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Thread: Silver Bullet spreading falsehoods.

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    I just talked to my dad, and he says a guy at his church was at Silver Bullet in Grand Rapids MI (By the way they teach CPL classes), they told him that you can not open carry if you have a CPL. From being here and reading into everything before I already now for a fact the you can open carry at more place such as ,Walmart ,Stores the serve alcohol, a Bar, and many others that are prohibited if you don't have a CPL. The reason I am writing this is to have a Senior Member educate Silver Bullet, so they don't go around teaching everyone in their CPL classes these Lies. The have miss educated who know how many people. This I think is meant to scare people from OCing and looks like people are beleiving it. Someone needs to call Silver Bullet In Grand Rapids and let them know that this is not OK. I have not had a problem with Silver Bullet in the past, in fact I bought 3 or 4 guns from them. Please let me know. I can call but I think it is better left to someone who has been doing this longer and know the laws better, as these a supposedly well educated people. Thanks Here is thier phone # 616-249-1911 They are closed on Sundays.

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    We need to have an info packet specifically to give to CPL teachers. Maybe also a packet specifically intended to be given to CPL students.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    The guy who taught my CPL class told us that you can not show a bit of your gun (he never said anything about open carry). He just said you can't have your barrel showing at all and the rest concealed, and that the entire gun needs to be concealed.

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    That kinda the same thing, because you can carry with your gun showing it just not cc then.

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    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
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    If you have a CPL (CWP here) to conceal, the permit is only to conceal... not carry. WhereOC is recognized, it doesn't matter much how much of the weapon is concealed or whatever. You retain the Right to 'carry'. The permit only addresses one method. Rights do not require permit or license.

    Some of the people who teach this CC stuffdon't comprehend the difference betwen 'rights... license and permit.

  6. #6
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
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    Smoothsounds21 wrote:
    I just talked to my dad, and he says a guy at his church was at Silver Bullet in Grand Rapids MI (By the way they teach CPL classes), they told him that you can not open carry if you have a CPL. From being here and reading into everything before I already now for a fact the you can open carry at more place such as ,Walmart ,Stores the serve alcohol, a Bar, and many others that are prohibited if you don't have a CPL. The reason I am writing this is to have a Senior Member educate Silver Bullet, so they don't go around teaching everyone in their CPL classes these Lies. The have miss educated who know how many people. This I think is meant to scare people from OCing and looks like people are beleiving it. Someone needs to call Silver Bullet In Grand Rapids and let them know that this is not OK. I have not had a problem with Silver Bullet in the past, in fact I bought 3 or 4 guns from them. Please let me know. I can call but I think it is better left to someone who has been doing this longer and know the laws better, as these a supposedly well educated people. Thanks Here is thier phone # 616-249-1911 They are closed on Sundays.
    Do you have a phone? Can you give them a call and enlighten them. We need people doing these things at a grass roots level. If they can't get results then MOC can try.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    I can try and I will post the results on Monday.

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    It's probably just an employee who said that. There was an incident where a member was told that they couldn't OC in SB, but after talking to the manager it was cleared up, and he was told that OC was welcome in SB. When things like this happen, it's important to get the persons name. The management can't do much about it if they don't know who to address.

    As far as the class goes. Lost of CPL instructors give out misinformation. FWIW, Steve Dulan teaches the law portion of their classes (or at least he was last winter).

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    also we have info pamphlets and all kinds of goodies you can print off yourself, and either mail, email, personally deliver, fax, etc. to whomever.


    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/13328.html

    ^check the links in the first post!

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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    I took my CPL class there about 3.5 years ago. The attorney we had was NOT knowledgeable in the slightest regarding OC (I really question whether he had a clear understanding of CC too). After a few questions, I just kept my mouth shut. He told our class that if we so much as "print" we could be successfully convicted of "improper use of a firearm"(???); even claimed that people in Michigan had been convicted of doing just that. When I questioned his statement, he just glared at me, and moved on. I think he was from the Muskegon area though, so I'm sure it was not Atty. Dulan. Everybody else in the class thought he was so "knowledgable".

    But, I guess that's why we are here.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

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    Yup Dr Todd that is one of many reasons that we are out there.

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    I'm on that, I'm in there frequently, and since december, have OC'd every time (except once, when it was raining). I'll figger it out.

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    DrTodd wrote:
    The attorney we had was NOT knowledgeable in the slightest regarding OC
    On a related note, Dean Greenblat was the attorney who answered questions for my CPL class, and I was impressed, because he knows just as much about OCing as anyone here, even though he isn't into it himself. Several times when someone asked "what if's", he would say "well that depends, would you be carrying concealed or openly?"

    Without hesitation I can recommend him as THE guy I would go to if I got popped by police for lawful OCing, especially in the southeast lower peninsula.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    I just got off the phone with a manager from Silver Bullet. I am happy to report that they will be visiting this page and educating there employees about the open carry laws in MI. The manager I spoke with seemed to be aware that you can open carry in MI with a CPL. But soon I hope all the people who work there will know that as well. I had a very pleasant conversation with him and he seemed to understand the need for people to at least know about open carry being legal. Hopefully he will be reading this and if he is I do appreciate the fact that you are looking into this. I hope to be a customer of Silver Bullet for a very long time to come.

    Also he informed me they now have a very knowledgeable attorney in OC by the name of Steven Dulan. This is the attorney that is representing the famous Grand Haven Coast Guard OC.

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    Smoothsound21, enjoyed talking to you when you called Silver Bullet Firearms today. I will post on here what the official Silver Bullet emplyees will be told at our meetings. It may take a little while to cycle thru as we have 20 some employees to talk with. Thanks again for the call . Doug

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    Thanks you very much sir and welcome aboard. I do appreciate all you are doing. You can expect my business any time I need something.

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    It's refreshing to see a business owner educating his employees instead of making excusses.

    It show's great character when someone is more interested in doing things right and giving correct info than pushing an agenda.

    Thanks for your support and I'll be using your store as well when in the area.

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    Awesome, thank you, thank you, thank you! This is beyond refreshing for me. This is downright encouraging!

    Well done Smooth, well done.

    And a big thanks to Doug for actually having an open mind and listening, many, many kudos to you sir.

    I wonder, might you be interested in taking it small step further and putting an OpenCarry.Org sticker up on your door? Or possibly even putting some info cards or tracts up in the store? No pressure, we're all friends here, but it can't hurt to ask!

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    FatboyCykes wrote:
    Awesome, thank you, thank you, thank you! This is beyond refreshing for me. This is downright encouraging!

    Well done Smooth, well done.

    And a big thanks to Doug for actually having an open mind and listening, many, many kudos to you sir.

    I wonder, might you be interested in taking it small step further and putting an OpenCarry.Org sticker up on your door? Or possibly even putting some info cards or tracts up in the store? No pressure, we're all friends here, but it can't hurt to ask!
    It wouldn't be a bad idea since another gun store in town does just that, and they print it up on their own paper.

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    Smoothsounds21 wrote:
    The manager I spoke with seemed to be aware that you can open carry in MI with a CPL.

    Remember, you DON'T need a CPL to open carry in Michigan.

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    I know It was just said there that you can without one but you can only conceal if you have a CPL. As in you can no longer OC.

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    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    Wrong! With a CPL you can OC in many more places than without a CPL!
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    dougmod33 wrote:
    Smoothsound21, enjoyed talking to you when you called Silver Bullet Firearms today. I will post on here what the official Silver Bullet emplyees will be told at our meetings. It may take a little while to cycle thru as we have 20 some employees to talk with. Thanks again for the call . Doug
    Greetings Doug and thanks for taking the time to come and talk with us and get some info.

    Bronson




    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Thomas Paine

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    What we have done at Silver Bullet Firearms is-printed off copies of your 3 page brouchure from your site to give out to our guests that have questions about open carry, we also our having the sales staff go over the brouchure so everyone is on the same page. Thank you again for helping us better help our guests. Doug at Silver Bullet Firearms

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    dougmod33 wrote:
    What we have done at Silver Bullet Firearms is-printed off copies of your 3 page brouchure from your site to give out to our guests that have questions about open carry, we also our having the sales staff go over the brouchure so everyone is on the same page. Thank you again for helping us better help our guests. Doug at Silver Bullet Firearms
    Thanks Doug,

    It's very much appreciated.

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