Sky Harbor - Phoenix

imported post

'Had occaision to pick up a friend in Sky Harbor early this week'n then take him back yesterday. This was more than a curbside deal... so I hadda wander the main terminal a bit.We left the guns in the truck... butI still had my open bucket and an open topped mag pouch on my pants belt. I didn't wear the gunbelt 'cause it's bulky to 'hide'.

Ennyhoo... the terminal is not posted (that I observed)... but all the security types and the info booth wonks got a nervous twitch goin' when I inquired about carryin' pistols in the terminal (if you were not going to fly). They were universal in their "NO's". I had my bud transport a Kraut 9mm P-38 back to a warrelics dealer we both know when he left. (Along with a letter for all the mfg codes 'n Waffenampt proofs on the pistol and two magazines.) The holster is also original. I included a P-38 water pistol that I've used a holster filler for years. That's prob'ly a rare piece now too.

So... he checks the gun in at the ticket counter... and asecurity dude takes the box (now with a security tag) and escorts him (and I)to a 'special' X-ray TSA thingie 'cross the way. They run it thru... give him a receipt and then thesecurity guy brings it back to the ticket booth and away it goes as checked baggage. They were very nice about the whole thing.

So... my bud got home last nite 'n had no apparent problems at BWI in the Demokratik Peoples Republik of Murderland either (amazing).

There's no real reason to carry in the terminal... Not 'that' one at least... altho I've been thru some where I'd rather been heeled than not. So... the wife pulls off into the Gila River casino on the way back south... and we leave there $600. to the good. Must'a been 110 deg... and the recent Monsoon activity has upped the humidity (agh!).


As an aside... it was his first ever public OC while he was here in AZ. I let him carry the .40 and/or the .45.

imported post

I O.C. at the Tucson airport frequently, especially when picking up my troops returning from deployments. Doing this again today. Haven't had any problems thus far...



ETA: Mission accomplished. After getting him home I went to Borders and then Performance Bicycle shop. The clerk at Performance asked what kind of gun I carried (Taurus PT1911), then asked if I ever CC'd. I explained that I did have an Arizona CWP but mostly OC'd for comfort in the heat. He nodded and said "Hmm". Iprobably should have elaborated more, but I was running late for some other stuff by then.

My Senior NCO at the airport never said a word or even raised an eyebrow that I could tell. Don't think he's ever seen me OC, but I'm going to be prepared for possible questions tomorrow...

imported post

There was a thread about OC at Sky Harbor earlier this year or late last year. I have never OC there, but I understand people do quite often. A Police Lt. (?) joined in that thread and said officers there were trained that OC at Sky Harbor was legal.

Here it is....

http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_topic.php?id=11155&forum_id=10&highlight=sky+harbor

imported post

Best advice is call DPS and ask them, do not listen to people on the internet with a little knowledge about the laws including myself. Find out your self.
S/F Vic

imported post

Actually, short of finding a lawyer and getting his advice, next time down at Sky Harbor, find the Lt. from the other thread(RickG) and talk to him. He sounds like a pretty straight shooter(pun intended). There's not much telling who you will be getting advice from if you call the DPS office.

imported post

Very interesting. I took a friend's daughter and grandkid to Sky Harbor 10 days ago or so. OC'd the 1911 with two extra mags. Stood in line with them to check-in at the Southwest counter, got junior a snack, walked around the terminal, and then walked them to the security gate. Passed many, many Airport employees, TSA's dingelberry's, and regular security folks, and never got a raised eyebrow, much less anything else.

I've OC'd at Sky Harbor for nigh on 29 years or so, and have never had a LEO encounter of any kind. I find it kind of interesting that you had such reactions, not to mention the BS "No" answer to your carry questions.

Unless, of course, things have changed in the past week. Though I think we would have heard something.

imported post

Pistol-Packing-Preacher-in-PV wrote:

Very interesting. I took a friend's daughter and grandkid to Sky Harbor 10 days ago or so. OC'd the 1911 with two extra mags. Stood in line with them to check-in at the Southwest counter, got junior a snack, walked around the terminal, and then walked them to the security gate. Passed many, many Airport employees, TSA's dingelberry's, and regular security folks, and never got a raised eyebrow, much less anything else.

I've OC'd at Sky Harbor for nigh on 29 years or so, and have never had a LEO encounter of any kind. I find it kind of interesting that you had such reactions, not to mention the BS "No" answer to your carry questions.

Unless, of course, things have changed in the past week. Though I think we would have heard something.

Click to expand...

My wife and I will be OC at Sky Harbor this weekend when I take my daughter to the airport to send her back to Texas for a couple of weeks.

I'll let you know the results.

imported post

Pistol-Packing-Preacher-in-PV wrote:

Very interesting. I took a friend's daughter and grandkid to Sky Harbor 10 days ago or so. OC'd the 1911 with two extra mags. Stood in line with them to check-in at the Southwest counter, got junior a snack, walked around the terminal, and then walked them to the security gate. Passed many, many Airport employees, TSA's dingelberry's, and regular security folks, and never got a raised eyebrow, much less anything else.

I've OC'd at Sky Harbor for nigh on 29 years or so, and have never had a LEO encounter of any kind. I find it kind of interesting that you had such reactions, not to mention the BS "No" answer to your carry questions.

Unless, of course, things have changed in the past week. Though I think we would have heard something.

Click to expand...

Yeah... the Southwest counteris whereI took my friend. The 'NO' came from several sources... 'n the dude at the info booth got all nervous like "Do you have it on you now?" I live over 100milessouth ofSky Harbor so it's not like I go there frequently. BUT... I don't like leavin' my gun in parking lots. I didn't want to risk a hassle either. We did go in Chile's tho... so I s'pose it's just as well. That joint is ridiculously expensive... waaaayyyyy overpriced as I soon found out.

imported post

Sonora:

Well, since you went into Chili's... *GRIN* Overpriced is an understatement.

Still, I find it interesting that you got the reaction that you did. Perhaps they were just trying to "encourage" you not to exercise an available right. Guess I'll have to contact RickG (if he's still around) and find out if something has changed.

imported post

reconvic wrote:

Best advice is call DPS and ask them, do not listen to people on the internet with a little knowledge about the laws including myself. Find out your self.
S/F Vic

Click to expand...

Asking a liar doesn't do much good either. You'll be hard pressed to find any government employee that 'allows' you to carry a gun, much less openly. They all say "no" regardless.

imported post

Having read a few of your posts it appears youare rather bitter with life ixtow. Did the boy's in blue or brown lock you up for something?

imported post

TOF wrote:

Having read a few of your posts it appears youare rather bitter with life ixtow. Did the boy's in blue or brown lock you up for something?

Click to expand...

They've tried.

imported post

TOF wrote:

Having read a few of your posts it appears youare rather bitter with life ixtow. Did the boy's in blue or brown lock you up for something?

Click to expand...

Right!! LOL I've open carried at Sky Harbor many times. If it was illegal i'd be in jail

imported post

Soooo... long story short... Next time I have to go up that way... I'm goin' heeled.

imported post

way to be!!!!!!! The only way I might add

imported post

I was at Sky Harbor on Saturday morning, from 10:00 AM to 11:20 AM walking around in terminal 4 through the ticketing lines for Southwest, upstairs through the terminal shopping area, and over to the Security Area at the C Gates.

In all of that movement I only noticed TSA personnel looking at me cross-eyed (the two men that did look at me) while the two Phoenix PD in the terminal didn't even give me a glance.

We dropped off our daughter, retraced our steps back out to the parking garage, and went on our merry way.

No hassles, not so much as an interview. Good experience.

imported post

davesnothere wrote:

I was at Sky Harbor on Saturday morning, from 10:00 AM to 11:20 AM walking around in terminal 4 through the ticketing lines for Southwest, upstairs through the terminal shopping area, and over to the Security Area at the C Gates.

In all of that movement I only noticed TSA personnel looking at me cross-eyed (the two men that did look at me) while the two Phoenix PD in the terminal didn't even give me a glance.

We dropped off our daughter, retraced our steps back out to the parking garage, and went on our merry way.

No hassles, not so much as an interview. Good experience.

Click to expand...

I find it hard to believe that one shift of employees, from all different companies and agencies, could all be indoctrinated one way, and the whole other shift in another.

You have to wonder how many are just in condition white.... If there really was a problem, would they even notice? If you walked up and asked them, while OCing, if OC was OK, what do you think would happen? It's probably the only way to get them to even notice!

Of course, if I do that, I'll be accused of stirring up... But really, I just want to make the point. They aren't paying any attention, and if you don't walk right up in their face and tell them about it, they won't even notice...

We all know they can't protect us from anything. It's up to us. but they are there to at least create an illusion of security, tell us guns are bad, and they don't even see them? What are they doing? Why are they there? And most importantly, Why are we paying them?

imported post

Ixtow, this isn't intended to get you riled, so don't take it the wrong way, but just because the officers in the airport didn't obviously react to the fact that I was OC'ing doesn't mean that they didn't see or notice that fact.

As has been expressed many times concerning Arizona, as well as the other States where OC and other forms of carry are fully allowed, the LEOs here, as well as most of the general public, are much more accepting of carry, as well as weapons in general.

Your negative experiences with LE do not make all cops bad, just as the evil actions of some civilian gun-owners don't make all gun-owners bad.

Avoid broad generalizations and open your mind to the possibility that there might be hope for some of the LEOs you encounter - with a little education.

imported post

davesnothere wrote:

Ixtow, this isn't intended to get you riled, so don't take it the wrong way, but just because the officers in the airport didn't obviously react to the fact that I was OC'ing doesn't mean that they didn't see or notice that fact.

As has been expressed many times concerning Arizona, as well as the other States where OC and other forms of carry are fully allowed, the LEOs here, as well as most of the general public, are much more accepting of carry, as well as weapons in general.

Your negative experiences with LE do not make all cops bad, just as the evil actions of some civilian gun-owners don't make all gun-owners bad.

Avoid broad generalizations and open your mind to the possibility that there might be hope for some of the LEOs you encounter - with a little education.

Click to expand...

I love having that reputation, but I based my statements strictly on the observations made by others in this very thread, and went out of my way to make that pretty clear.

At the top everyone queried said "no way!" Yet several others wander around with guns for hours, and not a peep...

It seems the thought doesn't even cross their mind. One can ASSUME that they see it and approve, or don't care. But ASSUMING isn't definitive.

I mentioned that it's impossible to both walk around with a gun, AND walk up and ask while wearing it, without being accused of agitation. But as the evidence supports, there seems no other way to arrive at a definitive answer.

I didn't single out cops either. I mentioned every employee in the place.

Is 'my reputation' all it takes to cloud your own perception, even in plainly written words?

Nope, doesn't bother me a bit.

What I'm suggesting is a poll. Kind of like the way a place or business tries to defy corporate policy and make it's own anti-gun law, and then a bunch of OCers go there to press the issue and get a real answer. But, instead, take a poll. Go there with a dozen people unarmed, asking if it is ok to OC a gun, etc. Then after they all say no, mention the other dozen people that you have seen walking around with guns. Offer no help in identifying them.

Watch.

I was hoping I wouldn't have to be the only creative one...

While that seems obnoxious, I'm honestly trying to find a way to pull them out of condition white and see what they do when they are aware. It's the least obnoxious way of doing it that I can think of.