JC
Regular Member
imported post
What's the stand down on open carry about? Harmful Legislation? Can anyone elaborate?
What's the stand down on open carry about? Harmful Legislation? Can anyone elaborate?
Don't give them any ideas!and I'll continue to so until violence is used to stop me.
I think we can all agree that the RKBA includes open, loaded, carry as well as concealed carry. It is difficult to see how one right can be exercised while the other right is denied when they are two aspects of the same right!
However, what we seem to disagree on is the means of attaining the end. Some believe open carry will be the catalyst to bring about our goals and others believe the opposite. What we must bear in mind is that open carriers are not the enemy. They are our comrades, literally, in arms. Let's fight the right foe! If we spend too much time fighting amongst ourselves somebody might think we are Irish!
Even if all gun owners died, they'd still infringe on the corpses.
The system is a farce, and everyone knows how to manipulate it.I had a friend threaten me with a restraing order just because she hate firearms UMmm shes no longer a friend known here for 10 years now that suck f it
I honestly do not know where these guys are coming from?!
Put yourself in Gene's shoes. You're the head of the main group fighting for gun rights in California. Your goal is to free California citizens from the all restrictions placed on gun owners. Right now you've suffered a temporary setback which means your attack must be delayed for six months. What do you advise people to do?I just read the opening of a thread started by Gene last week. Now he is advising not to UOC until June of 2010, maybe??!! :banghead:
First it was, wait until the CA legislature gets out of session and now its wait until June 2010, maybe? I think that is pretty unreasonable!!!!
I've explained before that there is a reason for the order of operations here.
We can get shall issue CCW if we attack that first (and say some things in that attack that OC proponents will not like - I'm warning you.) Once we secure shall issue CCW there is a specific way in which we can likely decriminalize LOC as well. I too don't want to be in the Texas situation of being cited for OC when I have a CCW too. That will also mean we'll head after GFSZ's too but those are certainly not the first cases you want to bring.
If we went in the other order, then I worry simply that LOC will end up being prohibited by every mall and restaurant in California. Just look at what is happening in Arizona and Tenessee for goodness sake. Bars are posting "no guns" signs even after both states started allowing CCW carriers in. Don't for a moment think that if LOC is our only choice, that we will not suffer the effect of having gun haters outnumber us 3:2 and have that make the private sector make it virtually impossible to carry.
LCAV and Brady would enjoy us attempting to get the equivalent ruling to Pruneyard on guns. Here's a hint - it will not happen. We'll have a mooted right to LOC - basically useless...
I've open carried before in places where it is legal and the public support ratio is more like 1:1. It is nicer and easier than CCW. Personally I want to walk down Market Street in San Francisco with an AR on my back and a Sig on my hip and a s**t eating grin on my face.
Do this in reverse, and we'll all hang separately. Remember that it took 100 years after the end of slavery for black people to stop being lynched. The patience we're asking for is very, very short in comparison. Also note that I'm certainly not saying no UOC. I'm saying no lone UOC and that it would be far, far better politically if the group UOC wasn't a bunch of normal white males.
-Gene
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Gene Hoffman
Chairman, The Calguns Foundation - Member, CRPA Board of Directors
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[align=center]"The problem with being a gun rights supporter is that the left hates guns and the right hates rights." -Anon
Ultima Ratio Liberarum[/align]
And now THEY have decided that financially and legally backing UOC is not worth it to them at this time. And then THEY ask us all to stop UOC for the time being because THEY have different views/ideas of achieving results. Not only that put it seems that THEY only want to use UOC to reform CCW laws.Sons of Liberty wrote:I honestly do not know where these guys are coming from?!
They've financially and legallybacked several UOCers which resulted in NO charges being filed in those cases.
Not all of us OC to try to get Shall issue CCW. Even if this state becomes Shall issue I will not get a CCW. Why should I have to ask for permission, and be given a permit to exercise a right??Sons of Liberty wrote:Put yourself in Gene's shoes. You're the head of the main group fighting for gun rights in California. Your goal is to free California citizens from the all restrictions placed on gun owners. Right now you've suffered a temporary setback which means your attack must be delayed for six months. What do you advise people to do?I just read the opening of a thread started by Gene last week. Now he is advising not to UOC until June of 2010, maybe??!! :banghead:
First it was, wait until the CA legislature gets out of session and now its wait until June 2010, maybe? I think that is pretty unreasonable!!!!
I think it's pretty fair to say that Gene is doing a great job trying to accomplish goals that we can all get behind. He could tell people to go out an open carry and if we somehow fail to get shall issue ccw, then no big deal. Except he's trying to win it ALL. Getting everything but shall issue ccw isn't winning to him. That's failing for all Californians. He's just trying to take his time and do everything the right way, in order to maximize our percentages and get all of our rights back.
Naturally nobody has to listen to Gene, and he knows that. He cannot order anybody to not open carry, but he knows he can't influence those who won't listen to him anyway. He's only trying to influence the ones who will listen to him. So do whatever you'd like to.
You hit the nail squarely on the head there.it seems that THEY only want to use UOC to reform CCW laws.