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Thread: oc in mich question

  1. #1
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    I am a marine stationed in VA so i have a VA RESIDENT cpl. i bought my pistol in va. I have a MI drivers lisence. Also Va is a gold star open carry state. Can i OC in Mich?

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    vamarine wrote:
    I am a marine stationed in VA so i have a VA RESIDENT cpl. i bought my pistol in va. I have a* MI drivers lisence. Also Va is a gold star open carry state. Can i OC in Mich?
    Welcome VaMarine.

    The answer to your question is yes, while in Michigan, you may OC.

    The real question here is whether you can CC. I believe the answer to that is also yes, provided you can prove that you have residency in VA. (your station orders should suffice).

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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    It would depend on your circumstances.

    Please see this court case:
    http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs/usr/wba...v_williams.txt

    Basically, the court ruled that:

    Although defendant may have been residing in both Michigan and
    Alabama at the time of his arrest, he could only have one legal
    residence. Gluc v Klein, 226 Mich 175, 179; 197 NW 691 (1924).
    Because defendant had not applied for a Michigan driver's license,
    had not rented or purchased a home in Michigan, and had not
    obtained permanent employment in Michigan,we find that the
    evidence does not establish that defendant intended to permanently
    abandon his Alabama domicile.


    I guess the only issue you would have is the driver' license. A court
    is going to consider the above-mentioned behaviors as indicative of
    whether you would be considered a "Michigan resident". I would think that
    would not be considered a resident and therefore would be able to carry the
    pistol while in Michigan. However, my opinion is not worth anything. If I
    were you I would get a VA driver's license and carry here with that and the VA
    concealed pistol license.

    But perhaps you still have the MI DL so you can get a resident hunting license
    and, if that's the case, it would hard to justify using a Mich DL for residency
    to hunt with a pistol which you claim you are allowed to use because
    you are an out-of-state resident. Just my opinion, though.

    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  4. #4
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Welcome to the site!

    About carrying, I wouldn't do it without a VA drivers license. Maybe overly cautious, but that's what I'd do to be on the safe side.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    Thank you for the replys, i will most likely just cc because mi accepts va resident cpl.

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    Regular Member WARCHILD's Avatar
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    Keep in mind...Military Personel...have a different residency status. Unless it has been changed and I don't believe it has, so check it out.
    Anyone in the military no matter where they are stationed their "home of record" is considered their residence. You state you have a Mich. D.L. so, you are a Mich. resident stationed in Va.
    As I said.... check it out...don't just take my word for it.

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    WARCHILD wrote:
    Keep in mind...Military Personel...have a different residency status. Unless it has been changed and I don't believe it has, so check it out.
    Anyone in the military no matter where they are stationed their "home of record" is considered their residence. You state you have a Mich. D.L. so, you are a Mich. resident stationed in Va.
    As I said.... check it out...don't just take my word for it.
    i understand that and va also considers me a resident hence the resident cpl.

  8. #8
    Regular Member WARCHILD's Avatar
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    Yeah, I figured that. I would suggest, go to the new member info thread and get the email address for Sgt. Deasy of the Mich. state police. Pose the question to him for a more direct answer. I would rather be safe than in jail, especially for a service man.

    Welcome to OCDO and thanks for your service to our country.
    Jerry

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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    vamarine wrote:
    WARCHILD wrote:
    Keep in mind...Military Personel...have a different residency status. Unless it has been changed and I don't believe it has, so check it out.
    Anyone in the military no matter where they are stationed their "home of record" is considered their residence. You state you have a Mich. D.L. so, you are a Mich. resident stationed in Va.
    As I said.... check it out...don't just take my word for it.
    i understand that and va also considers me a resident hence the resident cpl.
    If you are considered a Michigan resident you MAY NOT bring an unregistered pistol into Michigan NOR may you use your VA concealed permit to CC here. Sorry.

    http://www.ag.state.mi.us/opinion/da...0s/op06798.htm

    AG Opinion No. 6798
    May 16, 1994
    CONCEALED WEAPON LICENSE:
    Michigan resident with a concealed weapon license acquired from another state
    A Michigan resident may not carry a concealed pistol in Michigan if the resident has only acquired a license to carry a concealed
    pistol from another state.


    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  10. #10
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    It's still the same solution in my opinion, to go get the VA license. It's the best of all worlds, since you can do as you please with carrying, and not have to register your pistol. I don't know the specifics in VA, but usually it's only a few bucks....
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

  11. #11
    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Michigander wrote:
    It's still the same solution in my opinion, to go get the VA license. It's the best of all worlds, since you can do as you please with carrying, and not have to register your pistol. I don't know the specifics in VA, but usually it's only a few bucks....
    It is a possible solution that may work. The chances of Michigan "knowing" that he is a Michigan resident are slim to none if he gets the VA license. However, vamarine needs to fully understand the potential issues involved. Technically, if the military considers him a Michigan resident then there is the possibility that he could be arrested for the pistol registration requirement and the cc violation, the ccw being a conviction with potentially severe consequences. If that is something vamarine is willing to risk, that is his business. I am hesitant, though, of suggesting that he just get a VA Driver's license as if this will totally negate the possibility of being arrested/convicted. I admit, though, I would probably do as Michigander suggested but I would be fully cognizant of my potential liabilities. In the end vamarine, that is something only you can decide. But, if you do decide to do as Michigander suggested and what I personally would probably do myself, realize that although the VA Driver's license may improve your chances of claiming the legality of ccing the pistol here in Michigan, it does have some risk involved, especially if the MSP have access to Military records (I really do not know if they do).
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    With all that in mind, I think a call to Sgt Deasy is definitely needed!
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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