Carry on VRE

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Thundar wrote:

Reply from Mr. Flores:




[align=left]Dear Mr. xxxxxxxxxx,[/align]
[align=left]Thank you for writing.[/align]

[align=left]We understand and appreciate your perspective. As stated in emails to other passengers, we are making revisions to our tariff to be in compliance with Virginia Code and to clarify the circumstances that would permit us to refuse passage.[/align]

[align=left]That said,you may board our trains armedif you have all the necessary permits to legally carry firearms in Virginia. Please be aware that the laws are different in D.C., where it may not be legal to carry a firearm.[/align]

[align=left]Thank you for riding VRE.[/align]
[align=left]Regards, [/align]Jeremy Flores
Operations Service Manager
Virginia Railway Express
1500 King Street, Suite 202
Alexandria, VA 22314-2730
Main (703) 684-1001
Fax (703) 684-1313
gotrains@vre.org
[url]http://www.vre.org/[/url]

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You can feel this guy's indigestion over this issue just from reading his reply. It's almost enough to make you feel sorry for him. Well, not really...

It does make you chuckle... all the necessary permits. Yep, got them all right here... they're printed on invisible paper, with invisible ink...

TFred

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TFred wrote:

It does make you chuckle... all the necessary permits. Yep, got them all right here... they're printed on invisible paper, with invisible ink...

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And here I was thinking that my original permit is stored under lock and key (or maybe bulletproof glass, if it's on display) in the National Archives.

~ Boyd

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I've ridden VRE twice a day for about 7 years.

If you're carrying openly, you might want to give some thought about how easy it is to fall asleep on a rockin' train. I do it all the time, and judging from the cell phone alarms programmed to wake them up just before hitting a station, it seems like a lot of others do too.

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Nelson_Muntz wrote:

If you're carrying openly, you might want to give some thought about how easy it is to fall asleep on a rockin' train. I do it all the time, and judging from the cell phone alarms programmed to wake them up just before hitting a station, it seems like a lot of others do too.

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This is more than "condition white!" Call it "condition whiteout?"

If you are comfortable sleeping in an unknown potentially risky situation I have to think you might be more comfortable if you did not carry at all.

I don't see any distinction between OC and CC here, because you wouldn't become aware if your CC'd piece were inadvertently exposed or printed during your nap. Seems to me that this would be even more of an invitation to a BG to help himself to the item than if it were OC'd, especially in a retention holster.

But really, falling asleep in a public place while carrying? Your choice, obviously, but you might want to assess how well this fits with your overall SD plan.

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I don't think Nelson was talking about intentionally falling asleep on the train, just that it might happen despite you wanting to stay awake. I think he's talking about exactly what you mention, architect.

And an additional danger he's referring to from falling asleep is missing the last stop before you enter the District of Columbia. Not good.

~ Boyd

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Thanks for your concern of my SA, Architect. But TexasNative got it right.

I would OC on VRE, but I ride it into the mouth of the beast where it is prohibited. Just wanted to warn anyone considering it, that it is pretty easy to fall asleep. The last thing I'd want to do is fall asleep in public with a firearm visible.

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I looks like VRE doesn't like it, but has figured out what they need to do. I sent them:

-----------------------------

Description/Comments:

I noticed in your tariff that your policies are in violation of VA State law. I have included 06.02.00 below for reference.

Open carry of a firearm in VA does not require a permit of any kind. Anyone age 18 or older can carry a firearm in plain view.

Concealed carry of a firearm does require a permit. Anyone age 21 or older can apply for a permit and VA is a "shall issue" state.

VA State law provides for complete preemption where the VA General Assembly occupies the entire field concerning the purchase, possession, and carry of firearms in the commonwealth. No other government entity can create or enforce any regulation in those areas beyond what the VA General Assembly has provided for in Title 18 of the VA State Code. Title 18 of the VA State Code also allows for damages to be awarded to any individual that chooses to carry a firearm in the open without a permit or concealed with a permit and is subsequently refused passage under your unenforceable tariff.

You should also be aware that it is a matter of settled law in VA that the carrying of a firearm in the open without a permit is not grounds for the police to stop, question, harass, or detain an individual that chooses to do so.

I have been a VRE passenger and I plan to continue being one in the future. I want to know how your staff is going to respond to a passenger who chooses to exercise their right to carry a firearm in the open without a permit. Will your staff refuse passage in violation of VA State law? Will your staff stop, question, harass, or detain a passenger who chooses to exercise their right to carry a firearm in the open without a permit?

-----------------------------



And their response was:

-----------------------------

Thank you for writing.

We understand that you do not need a permit to openly carry firearms. As a result, we will be changing our tariff as part of some other changes that we are working on. While the actual document won’t be changed until after our September Board meeting (our Operations Board must approve all tariff changes), we do not intend to enforce that portion of our tariff in the meantime. In addition, we will be defining "dangerous weapons" in that section of our tariff to better conform with Virginia law.

We hope this better clarifies our position.



Sincerely,

April Maguigad

Manager, Operations and Customer Communications

-----------------------------

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Les, I have a feeling they are becoming sufficiently 'cowed'. They've heard from several different people in the last couple of weeks. I believe they've found that their regulations are contrary to Commonwealth law and are quietly moving to change that, during their next scheduled board meeting.

He did indicate that they would make sure their unlawful regulations are not enforced to accomodate the law abiding, rights excercising, citizen. In fact, it seems that in his response they have verified that what you and others have been trying to get across is in fact settled law.

If you ask me, the response looks like they will simply change the definition of 'dangerous weapons' to only include the word(s) illegal, illegally, etc. in conjunction with firearms. They know they are dependant on local and federal funds to continue to operate, which an awake and vocal segment is making them aware of.

I have a medical appointment and an automotive service appointment on Wednesday. If I am done early enough, and if it coincides with their schedule (to/from) within a reasonable length of time, I will OC on VRE for a few or more stops and wait for a returning train to bring me back. I'll have to check the printed schedules to see if this will be reasonable. If it is not possible I will always be open to trying it again when schedules coincide.


ETA: If Thundar doesn't get to it first!

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I wish we had a train trainsportation system around here... I do love riding the train!

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Didn't get to take a short ride and back today after my appts. VRE only runs regularly in the early morning. Afternoon, not so much. It's all yours Thundar.

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Nelson_Muntz wrote:

Didn't get to take a short ride and back today after my appts. VRE only runs regularly in the early morning. Afternoon, not so much. It's all yours Thundar.

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Yep, it's definitely a commuter train. Early morning in, late afternoon return. I think there may be one return in the early-afternoon. It's easy enough to find here: http://vre.org/service/schedule.htm

There are a few Amtrak trains on the schedule, which you can only use if you have one of the multi-day passes.

TFred

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MSC 45ACP wrote:

I wish we had a train trainsportation system around here... I do love riding the train!

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The light rail is coming to Norfolk some day.

Danbus has had fun on the bus. HRT has already been schooled.

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MSC 45ACP wrote:

I wish we had a train trainsportation system around here... I do love riding the train!

Click to expand...

The light rail is coming to Norfolk some day.

Danbus has had fun on the bus. HRT has already been schooled.

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Thundar, did you have any reactions to your OC on the train this week?

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RedKnightt wrote:

Thundar, did you have any reactions to your OC on the train this week?

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Woodbridge to Crystal City, some :what:but no LEO calls or other negative actions. I was in a suit and tie, so maybe that calmed the nervous nellies.

The train wasn't as nice as I thought it would be.

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RedKnightt wrote:

Thundar, did you have any reactions to your OC on the train this week?

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Woodbridge to Crystal City, some :what:but no LEO calls or other negative actions. I was in a suit and tie, so maybe that calmed the nervous nellies.

The train wasn't as nice as I thought it would be.

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Thundar wrote:

RedKnightt wrote:

Thundar, did you have any reactions to your OC on the train this week?

Click to expand...

Woodbridge to Crystal City, some :what:but no LEO calls or other negative actions. I was in a suit and tie, so maybe that calmed the nervous nellies.

The train wasn't as nice as I thought it would be.

Click to expand...

Just pistol, no long gun OC?

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Thundar wrote:

MSC 45ACP wrote:

I wish we had a train trainsportation system around here... I do love riding the train!

Click to expand...

The light rail is coming to Norfolk some day.

Danbus has had fun on the bus. HRT has already been schooled.

Click to expand...

I remember reading about Danbus' Trials and Tribulations aboard HRT. I don't know if I want to take a ride on HRT just to check :whatr ( ) * ( )holes.

They do have some cool new busses, but I enjoy driving my car when in Norfolk. Midget and I do enjoy the zoo, though. I think we'll make a trip down there soon and check out the critters (inside and outside the cages).