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Examiner.com: Gun rights are for immigrants too

Mike

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http://www.examiner.com/x-2782-DC-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m8d9-Gun-rights-are-for-immigrants-too

PLEASE DIGG & REDDIT!

SNIP

Some gun rights advocates worry that immigrants from other cultures will dilute support for gun rights in America. But I'm not so sure that's true, especially since immigrants come to America for freedom and opportunity not found in their home country. And the fact that two out of two random CHP applicants in Virginia are immigrants just goes to show you that it appears that gun rights are for immigrants too.
 

R a Z o R

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Self defense is a human right .

Immigrants have a right to be armed everywhere in this world .

Give health benifits to the elderly also .

Stand up for our human rights . . . all of them .
 

JoeSparky

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R a Z o R wrote:


Self defense is a human right .

Immigrants have a right to be armed everywhere in this world .

Give health benifits to the elderly also .

Stand up for our human rights . . . all of them .
Sure looks to me that the old woman is about to exercise her right of SELF DEFENSE!!!
 

SouthernBoy

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Mike wrote:
http://www.examiner.com/x-2782-DC-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m8d9-Gun-rights-are-for-immigrants-too

PLEASE DIGG & REDDIT!

SNIP

Some gun rights advocates worry that immigrants from other cultures will dilute support for gun rights in America. But I'm not so sure that's true, especially since immigrants come to America for freedom and opportunity not found in their home country. And the fact that two out of two random CHP applicants in Virginia are immigrants just goes to show you that it appears that gun rights are for immigrants too.
Well of course, that can't be true. My lineage goes back quite a ways so that kills their report.
 

JoeSparky

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SouthernBoy wrote:
Mike wrote:
http://www.examiner.com/x-2782-DC-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m8d9-Gun-rights-are-for-immigrants-too

PLEASE DIGG & REDDIT!

SNIP

Some gun rights advocates worry that immigrants from other cultures will dilute support for gun rights in America. But I'm not so sure that's true, especially since immigrants come to America for freedom and opportunity not found in their home country. And the fact that two out of two random CHP applicants in Virginia are immigrants just goes to show you that it appears that gun rights are for immigrants too.
Well of course, that can't be true. My lineage goes back quite a ways so that kills their report.
And we have ANOTHER example of facts getting in the way of Statitics.... LOL
 

ixtow

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JoeSparky wrote:
SouthernBoy wrote:
Mike wrote:
http://www.examiner.com/x-2782-DC-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m8d9-Gun-rights-are-for-immigrants-too

PLEASE DIGG & REDDIT!

SNIP

Some gun rights advocates worry that immigrants from other cultures will dilute support for gun rights in America. But I'm not so sure that's true, especially since immigrants come to America for freedom and opportunity not found in their home country. And the fact that two out of two random CHP applicants in Virginia are immigrants just goes to show you that it appears that gun rights are for immigrants too.
Well of course, that can't be true. My lineage goes back quite a ways so that kills their report.
And we have ANOTHER example of facts getting in the way of Statitics.... LOL
'Go back' far enough, and we're all immigrants...
 

ixtow

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Mike, while we may have strong differences, I usually find your articles enlightening and well-thought. But this one seems a bit rushed and self-insisting...

So, of 2 (not exactly a wide demographic cross-section) random pulls, 2 were immigrants.

Even to cite a qualifier, such a narrow (TWO!!!) sampling is something that should not even be published. It is a curious discovery, I'll give you that. But to use it as the basis for an entire article, that just isn't quantifiable.

I realize you have many balls in the air, but the only way this could serve the headline, is if you were to sample, say, 10,000 or more.

The right to be armed, to be a tool using human, is a right all people have. Period. But these 2 whole applications, as a point to support the position.... That just puts egg on all of our faces.
 

old dog

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Not bad enough for you, huh? Now you want the Latino drug gangs legally armed?

Get real. We are fighting for our lives and it's no time for abstract philosophizing.

If these immigrants are so wonderful and deserving let them stay home and clean up their own countries.
 

ixtow

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old dog wrote:
Not bad enough for you, huh? Now you want the Latino drug gangs legally armed?

Get real. We are fighting for our lives and it's no time for abstract philosophizing.

If these immigrants are so wonderful and deserving let the stay home and clean up their own countries.
He isn't talking about Illegal Immigrants, Gangs, Dealers, etc. A Criminal is a Criminal.

Don't drink the Kool Aid.... The only non-immigrants on this continent are living on reservations........... They failed to control their own illegal immigrant problem.

I see no reason why any legitimate American Citizen, or even people just visiting, should be deprived the Basic Human Right to be a tool using human.
 

old dog

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I feel humbled in the midst of such moral purity, but perhaps you haven't noticed that our beloved leaders are pushing hard every day to extend rights and courtesies to illegals. Do you really suppose politicians would be allowed to curb rights even if they wanted to? I repeat -- GET REAL!!!!
 

ixtow

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old dog wrote:
I feel humbled in the midst of such moral purity, but perhaps you haven't noticed that our beloved leaders are pushing hard every day to extend rights and courtesies to illegals. Do you really suppose politicians would be allowed to curb rights even if they wanted to? I repeat -- GET REAL!!!!
Yes, agreed.

But that hasn't got anything to do with what the article was about, or any reason to not like the article.

It has nothing to do with illegal immigrants.

strawman.jpg


Or do you prefer this one:

strawman.jpg


Or this one:

418-strawman.jpg
 

old dog

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Strawman indeed! Is it your position then that legal immigrants are always saints and scholars who would never abuse our hospitality?

I believe wholeheartedly in firearms rights -- FOR AMERICANS WHO HAVE SHOWN THEMSELVES WORTHY. Our gun rights are a precious blessing and must not be threatened and diluted by starry-eyed people still mired in infantile Sunday school pieties.
 

ixtow

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old dog wrote:
Strawman indeed! Is it your position then that legal immigrants are always saints and scholars who would never abuse our hospitality?
No, that is not my position, or anyone else's here that I have seen thus far.

1) my position has absolutely nothing to do with illegal aliens, or criminals
2) neither does the article
3) neither addresses illegal aliens or criminals at all, much less their demeanor as a stereotype

Confirmed; Straw Man.

This article and discussion are related to 2 legitimate immigrants who, as a slim and useless cross-section, were both CCW permit holders. And holding the CCW also negates any possibility of discussion on illegal aliens, as only citizens (to my understanding) can get a CCW in the state in question.

To argue the unrelated point that you have diverged upon; no. A Naturalized Citizen, or a Native Born Citizen cannot be predicted, by that material alone, to be a good or bad citizen. To debate the matter is futile, as the type of citizen has no bearing on character or civility. Being born in another country does not pre-dispose a person to any behavior that being born here would or would not.

So, I have confounded both your Straw Man, and your own position.

Care to address mine yet? Or is ranting pointlessly about something you hate, and putting someone else's name to it, going to suffice for you?

In case you didn't notice, my position is:

Citing two random document pulls does not constitute a broad enough sample to draw the headline's suggestion. In fact, it is so narrow, that it could be considered nothing more than a reason to do more research to either confirm or deny the curiosity, and made an unsound basis for an article.
 

old dog

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You seem bent on not following my thought so I'll type slowly.

I suppose we have no choice but to accept some refugees, but under no circumstances would I give them firearms or voting rights. Such precious gifts should be limited to the native-born.

Go to any Walmart on Saturday. Would you really have these people legally armed? Of all people, a Floridian should understand.

Now I hope you got it this time because I'm bored with you and I'm unwatching.
 

Interceptor_Knight

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old dog wrote:
I suppose we have no choice but to accept some refugees, but under no circumstances would I give them firearms or voting rights. Such precious gifts should be limited to the native-born.


What part of inalienable do you not understand? EVERYONE has the basic human right toself defense.

The white "Americans" of European descent living in the dense urban areas have been bankrolling the gangs by purchasing and using the drugs they sell for decades. Gangs are not an immigration problem. Crime is not an immigration problem. Much of our crime problem is the result of poor legislative and governing choices based on racism. You can not legislate away crime.


old dog wrote:
Go to any Walmart on Saturday. Would you really have these people legally armed?
Yes........ I would....:cool:
 

Mike

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old dog wrote:
I believe wholeheartedly in firearms rights -- FOR AMERICANS WHO HAVE SHOWN THEMSELVES WORTHY. Our gun rights are a precious blessing and must not be threatened and diluted by starry-eyed people still mired in infantile Sunday school pieties.
Fortunately the equal protection clause guarantees resident aliens the same gun rights as US citizens - there have been recent cases in Washinton and Tennessee affirming this principle discussed on this board over the last couple of years.
 

Mike

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Pointman wrote:
What Mike discovered is Virginia is granting permits to foreign citizens. (I don't know if the two people are actually immigrating to the U.S. or if they're here for other reasons.)
The 2 immigrants may still be citizens of their country of birth, but they claimed to now be US citizens on their applications. Virginia requires that CHP applicants either be US Citizens or permanent resident aliens.

I probably should do a larger sample, but 2/2 being immigrants really floored me - the Aelxandria one I chose myself, just clicked on the most recently approved application on the computer screen. the Arlington one was handed to me - I think the lady just looked thru the recent approved stack and pulled one where the applicant chose not to disclose their SSN so she would not have to redact it.
 
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