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Thread: Open carry of gadget guns in CC free zones

  1. #1
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Most of these things are NFA guns, but as I undestand it, black powder muzzle loading ones are regulated just like an old black powder revolver. So as far as I know, it's legal to have the black powder ones in Michigan without a lot of trouble, and also legal to have the cartridge versions if you feel like registering a gun as an AOW. And then there are the stinger .22 and .25 pen guns that aren't even regulated as NFA items because they have to be folded into a pistol shape to be fired.

    In Michigan, we are obviously in a funny position with schools and other CC free zones. Those of us with CPLs can only open carry. In some cases, we'd be risking getting kicked out or fired from our jobs if we carried. But what if we had some kind of visible gun that doesn't look like a gun? Wouldn't that still technically be legal?

    While pumping a bike tire recently it occured to me just how easy it would be to convert a portable bike pump into a slam fire .357 magnum, and this idea came to me.

    Did this occur to anyone else? Anybody think it's a lousy idea? Maybe a good idea?
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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    I actually own one of the stingers in .22lr; useless as anything other than a "conversation piece". It was made in the Soo; they are no longer in business. When I brought it in during the days of the Michigan "pistol inspection", the clerk thought it was the most interesting thing she had ever seen. About 4-5 Police Officers came in and took a look at it.

    Like Michigander said, it was not an AOW, I believe because one needed to actually fold it to shoot. Then to reload, unscrew the end, pull out the spent casing and insert another .22lr cartridge and screw it back on. The safety was a slide, but it always seemed to be moving around and I thought it was pretty unsafe.

    It is not illegal to make a firearm per se, but making a functional firearm that looks like something else is risky (especially a .357 :what, but it can be done. In my "not so distant" past I made a homemade 9mm pistol and I made a shotgun. As long as you register after you make it, I don't see what the problem would be. Perhaps someone here knows better than I do regarding the legalities??
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  3. #3
    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Michigander wrote:
    But what if we had some kind of visible gun that doesn't look like a gun? Wouldn't that still technically be legal?
    FIREARMS (EXCERPT)
    Act 372 of 1927

    28.421 Definitions.Sec. 1.
    As used in this act:
    (a) "Felony" means that term as defined in section 1 of chapter I of the code of criminal procedure, 1927 PA 175, MCL 761.1, or a violation of a law of the United States or another state that is designated as a felony or that is punishable by death or by imprisonment for more than 1 year.
    (b) "Firearm" means a weapon from which a dangerous projectile may be propelled by an explosive, or by gas or air. Firearm does not include a smooth bore rifle or handgun designed and manufactured exclusively for propelling by a spring, or by gas or air, BB's not exceeding .177 caliber.
    (c) "Misdemeanor" means a violation of a penal law of this state or violation of a local ordinance substantially corresponding to a violation of a penal law of this state that is not a felony or a violation of an order, rule, or regulation of a state agency that is punishable by imprisonment or a fine that is not a civil fine, or both.
    (d) "Peace officer" means, except as otherwise provided in this act, an individual who is employed as a law enforcement officer, as that term is defined under section 2 of the commission on law enforcement standards act, 1965 PA 203, MCL 28.602, by this state or another state, a political subdivision of this state or another state, or the United States, and who is required to carry a firearm in the course of his or her duties as a law enforcement officer.
    (e) "Pistol" means a loaded or unloaded firearm that is 30 inches or less in length, or a loaded or unloaded firearm that by its construction and appearance conceals it as a firearm.

    I believe that the statement "a loaded or unloaded firearm that by its construction and appearance conceals it as a firearm" is what would keep it defined as a pistol and the fact that it is concealed as a firearm.

    My employer's rules/regulations would include a "pen gun" as a firearm.

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  4. #4
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    DrTodd wrote:
    It is not illegal to make a firearm per se, but making a functional firearm that looks like something else is risky (especially a .357 :what, but it can be done. In my "not so distant" past I made a homemade 9mm pistol and I made a shotgun. As long as you register after you make it, I don't see what the problem would be. Perhaps someone here knows better than I do regarding the legalities??
    It would have to be registered as an AOW, and also as a pistol because of Michigan law. As far as I know, these are the only important legal factors regarding ownership.

    It would also be quite safe in .357 or even .45 Colt caliber because the diameter of a bike pump is more than large enough to accommodate a chopped down barrel. Safety features and relatively rapid reloading capability are concerns, but I have theories about how these things could be accomplished.

    If possible I'd like to make one of these as a muzzle loader in order to bypass the NFA and Michigan registration, but I'm a lot less sure on ways to do that safely and effectively. Plus, there would obviously be no chance for a second shot in any circumstance where it could count.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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