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FOR ALL YOU PRIVILEGE SEEKERS

J

J.Gleason

Banned
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
3,481
Location
Chilton, Wisconsin, USA
imported post

Brass Magnet wrote:
I also want both! Open carry as a right and concealed carry as a privilege.
Click to expand...
WHAT?
Are you kidding me? Since when should my right to carry whether it be OCor CC become a @#$%ing privilege?

Let me be perfectly clear here... This Forum is about OC! If you want to promote your rights becoming a privilege so you can CC then go somewhere else! Do not come here promoting any type of carry as a privilege. That is ridiculous! Whether I choose to OC or even unlawfully CC it is my GOD given RIGHT! If any of you are going to try to push CC as a privilege and interfere with my right to OC you are in for a fight you will not win! Why don't you start a new web site called CCasaprivilege.org and lets see how many members you get. Until then stop coming on here and giving these lame anti gunners any ammunition. The USSC said that I do not need a permit or license and neither do I have to register to exercise my rights. Let's keep it that way!
 
AaronS

AaronS

Regular Member
Joined
May 2, 2009
Messages
1,497
Location
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA
imported post

I do have to agree. The right to self protection is a right. In no way should it become a card, that can be taken away. I would be happy with laws that let me pick how I can carry (OC or CC), but none should be given, just to take away the right.

So I would love to see CCW in Wisconsin, but I do not want to pay for it, with the loss of a right. If the loss of the right is the only way to get CCW in Wisconsin, I am happy to keep my right, to open carry.
 
M

Mr. Greg

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
218
Location
Greenfield, WI / Grand Forks, ND, ,
imported post

While I may disagree on principle, I would be satisfied if a permit CCW/OC system would be set up.

Carrying without a permit is well and good, but seeing as only one state allows you to CCW without a permit (Not sure what the number of states that allow OC without a permit is, but I know it's numerous), permit-less OC/CCW is nearly a pipe dream.

Besides, I don't necessarily see a background check as a barrier making a license a "privilege" (I suppose the argument could be made for the money required to be paid, but I digress). As long as it's a shall-issue rule, making them give you a permit if you're not a criminal, I see no problem with it. Shall-Issue works the same as a Brady check, and I don't see the same people who rally for non-licensed OC/CCW on the frontlines trying to eliminate FFL transfer requirements.
 
Brass Magnet

Brass Magnet

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2009
Messages
2,818
Location
Right Behind You!, Wisconsin, USA
imported post

J.Gleason wrote:
Brass Magnet wrote:
I also want both! Open carry as a right and concealed carry as a privilege.
Click to expand...
WHAT?
Are you kidding me? Since when should my right to carry whether it be OCor CC become a @#$%ing privilege?

Let me be perfectly clear here... This Forum is about OC! If you want to promote your rights becoming a privilege so you can CC then go somewhere else! Do not come here promoting any type of carry as a privilege. That is ridiculous! Whether I choose to OC or even unlawfully CC it is my GOD given RIGHT! If any of you are going to try to push CC as a privilege and interfere with my right to OC you are in for a fight you will not win! Why don't you start a new web site called CCasaprivilege.org and lets see how many members you get. Until then stop coming on here and giving these lame anti gunners any ammunition. The USSC said that I do not need a permit or license and neither do I have to register to exercise my rights. Let's keep it that way!
Click to expand...

Go post in the thread this came from and actually use an intelligent argument instead of sticking this into a new thread. You're posting something that is totally out of context if you don't read the other thread first. Go try to make someone else look bad like Mcarthy or Feinstein and stop wasting your time trying to polarize people that need to stick together.
 
M

MadisonRebel

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
61
Location
Madison, WI
imported post

Absolutely agreed. The second amendment doesn't cover open carry or concealed carry. It covers carry, by stating the right to keep and bear arms.

As far as I'm concerned, what we're attempting to do is overturn unconstitutional state laws.
 
HankT

HankT

State Researcher
Joined
Feb 20, 2007
Messages
6,215
Location
Invisible Mode
imported post

J.Gleason wrote:
Brass Magnet wrote:
I also want both! Open carry as a right and concealed carry as a privilege.
Click to expand...
WHAT?
Are you kidding me? Since when should my right to carry whether it be OCor CC become a @#$%ing privilege?

Let me be perfectly clear here... This Forum is about OC! If you want to promote your rights becoming a privilege so you can CC then go somewhere else! Do not come here promoting any type of carry as a privilege. That is ridiculous! Whether I choose to OC or even unlawfully CC it is my GOD given RIGHT! If any of you are going to try to push CC as a privilege and interfere with my right to OC you are in for a fight you will not win! Why don't you start a new web site called CCasaprivilege.org and lets see how many members you get. Until then stop coming on here and giving these lame anti gunners any ammunition. The USSC said that I do not need a permit or license and neither do I have to register to exercise my rights. Let's keep it that way!
Click to expand...

I agree the right to bear arms is not a privilege. All of us here understand that. Maybe Brass Magnet just misspoke.

But reasonable regulation of CC (and OC) is not barred by 2A. So, you lose me with your advocacy of "unlawfully" carrying concealed.

Seems to me that would give the lame anti gunners some ammunition. Gun guys talking about breakinglaws they don't like is kind of, uhm, imprudent.:uhoh:
 
Brass Magnet

Brass Magnet

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2009
Messages
2,818
Location
Right Behind You!, Wisconsin, USA
imported post

HankT wrote:
I agree the right to bear arms is not a privilege. All of us here understand that. Maybe Brass Magnet just misspoke.

But reasonable regulation of CC (and OC) is not barred by 2A. So, you lose me with your advocacy of "unlawfully" carrying concealed.

Seems to me that would give the lame anti gunners some ammunition. Gun guys talking about breakinglaws they don't like is kind of, uhm, imprudent.:uhoh:
Click to expand...

Yes Hank! But I didn't mispeak, he misreplied. Which is why this post is totally out of context and down right rude. Now go to read the other thread that he took my quote out of. http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum57/27100.html
 
M

MadisonRebel

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
61
Location
Madison, WI
imported post

HankT wrote:
J.Gleason wrote:
Brass Magnet wrote:
I also want both! Open carry as a right and concealed carry as a privilege.
Click to expand...
WHAT?
Are you kidding me? Since when should my right to carry whether it be OCor CC become a @#$%ing privilege?

Let me be perfectly clear here... This Forum is about OC! If you want to promote your rights becoming a privilege so you can CC then go somewhere else! Do not come here promoting any type of carry as a privilege. That is ridiculous! Whether I choose to OC or even unlawfully CC it is my GOD given RIGHT! If any of you are going to try to push CC as a privilege and interfere with my right to OC you are in for a fight you will not win! Why don't you start a new web site called CCasaprivilege.org and lets see how many members you get. Until then stop coming on here and giving these lame anti gunners any ammunition. The USSC said that I do not need a permit or license and neither do I have to register to exercise my rights. Let's keep it that way!
Click to expand...

I agree the right to bear arms is not a privilege. All of us here understand that. Maybe Brass Magnet just misspoke.

But reasonable regulation of CC (and OC) is not barred by 2A. So, you lose me with your advocacy of "unlawfully" carrying concealed.

Seems to me that would give the lame anti gunners some ammunition. Gun guys talking about breakinglaws they don't like is kind of, uhm, imprudent.:uhoh:
Click to expand...
Unfortunately, that word "reasonable" is a canard. It's subject to the machinations of the judge at hand. There is nothing in the second amendment about reasonable regulation. It says the right shall NOT be infringed. The amendment was set up first and foremost as an insurance policy to keep the populace able to resist the government if it became as oppressive as it was in the 18th century. The notion of having anti-tank weapons, or even tanks, in the possession of the populace may seem ludicrous to some, but that is the level of government power that currently exists. If the populace were to do as Thomas Jefferson suggested, and revolt every 20 years, they might need such means. Now, from a purely strategic view, I think the weaponry we currently suggest could easily facilitate a revolution with little blood. However, the Founders wanted to be sure that never again would we have farmers with scythes fighting Hessians with muskets.
 
J

J.Gleason

Banned
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
3,481
Location
Chilton, Wisconsin, USA
imported post

HankT wrote:
So, you lose me with your advocacy of "unlawfully" carrying concealed.
Click to expand...
I am not advocating carrying concealed. It is unlawful in the State of Wisconsin. The point I was trying to make is that "Carrying" a fire arm is a RIGHT not a PRIVILEGE.

In no way should we have to be permitted, licensed, trained or registered to exercise our rights. Nor should we have to pay a fee or give up another right for a new one (I.E. give up OC for CC.)
 
Brass Magnet

Brass Magnet

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2009
Messages
2,818
Location
Right Behind You!, Wisconsin, USA
imported post

J.Gleason wrote:
HankT wrote:
So, you lose me with your advocacy of "unlawfully" carrying concealed.
Click to expand...
I am not advocating carrying concealed. It is unlawful in the State of Wisconsin. The point I was trying to make is that "Carrying" a fire arm is a RIGHT not a PRIVILEGE.

In no way should we be permitted, licensed, trained or registered to exercise our rights. Nor should we have to pay a fee or give up another right for a new one (I.E. give up OC for CC.)
Click to expand...

And THIS I totally agree with.

http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum57/27100.html
 
M

MadisonRebel

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
61
Location
Madison, WI
imported post

Mr. Greg wrote:
J.Gleason wrote
In no way should we be permitted, licensed, trained or registered to exercise our rights. Nor should we have to pay a fee or give up another right for a new one (I.E. give up OC for CC.)
Click to expand...
Are you against paying a FFL for a gun transfer?
Click to expand...
I'm against the requirement of an FFL in order to sell firearms. Not the gun seller's fault that the government is registering anyone who sells firearms. We got through most of two centuries in this country without such licenses.
 
HankT

HankT

State Researcher
Joined
Feb 20, 2007
Messages
6,215
Location
Invisible Mode
imported post

J.Gleason wrote:
HankT wrote:
So, you lose me with your advocacy of "unlawfully" carrying concealed.
Click to expand...
I am not advocating carrying concealed. It is unlawful in the State of Wisconsin. The point I was trying to make is that "Carrying" a fire arm is a RIGHT not a PRIVILEGE.

In no way should we be permitted, licensed, trained or registered to exercise our rights. Nor should we have to pay a fee or give up another right for a new one (I.E. give up OC for CC.)
Click to expand...

Sorry, seems to me like you are advocating any kind of carry anytime, including "unlawfully CC." Since you see no validity to permitting or licensing of any kind, that's the impression I get from you.

I don't know what fees have to do with your possession on the matter, but I and most others here would agree--it makes no sense to charge someone a fee to get a permit/license to carry. But that's tangential.

The right to bear arms and 2A both do not preclude reasonable regulation of gun ownership, purchase, use and carry. Get used to it. There will be more regulation now that the antis have lost the war.
 
J

J.Gleason

Banned
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
3,481
Location
Chilton, Wisconsin, USA
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Well Hank you have a right to your own opinion. I do not agree that we should have to register our fire arms...for obvious reasons. I do not believe we should have to receive some training before we can lawfully carry our fire arms. I do not believe we should have to pay any permit fee or license fee in order to lawfully carry our fire arms either. Obviously the application fee you pay when you purchase a fire arm is the only way you can obtain possession of said fire arm after purchase.
I do not advocate breaking the law as I have stated earlier.
Again the original debate was the difference between Rights and Privilege.
 
Brass Magnet

Brass Magnet

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2009
Messages
2,818
Location
Right Behind You!, Wisconsin, USA
imported post

HankT wrote:
J.Gleason wrote:
Click to expand...
HankT wrote:
So, you lose me with your advocacy of "unlawfully" carrying concealed.
Click to expand...
I am not advocating carrying concealed. It is unlawful in the State of Wisconsin. The point I was trying to make is that "Carrying" a fire arm is a RIGHT not a PRIVILEGE.

In no way should we be permitted, licensed, trained or registered to exercise our rights. Nor should we have to pay a fee or give up another right for a new one (I.E. give up OC for CC.)
Click to expand...
Sorry, seems to me like you are advocating any kind of carry anytime, including "unlawfully CC." Since you see no validity to permitting or licensing of any kind, that's the impression I get from you.
Click to expand...
Agree
Click to expand...
I don't know what fees have to do with your possession on the matter, but I and most others here would agree--it makes no sense to charge someone a fee to get a permit/license to carry. But that's tangential.
Click to expand...
Agree

The right to bear arms and 2A both do not preclude reasonable regulation of gun ownership, purchase, use and carry. Get used to it. There will be more regulation now that the antis have lost the war.
Click to expand...
Disagree
Click to expand...

I beleive it does preclude reasonable regulation. Resonable regulation was a term invented by the courts to apply to the 2A. However; even if restrictions on the mode of carry is infringement it doesn't matter. It's about balancing your rights against someone elses. It works with all the rights, even the famous "yelling FIRE" in the theatre. You have the right to free speach but as soon as you use it to infringe on others rights, you get trumped. RKBA can also be trumped by someone elses rights in the same way but never by "reasonable regulation" IMO, at least not legally.
 
bigdaddy1

bigdaddy1

Regular Member
Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
1,320
Location
Southsider der hey
imported post

Perhaps PRIVATE MESSAGES would be a more appropriate venue for your agreement.


While we are all concerned about the 2nd amendment, lets not forget the 1st.
 
S

smithman

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
718
Location
Waukesha, Wisconsin, USA
imported post

All people on this forum want to retain our right to OC in Wisconsin. Most want to have a legal means to conceal as well. The amount of jumping through hoops to be able to conceal varies among members, and it will ALWAYS be a contentious issue.

People, Vermont-style carry will NEVER come to Wisconsin, period. If you want to conceal in this state in the future, you will have to concede and get a permit and pay a fee at some point once such a system is set up. This is the way the government and the NRA want it. The NRA calls CC "right-to-carry laws" but when you have to meet the states requirement for training and pay a fee for them to confirm that you aren't a felon (as if felons ever apply for such permits), it IS NO LONGER a right.
 
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