or otherwise seriously injured:

    (1) Do EXACTLY as the LEO tells you to do and

    (2) Do it WHEN he tells you to do it.

    The cops have adequate training in rolling up on a situation where they can't tell the good guys from the bad guys (It is one of the first things you learn) and basically the formulaa is "neutralize everbody, cuff everybody, and then sort them out" The BGs give themselves away often by being slow to respond or balking, so instead of holding up a badge, just do what yoou are told to do when you are tol to do it and you will be just fine.
    I understand where your coming from. I also understand explicitedly your instructions and advise. Thank you, VERY MUCH

  20. #20
    Regular Member david.ross's Avatar
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    How stupid. A conceal carry badge is just plain stupid.

    If you're going to wear any type of insignia, buy proper BDUs and wear some type of gun design.
    Gays are prominent members of firearm rights, we do more via the courts, don't like it? Leave.
    Religious bigots against same sex marriage are not different than white supremacists.
    I expel anti-gay people off my teams. Tolerance is key to team cohesion and team building.

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    A recent incident where a boy was told to put his gun down and rather than doing that he pointed it at the officer. It turned out to be a toy gun but the boy was still shot. When 15 officers are surrounding me with guns drawn the last thing I am going to dois try to wave anything especially a phony badge. I am going to slowly put my gun down and he says get on the ground I am gong spread eagle and dog a hole. After all guns are put away I can argue about my rights but I can't do a thing if I am dead.

    Bottom line is any CWP badge including reflective tape or whatever is a BAD idea. You have been watching too many cop shows.

  22. #22
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    It's really an ego thing to want a CC badge. "Hey....lookit me"!

    I'm in corrections and do carry a badge on duty. I turn it face into my body when off. I OC almost everywhere. I can understand the OPs question and it has been answered. No. It is a solution looking for a problem.

  23. #23
    Campaign Veteran Bookman's Avatar
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    I think you're a bit naive about your badge. It really does leave you open to charges of impersonating a police officer. All it takes is for ONE person to accuse you of claiming to be a LEO, whether or not they know you have the badge, and it's pretty much over. The fact that the BG accuses you and you have the badge may enough circumstantial evidence to land you in court. You may not be convicted if you have good lawyer, but do you really need the hassle?
    "All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke


    "I like people who stand on the Constitution... unless they're using it to wipe their feet." - Jon E Hutcherson

  24. #24
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    If anyone can buy, carry, and display the CC badge.. it is pretty much useless. Criminals can use it and then get the drop on law enforcement.

    Displaying it has no valid purpose. It is not a requirement.

    A badge is a sign of authority and is made visible to show others you are alleged to have some type of authority. There are severe penalties for anyone attempting to unlawfully obtain authority they are not permitted to have.

    Badges of authority are not easy to obtain but also not impossible. A CC badge can be purchased by anyone, at any time, and lawfully displayed with no real repercussion.

    If you have a permit and you need to inform the police you are armed you can do so in many other ways besides showing a "badge" that simply does not give you any authority to CC.

    If you need to make it known that you are armed... you can keep your hands in sight and tell the officer as he approaches. You can also put your gun on the ground and step away from it before the officer approaches.


  25. #25
    Regular Member Gunslinger's Avatar
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    Those badges cost about 50 bucks. A box of good, .45ACP +P Federal HSTs about the same. Let's see...which should I spend my money on...
    "For any man who sheds his blood with me this day shall be my brother...And gentlemen now abed shall think themselves accursed, they were not here, and hold their manhoods cheap whilst any speaks who fought with us on Crispin's day." Henry V

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