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Thread: Green Bay Open Carry Event

  1. #1
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    Hey guys, I'm new to OC.org. Just want to know if anyone in or around GB wants to have an OC picnic/event. I have @ least 3 people aside from me & the wife that are game to set something up. Just kind of tossing the Idea around right now, but if anyone is serious,feel free to PM me. Thx.
    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

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    I am definitely up for this. This is a good summer to do this.

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    You set the date/time/place, and I am up for the drive. I will try to bring a friend as well. I'll bring a case of Sprecher soda (ya, I wish it could be beer)!

    I love the Green Bay area. The city is just a city to me(well the Packers are cool), but the area is real nice to see.

    Again, just let us know.

  4. #4
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    Just a suggestion, before you throw a time/date out there find a place.

    Hubert (bhpcomputing) had a MOSTER successful picnic last week in La Crosse. It was a public park, but one that didn't have a firearms restriction.

    If you can poke around the GB area and find a municipality that has a city park in a municipality that doesn't have one of these dumb "firearm prohibition" ordinances, you'll have a GREAT turnout.

    People will be drawn to a public event. Other options would be parking lots of businesses that would be pro-gun. Sporting goods stores (you'll have better luck with locally owned ones than national chains) Someplace with a good size parking lot and good public exposure.

    Another suggestion might be a church that doesn't have a school as part of it. If you know someone who's a member of a church like that you might have an EASY location for a saturday afternoon (if theres no weddings) as church services are on sundays.

    Other suggestions club halls (masonic temples, elks club lodges, VFW halls etc)

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    Regular Member Lurchiron's Avatar
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    Bale da Hay

    "Have you Spanked a leftist today; it's the Right thing to do!!!"


    Within the gates before a man shall go,
    (Fully warily let him watch,)
    Full long let him look about him;
    For little he knows where a foe may lurk,
    And sit in the seats within.

    Havamal (Bellows translation)

  6. #6
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    Hey guys,

    2morrow(Friday) I am going to call around and see which parks here in GB have Firearms restrictions.I'll post what I find out as soon as I do...L8r.
    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

  7. #7
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    So I found one park that may work for our event here. It's Bay Beach believe it or not, Only thing I have any beef about is that the lady I talked to could not be sure of the firearm laws at the park, and I really don't want us to take the chance going there OC'n and everybody gets a citation. So newayz, does anybody know off hand about GB's park ordinances? or of any other parks away from school zones that would work here in GB? thanks guys!
    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

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    http://www.ci.green-bay.wi.us/law/ordinancebook.html There's the full GB Ordinance book. Section 25 deals w/ parks, I don't see anything regarding firearms/guns in it. It does mention that alcoholic beverages are prohibited (except for Joannes stadium) though we won't be doing that will we?

    I'm going to toss out another park, Mcauliffe Park. Its outside of the 1000 ft range from the closest school (Prince of Peace School).

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    Hello, will the picnic be planned for certain date? My friend and I might be able to come to the picnic from Marathon County.

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    IANAL, but I think that if you read 27.603 (3) you may find that you will have to argue that GB has an ordinance that is contrary to what the Wisconsin AG and 2A have to say.

    (a) Generally Prohibited. ... no person shall carry ... any dangerous or deadly weapon including, but not limited by enumeration to, ...pistol, revolver, rifle, or shotgun.

    (b) Exceptions. The prohibitions of subsection (3)(a) will not be construed to prevent the carrying of any type of weapon when it is unloaded and properly cased, boxed, packaged, or otherwise unavailable for immediate use ...

    Private property might be a better option unless you want to go to battle over this.

    Good luck.

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    Big Dipper wrote:
    IANAL, but I think that if you read 27.603 (3) you may find that you will have to argue that GB has an ordinance that is contrary to what the Wisconsin AG and 2A have to say.

    (a) Generally Prohibited. ... no person shall carry ... any dangerous or deadly weapon including, but not limited by enumeration to, ...pistol, revolver, rifle, or shotgun.

    (b) Exceptions. The prohibitions of subsection (3)(a) will not be construed to prevent the carrying of any type of weapon when it is unloaded and properly cased, boxed, packaged, or otherwise unavailable for immediate use ...

    Private property might be a better option unless you want to go to battle over this.

    Good luck.
    You left out the most important chunk of that ordinance. Let's look at the WHOLE thing.



    27.603 WEAPONS . (3) POSSESSION OF DANGEROUS OR DEADLY WEAPONS. (a) Generally Prohibited. Except as reasonably necessary to fulfill the exceptions provided elsewhere in this ordinance, no person shall carry or transport any bow or crossbow, or conceal about the person or display in a threatening manner any dangerous or deadly weapon including, but not limited by enumeration to, martial arts weapons such as throwing stars, swords, or nunchiku; slingshots; knuckles of lead, brass, or other metals; or a bowie knife, bow, or crossbow; pistol, revolver, rifle, or shotgun. (b) Exceptions. The prohibitions of subsection (3)(a) will not be construed to prevent the carrying of any type of weapon when it is unloaded and properly cased, boxed, packaged, or otherwise unavailable for immediate use or transported in conformity with Sec. 167.31, Wis. Stats., or the display and sale of such weapon by a licensed retailer; or when such weapon is possessed in strict conformity with Sec. 29.304, Wis. Stats., nor shall any of these prohibitions forbid any peace officer of the United States, Wisconsin, or subdivision thereof from carrying, wearing, or using such weapons as shall be necessary in the property exercise of their duties.
    I've written to the City about this. And according to the City attorney, it only prohibits the open carry of a BOW or CROSSBOW. And prohibits the CONCEALING or BRANDISHING of other weapons.


  12. #12
    Regular Member Big Dipper's Avatar
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    I stand corrected!

    It's just those pesky commas that mess me up.

  13. #13
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    Just a heads up to all that have eyes on this post, It looks like we can move on with this event ASAP. I will repost again in early June with a date/time...Thanks again to all who helped with theordinances and what not!


    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

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    Good luck with this - sounds liking booking a park pavillion at a park not within 1000 ft of a school or somthing might be the way to go then holding a relatively low key event. Ensure that the parking areas are also not within 1000 ft of a school, and that folks understand that unloading/encasing handguns doesnot overcome the concealed carry law, so says the Wisconsin appeals court, so the case cannot be within reach inside the vehicle. Trunk carry is the way to go while inside vehicles.

    let me know when you have a date, timeand location established.

  15. #15
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    Mike wrote:
    Good luck with this - sounds liking booking a park pavillion at a park not within 1000 ft of a school or somthing might be the way to go then holding a relatively low key event. Ensure that the parking areas are also not within 1000 ft of a school, and that folks understand that unloading/encasing handguns doesnot overcome the concealed carry law, so says the Wisconsin appeals court, so the case cannot be within reach inside the vehicle. Trunk carry is the way to go while inside vehicles.

    let me know when you have a date, timeand location established.
    I have an FJ Cruiser, with no back seats. My dog is in the back. I keep my gun under the pass. seat (in a case), because my truck has no other place to keep it (like a pick-up truck). So no, I do not have to keep it "out of reach". I would have to stop to get it, and then load it though... I guess I could tie it to my roof rack...

  16. #16
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    AaronS wrote:
    I have an FJ Cruiser, with no back seats. My dog is in the back. I keep my gun under the pass. seat (in a case), because my truck has no other place to keep it (like a pick-up truck). So no, I do not have to keep it "out of reach". I would have to stop to get it, and then load it though... I guess I could tie it to my roof rack...
    It would appear then that you are breaking the law - within reach usually means wingspan, and guns under seats have long been held in most states to be concealed about your person.

    is it a felony to carry concealed in Wisconsin??

    In any event, the only thing I can suggest is either get another vehicle or at least carry compoiant with FOPA at 18 USC 926A.

  17. #17
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    Mike wrote:
    AaronS wrote:
    I have an FJ Cruiser, with no back seats. My dog is in the back. I keep my gun under the pass. seat (in a case), because my truck has no other place to keep it (like a pick-up truck). So no, I do not have to keep it "out of reach". I would have to stop to get it, and then load it though... I guess I could tie it to my roof rack...
    It would appear then that you are breaking the law - within reach usually means wingspan, and guns under seats have long been held in most states to be concealed about your person.

    is it a felony to carry concealed in Wisconsin??

    In any event, the only thing I can suggest is either get another vehicle or at least carry compoiant with FOPA at 18 USC 926A.
    Mike, no CC is a misdemeanor.

    For everybody on this forum, I don't buy the 'out of reach' requirement, since it's not in the law regarding vehicle carry. Unloaded/encased, period! If the CCW was to be enforced as interpreted by the supreme court, then carrying an unloaded/encased handgun out of a gunstore after buying it is CCW: since it's hidden, in reach, and the person is aware it's there. LEOs could sit outside gunstores all day and issue a citation to every person who walks out with a gun in a case. Yet this does not happen. It is impossible to apply a law which restricts your ability to transport a gun from a store where you bought it. In other words, if the CCW doesn't apply to carrying an unloaded/encased handgun from a store, then it cannot be applied to further restrict vehicle carry. The fact is that you can bring a unloaded/encased handgun anywhere in the state, including into schools, your car...etc. Nowhere in any of the restrictive laws does it specify the required location of the unloaded/encased firearm, only the fact that it is unloaded/encased.

    Besides, this is all a moot point..if you keep the unloaded/encased gun out of view underneath a seat (not in plain view to give a possible probable cause search), and do not consent to a search, then you will ALWAYS be OK.

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    Smithman:

    I agree with you. There is no statute requirement that an encased firearm be carried out of reach. However, this is what the state supreme court said on the issue in the April 4, 2000 case of state v. Nick Alloy.

    ¶3 Much of Alloy’s argument is based on the false
    assertion that he was trapped by a conflict between Wis. Stat. § 167.31 and Wis.
    Stat. § 941.23. A person transporting a firearm is governed by both statutes.
    To comply with § 167.31, the person must encase the weapon. To comply with §
    941.23, he or she must place the enclosed weapon out of reach. See State v.
    Asfoor, 75 Wis. 2d 411, 433-34, 249 N.W.2d 529 (1977). A person complying with
    § 167.31 is not required to violate § 941.23. The encased weapon can be
    lawfully transported out of reach.[3] The trial court properly disallowed
    testimony in support of the invalid defense that § 167.31 compelled Alloy to “go
    armed” with a concealed handgun. See Dundon, 226 Wis. 2d at 674.
    By the Court.—Judgment affirmed.

    The gross error the Court made is it presumed that every vehicle on which a person can lawfully transport a firearm is constructed such that it is possible to carry the firearm out of reach. Of course that is not true. State law specifically allows carry of firearms on snowmobiles andall-terrain-vehicles if they areunloaded and encased.Snowmobiles and ATV'sare buttwo examples where it is impossible to carry anything out of reach, let alone firearms. And then there are bicycles, motorcycles, mopeds as well as others. SSC opinions become case law and as far as I know the SSC has final word and there is no way to contest it except for the legislature to make new law.

  19. #19
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    Just wondering if planning is moving forward with a oc day here in the Bay? If so I'm in...

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    Hey guys, can we keep things on topic. Its good we have discussion about the laws but it gets to the point of manhood measuring (if you get what I'm saying). Its June, we need to get some stuff outlined, a place decided upon, and get this event actually held. We can sit here and pull up law after law, hem and haw over whats what but we can't get anything done if we only do that.

    To that end, I've sent off a letter to GBPD asking which laws we have to keep in mind as well as their policy regarding a person open carrying. Lets get something moving.

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    Okay guys, Things look good on this event,just waiting for my car to sell so I'll have some extra cash to cover food...etc,On a related note if anyone needs or knows anyone who needs a nice gasmizer, I have a very clean 99' Z24 Cavalier($3200) here's the link if you w2 check it out http://appleton.craigslist.org/cto/1219640545.html feel free to PM me if interested...I would appreciate if you guys could ask around for me,cuz the sooner it sells, the sooner we can get things moving! thanks ahead of time!
    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

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    Study up on the dysphemistic 7Ps of planning to prevent police persecution of proper picnic participation. It's better to have a clear understanding of the laws and legal liabilities than to rush in where angels fear to tread.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6_Ps

    The 7 Ps is [ ... ] Prior Planning and Preparation Prevents Piss Poor Performance
    planning to prevent police persecution of proper picnic participation please

  23. #23
    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    NPH_1985 wrote:
    Hey guys, can we keep things on topic. Its good we have discussion about the laws but it gets to the point of manhood measuring (if you get what I'm saying). Its June, we need to get some stuff outlined, a place decided upon, and get this event actually held. We can sit here and pull up law after law, hem and haw over whats what but we can't get anything done if we only do that.

    To that end, I've sent off a letter to GBPD asking which laws we have to keep in mind as well as their policy regarding a person open carrying. Lets get something moving.
    I have already had discussions with the city attorney regarding an OC picnic at Bay Beach. There is no City nor State ordinance which we would be violating. He alluded to "disorderly conduct" as a concern. This was before the AG "memo" I am about a month behind on actually moving ahead with this. What we need is $100 to reserve a shelter for 100 people. There is an additional fee for more than 100 people. We can rent 2 adjacent shelters on the East end for $200 which will cover 200 people.

    Once we get the logistics down, it would be a matter of a courtesy-only call to the city and the county. We do not need their permission to do something which is legal.

    I have assurance that we would have Green Bay TV-11 full media coverage. They are VERY interested in covering this.

  24. #24
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    Well lets actually see how many people are go for this if it were to take place in roughly 2 weeks... So far were @ 4 including myself. Anyone else? just reply with "I'm in" so we can get a rough estimate here...
    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

  25. #25
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    Green Bay in two weeks?

    If thats the weekend of the 27th, we have a litter pick-up that weekend. Sat June 27th at 10 am.

    Im in, if you do it sunday I guess.

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