M
McX
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:what:SNIP A store across the street was robbed, at gunpoint, one of the criminals ran out of the store, with the owner in hot persuit.
Yes, it's the job of the police to pursue criminals. It's not in our job description.McX wrote::what:SNIP A store across the street was robbed, at gunpoint, one of the criminals ran out of the store, with the owner in hot persuit.
See I totally agree I won't and wouldn't draw my gun unless a life was in danger, but I WOULD take action if I was in a place being robbed. I'm DONE letting criminals think we will sit by and let them "have their way just as long as they don't kill anyone". Hell no.I can't speak for everyone on here but I will not get involved in any situation like that unless I am sure that someone's life is in danger. For example, if I'm in a store while it's being robbed the safest thing I can do is let the guy have the money and leave.
Mind the hidden knife.SNIP I won't draw my gun if no life is in danger, but bet your ass I'll try to tackle or detain the person so long as doing so wouldn't (realistically) endanger lives.
Yes, once you draw an armed assailant's attention to you, for what ever purpose or reason, then you might as well prepare to defend yourself. Because you have arguably violated the first element of common-law self-defense, "be innocent of instigation."Mind the hidden knife.
I think the armed assailant is the "instigator" in this case. One can hardly commit armed robbery and then claim no responsibility for the consequences. Well, one CAN make that claim, but see how far it goes.Citizen wrote:Yes, once you draw an armed assailant's attention to you, for what ever purpose or reason, then you might as well prepare to defend yourself. Because you have arguably violated the first element of common-law self-defense, "be innocent of instigation."Mind the hidden knife.
The elements of common-law self-defense are four; Be innocent of instigation. Be in reasonable fear of bodily harm. Use sufficient force only to deliver oneself from evil. Attempt to withdraw.
I don't think you mentioned if the victim was armed during his pursuit. Either way it's not advisable for anyone but a uniformed officer to run down the streets with a drawn weapon. If, for any reason, I was inclined to make a pursuit, I would have concealed first. Or at the least kept the gun holstered. But everything depends on the circumstances. School zone laws be damned if you have a legitimate reason to enter them armed. If I saw a serious enough offense occurring on the front steps of a school I wouldn't hesitate intervene with my gun.Thank you all so much for your input. I've played out a number of "headlines" in my head,as well: Open Carrier enters school zone, and stops criminal, hailed as hero. Open carrier enters school zone, stops criminal, and goes to jail himself. Open carrier accidentally shot by police during attemtpt to stop criminal. None of them realy "worked" for me. My weapon remained holstered during the entire event. Had the criminal moved onto my property I would have drawn, and intercepted I guess saying: Halt, get down on the ground! Surrender, and submit to questioning by civil authorities................pretty lame huh? No "everybody freeze Miami Vice" number came to mind. In any event, it was an extremely stressful situation, and at 50 years old, I wasn't about to run down, and tackle anyone, and I did indeed consider the possibility of me receiving a "shank" to the ribs if I got too close in proximity to the criminal. Either way, it's over..............thank God.
There are two schools of thought concerning whose actions can cause the defendant to be guilty of felony murder. Jurisdictions that hold to the agency theory admit only deaths caused by the agents of the crime. Jurisdictions that use the proximate cause theory include any death, even if caused by a bystander or the police, provided that it meets one of several proximate cause tests to determine if the chain of events between the felony and the death was short enough to have legally caused the death.
When I went through the Academy I was instructed that if I was carrying a fire arm and some one used an incapacitating agent on me in an effort to take my fire arm and possibly attempt to kill me with it, that I would be justified in using my fire arm against them due to imminent threat.Lets say the guy threatens you with pepper spray, and you shoot this person because you honestly feared for your life. It is your burden to prove you actually did fear for your life instead of the burden being on the prosecutor to prove otherwise! We are actually expected to prove our innocence the twisted way our courts are right now.