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Thread: Self Defense, Solicitor Rules

  1. #1
    State Researcher HankT's Avatar
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    This is what gun rights are all about. Without a person exercising his right to carry (CC or OC, doesn't matter), this story would have turned out much differently.

    Kudos to Jim Corley.

    Ironically, a drunk with a gun was a good thing...

    And Corley darn well better get his gun back!





    Man who killed armed robber acted in self defense, solicitor rules


    June 10, 2009


    COLUMBIA, S.C. - The man who shot and killed an armed robber in April at a Five Points club for Alcoholics Anonymous members acted in justifiable self-defense, 5th Circuit Solicitor Barney Giese has ruled.

    "It's as clear a case as I've seen," Giese said Wednesday. He has been the circuit's top prosecutor for 14 years.

    The decision means no charges will be filed.

    Giese identified the man he cleared as James Corley, 61, a prominent Columbia lawyer.

    Corley, a USC law school graduate, is a licensed concealed weapons permit holder and self-described recovering alcoholic who hasn't taken a drink since 1981.

    On April 11, Corley shot and killed Kayson Helms, 18, of Edison, N.J., not only to protect himself, but also to protect others on whom Helms had pulled a .25-caliber pistol, Giese said.

    Helms entered the club, called the ACOA Club, with his gun drawn. When Corley rose from sitting on a couch, drew his gun from a back pocket and fired, Helms had already taken a cell phone at gunpoint from one AA member, so it was an actual, not attempted armed robbery, Giese said.

    Although The State published an interview with Corley days after the shooting, the newspaper identified him only as "Jim" because Columbia police said there was a possibility of retribution against him. They refused to be more specific.

    Giese said Wednesday he found no evidence of any threat against Corley in the 140-page police file of witness interviews and other evidence.

    Giese said it is appropriate to disclose Corley's identity.

    "When a life is taken in a public place, it's a serious matter. The public has a right to know all the facts," Giese said.

    Corley said later Wednesday he had no doubt he would be cleared - sooner or later.

    "You would have a hard time finding a jury that would convict," he said, adding he has no second thoughts. "I haven't lost any sleep at all over it."


    Corley said he thinks he did exactly what he should have.

    "I suspect they will use it as a textbook example in concealed weapons courses of a good, clean, legitimate shoot," he said.

    Corley declined to allow a photographer from The State to take his photo, but not for fear of retribution. As a lawyer who handles divorces, he sometimes is harassed by angry spouses, he said, and a photo would make their job easier.

    Giese explained his thinking this way:

    First, Corley and the others did nothing to provoke Helms' actions.

    And Helms was clearly a robber pointing a gun at people, including Corley, causing them to fear for their lives.

    "At that point, he is entitled to use deadly force under our law," said Giese. "He had a right to defend himself and the others."

    Moreover, Giese said, in incidents in which robbers hold up people in enclosed areas, like the ACOA club, they can end up executing everyone - as in the 1996 slayings of two people at Kelly's Barbershop on Assembly Street.

    "These kind of cases can get out of hand," Giese said.

    Statements police took from the three witnesses just after the shooting and reviewed Wednesday by The State supported Giese's version of events.

    "I believed he may have saved our lives," Jason, 27, an AA member sitting next to Corley on a couch at the time of the shooting, told police. (AA members, seeking privacy, do not use last names.)

    Another witness, Willie, 56, said the robber first pointed his pistol at him, then at Corley. Corley fired when the robber was aiming the gun at Corley's chest, Willie told police.

    Willie said he feared for his life. "I was glad Mr. Jim had a gun."

    The third and only other witness, Kathleen, 27, said Corley acted appropriately. "I was very relieved he was there."

    Giese's decision was consistent with a March ruling in which Lexington County law officers cleared a pizza deliveryman, Christopher Miller, 43, who shot a 17-year-old robber to death while making a delivery.

    In that case, the robber was unarmed but beating on Miller, who was retreating, police said. Miller told police when he saw the robber's three accomplices advancing, he shot twice, killing the first attacker.

    Dick Harpootlian, Giese's predecessor as 5th Circuit solicitor, said given what he knows about the Corley case, he would have made the same decision.

    Corley said he would like police to return his gun - a .32-caliber Kel-Tec semi -automatic.

    Efforts to reach Police Chief Tandy Carter for comment Thursday weren't successful.

    Giese said he sees no objection to police returning Corley's gun.

    Meanwhile, Corley said, he's carrying a spare gun these days - concealed, of course.

    "Before, I just carried a gun because I felt undressed if I didn't have it," he said. "Now, after this, you never know what's going to happen.

    "I'm not looking for a situation to shoot somebody; I don't want to be the one getting shot."

    http://www.gazette.com/articles/corl...se-police.html


  2. #2
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    HankT wrote:
    Ironically, a drunk with a gun was a good thing...
    I'm pleased to see you recognize the potentiality. :P

    Granted, he was a former drunk. Either way, +1. That's what the carry of firearms is all about.

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    HankT wrote:
    Ironically, a drunk with a gun was a good thing...
    As a recovering alcoholic (26+ years thank you very much) I find your remark very offensive! I believe you owe every one here an apology immediately. This as bad as using a racial epitaph to describe someone of color or national origin and is uncalled for.

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    Campaign Veteran ComSec's Avatar
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    modelo57 wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    Ironically, a drunk with a gun was a good thing...
    As a recovering alcoholic (26+ years thank you very much) I find your remark very offensive! I believe you owe every one here an apology immediately. This as bad as using a racial epitaph to describe someone of color or national origin and is uncalled for.
    :shock: I find that offensive that you find that offensive

  5. #5
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    ComSec wrote:
    modelo57 wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    Ironically, a drunk with a gun was a good thing...
    As a recovering alcoholic (26+ years thank you very much) I find your remark very offensive! I believe you owe every one here an apology immediately. This as bad as using a racial epitaph to describe someone of color or national origin and is uncalled for.
    :shock: I find that offensive that you find that offensive
    I'm offended that you find offense at his finding the "drunk" comment offensive.
    Associate with men of good quality if you esteem your own reputation; for it is better to be alone than in bad company. ~ George Washington

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Don't make me offend the lot of you.

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    Outsider here in the health care business. A recovering alcoholic is just that, a recovering alcoholic, nothing more. It is a person who has recognized that a problem exists, and is working to resolve the issue. More power to that person.

    To call a recovering alcoholic a drunk is insulting and rather ignorant.

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    modelo57 wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    Ironically, a drunk with a gun was a good thing...
    As a recovering alcoholic (26+ years thank you very much) I find your remark very offensive! I believe you owe every one here an apology immediately. This as bad as using a racial epitaph to describe someone of color or national origin and is uncalled for.
    Epithet.

    'T' stands for troll.

    To call a recovering alcoholic a drunk is insulting and quite ignorant.
    There, fixed.

  9. #9
    State Researcher HankT's Avatar
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    modelo57 wrote:
    HankT wrote:
    Ironically, a drunk with a gun was a good thing...
    As a recovering alcoholic (26+ years thank you very much) I find your remark very offensive! I believe you owe every one here an apology immediately. This as bad as using a racial epitaph to describe someone of color or national origin and is uncalled for.
    My, my, the Big Book is soooooooo right:

    "We alcoholics are sensitive people. It takes some of us a long time to outgrow that serious handicap."

    I've heard alcoholics in recoverycall other alcoholics in recoverydrunks thousands of times. I have NEVER heard anyone say that was an insult.

    You need to read Rule 62 of AA.

    I don't expect an "outsiderin the health care business" toknow about that rule. But I sure expect you to know it.

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    What is said in the program STAYS in the program! The second A stands for ANONYMOUS!

    Leave it to an insensitive clod to bring up an off topic subject AGAIN and disrupt what this forum is all about.

    Yes, I know. I'm the one that brought this up, but HankT can't make a decent comment without insulting someone.

    It's bad enough that the general public and the media view gun owners as a threat without bringing up the issues of chemical abuse.


    I have been the victim of prejudice because I admitted to alcoholism and sought help and the fact that I carry a gun. Let's not allow these same prejudges to leak into this forum.


    Oh yea, on topic, this shooting was righteous!

  11. #11
    State Researcher HankT's Avatar
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    modelo57 wrote:
    What is said in the program STAYS in the program! The second A stands for ANONYMOUS!
    That's silly. There is no such principle in AA.

    AA is one of the most written about social endeavors in the history of our country. Dozens of books have been written about it and that includes the behaviors and language of the members. Anonymity is a must but secrecy is not.



    modelo57 wrote:
    Leave it to an insensitive clod to bring up an off topic subject AGAIN and disrupt what this forum is all about.

    Yes, I know. I'm the one that brought this up, but HankT can't make a decent comment without insulting someone.

    It's bad enough that the general public and the media view gun owners as a threat without bringing up the issues of chemical abuse.


    I have been the victim of prejudice because I admitted to alcoholism and sought help and the fact that I carry a gun. Let's not allow these same prejudges to leak into this forum.
    Again, I have heard AAers call alkies in recovery drunks thousands of times. No one has ever considered it an insult. You're making that up.

    Even Bill Wilson called AAers in recovery drunks. Like the BB says, you're being to sensitive.Kind of like one of thosegun-hating politically correct liberals we all dislike so much.

    Again, please,read Rule62. You do know what that is? Look it up if you have to. And look up the word "ironically" too.

    "Ironically, a drunk with a gun was a good thing..."




    modelo57 wrote:

    Oh yea, on topic, this shooting was righteous!
    Of course. To display that was the purpose of this thread. An armed attack can come anywhere, anytime. And anyone of us who is legally armed, even a 61 year old professional person in a 12 step meeting, may be called upon to defend himself and others. And it wouldn't have mattered if he had 21 years....or 60 days.

    Keep coming back, modelo57.



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    My point was and is "DON'T FEED THE BEARS!"

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    Glad to see it worked out for him.

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    Maybe some of us are a little tired of the preachy attitude of so many AA members. I run into these people at bars of all places. It is a shame that you find that comment offensive but this is not exactly a "politically correct" board either. Besides, I believe in calling a spade a spade. The man may not have beena drunk and many members who aren't drinking wouldn't be drunks either. However, they are dry drunks because they are as addicted to the AA religion as they used to be to booze. Anyway, I'm going to the fridge to open an iced cold can of Bud Light.



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    Thankfully, he was legally armed, and took the appropriate action necessary to defend himself, and countless innocent others from death or great bodily harm. Otherwise, had he not been armed, the story would have likely unfolded, and turned intoa devastating deadly situation to himself, and thelaw-abiding citizens there at AA.

    Bottom line - regardless of his past in the use of alcoholthat he hasobviously been doing something about,he chose to exercise his legal rights of being armed and ready to protect himself, and to not become a victim.This I can support and appreciate.

    In my opinion, this is clearly an indisputable issue on self-defence. Point-Blank.


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