Okay, here’s how it all went down.
I met the commander and detective in the commander’s office and we sat down to go over what happened and the status of open carry in Indiana. The commander started off by saying again that I was completely in the right. I thanked him for researching this as thoroughly as he did and then I took a minute or two to just explain how poorly I thought the detective handled the situation. The det. was defensive and our discussion got a little heated (“I never threatened you with arrest” “You were yelling too”). He also said that if a cop sees a gun they have a right to ask for your permit. Again, I said yes, you can ask, but I don’t have to show you. I made the point that only if he has reasonable articulable suspicion that I was or am committing a crime could he compel me to show my permit. We went the copy of the IC 35-47-2 (since he insisted that it was in there) I brought with me, and the commander produced some law enforcement FAQ/guidelines that they were basing the “you have to show me your permit if I ask”. However, when we read the guidelines together, I made sure to clearly point out that it said that they may ask for your permit only if they feel you’ve been involved in an incident (RAS) or if they’re investigating a disturbance. I also made the point that they can’t stop every Mexican on the street and ask for a driver’s license, just because some may be illegal aliens.
The commander then said that if I wish to file an official complaint that there is a procedure that he can explain and if I wish to file charges, there is another procedure to take. I said that I have no intention of dragging the detective through the mud and that I only brought up the relevant codes to underscore the seriousness of the incident.
This is where the discussion became very productive.
I explained to them that “we’re on the same team. I hate murderers, rapists, robbers and criminals just as much as you do. I take the law and the safety of my family very seriously. We have the same goals.” Etc. etc. etc. The detective said that they deal with scum all day, everyday and can understandably be on edge whenever they see a firearm. He said every call could be a life or death situation. I said I understood, but that as a citizen, I sometimes get the same feeling towards LE. I referenced the two Chicago cops that in the past two months, killed a couple people in separate drunk driving incidents as well as the BART subway murder (which they knew about), so I got some head nods in agreement and “True, that’s right”.
He also said they never get good press, only bad press. “You could save 100 lives and only get a few lines in the paper, but one bad cop abuses a perp and it’s front page news”. I said I understand, but that conversely, there are tens of thousands of cases a year where citizens use firearms to stop a crime or protect their homes, but the media only reports the time where a guy goes crazy and shoots up a post office or school. Again, they nodded in agreement and said they understood that it goes both ways.
The detective said that he meant no disrespect to me or my family and was sorry for the way things escalated and I said that I wasn’t out to get him or press charges and after we left the room, I would consider it water under the bridge. We shook hands and ended with a bit more respect for each other than when we entered, I’m guessing.
There’s a lot more that we talked about that I left out here, but we discussed the 2A, other states carry laws, gary’s grandfather prohibition on carrying (passed before pre-emption) which they were somewhat surprised to learn, self protection, home defense, crime rising during recession/depressions, a local incident where a couple used a gun to stop a robbery, another local incident where the cops shot a man threatening them with an AK, and lots of other pertinent issues.
All in all, it turned out better than I hoped and was a great opportunity to learn a few things, both for the LE and myself.
Epilogue: The commander showed me an e-mail he sent to the entire department on open carrying and how it is permitted by those with a LTCH. I briefly spoke to the chief as well and he was very receptive and accommodating.
:celebrate