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Thread: Famous Ex Detroit Cop/ Stopping Power Author Evan Marshall on Open Carry

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    http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/t...TOPIC_ID=17364


    Posted - July 12 2009 : 4:32:32 PM
    "stupid-if I was a uniform copper and came upon a guy carrying open-he'd be face down in the dirt with my size 12 combat boot on the back on his neck AND I'm sure we could find an approriate charge that I would be extremely comfortable using.

    additionally, people who've never been involved in a deadly force encounter could make a foolish move that could be easily misinterpreted and result in their death."

    Anyone care to comment??

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    Toledo Kid wrote:
    http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/t...TOPIC_ID=17364


    Posted - July 12 2009 : 4:32:32 PM
    "stupid-if I was a uniform copper and came upon a guy carrying open-he'd be face down in the dirt with my size 12 combat boot on the back on his neck AND I'm sure we could find an approriate charge that I would be extremely comfortable using.

    additionally, people who've never been involved in a deadly force encounter could make a foolish move that could be easily misinterpreted and result in their death."

    Anyone care to comment??

    Typical police officer who wouldn't want the average citizen to have equal rights with the clearly superior police.

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    I'm about 90% positive this is the same guy that tought my NRA Pistol Self Defense class. :shock:

    If having an OC pistol in a holster is not a crime, and not reason for RS, then how can he assult someone?

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    ethernetweb wrote:
    If having an OC pistol in a holster is not a crime, and not reason for RS, then how can he assult someone?
    Because this:

    I'm sure we could find an approriate charge that I would be extremely comfortable using.
    tells us that he'd just make something up and that his dept. and PA would, probably, have backed him up on it.

    Listen the audio from TVance's encounter. They were working very hard trying to figure out some charge they could hit him with.

    There is alsothe story that was on the news recently about the woman who was cited for drunk driving but only after the officer hit her car from behind. The audio/video shows them discussing how they are going to doctor the report to make it look like it was her fault.

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Thomas Paine

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    Just went and read the linked thread. Wow, there are some ignorant, frightened people over there.

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Thomas Paine

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    Regular Member Jblack44's Avatar
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    Yep...No love for open carry over there. It's too bad that they all cling to the same (non validated) beliefs of what "could" happen.

    Once again though the few LEO that really oppose it sure do expose themselves as being superior to regular citizens and tere god given rights
    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous. If you have a gun, what in the hell do you have to be paranoid for." Clint Smith, Director of Thunder Ranch

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    I believe this guy is either a liar, or a truly rare kind of psychopath, because if he would openly admit to attempting to assault and falsely prosecute people, it's hard to believe he was ever a cop for any length of time.

    We've seen felony stops, we've seen false arrests, we've seen wrongful prosecutions, we've even seen some moron cops draw down on a few people, but no one has ever been beat up by the police for open carrying that I am aware of.

    In almost any circumstance, resisting unlawful arrest as an open carrier would be the last thing anyone would want because of the possible political repercussions. We could see media outrage, and open carry banned by popular demand. But stomping on someones neck, in my opinion, could easily break it and paralyze or kill that person, and it would be an excellent reason to use force to stop that person.

    I believe the reason we haven't seen this sort of thing is that the police are well aware that they could easily go to prison or be shot for doing that sort of thing. That is why I believe this guy is merely a liar who is trying to piss people off.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    wow, all I can say
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    Are you sure that that person is truely who he says he is? Not saying it may not be, just throwing it out there because of these words "stupid-if I was a uniform copper and came upon a guy carrying open-he'd be face down in the dirt with my size 12 combat boot on the back on his neck".

    Regardless, some of the talk on the other forum is reckless. Thiscomment stood out to me "I have talked to several guys that open carry and asked why? Mostly these where very young guys about 21 or so. They all said "because I can" or "it's cool".


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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Michigander wrote:
    I believe this guy is either a liar, or a truly rare kind of psychopath, because if he would openly admit to attempting to assault and falsely prosecute people, it's hard to believe he was ever a cop for any length of time.

    +1
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

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    T Vance wrote:
    Are you sure that that person is truely who he says he is? Not saying it may not be, just throwing it out there because of these words...
    T Vance....

    Two things here.

    (One) you need to brush up and run a Google on Evan Marshall.

    See what comes up....

    (Two) Join his site and ask him!!!

    Get on there and rub his nose about "Open Carry".



    Then come back and tell me if he is "Whom" he is...





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    Doesn't really matter the owner closed the topic. They are just spouting off myths anyway.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    I signed up, but the topic was locked? I don't know why. I sent an email to Evan but I dont think it will help.

    People who are so closed minded to open carry as just as bad as the anti carry people.

    ZOMG CC is the best!!! No other way can be justified in any way what so ever!! You will be shot first in a robber! You just look like a thug! You are out to cause trouble!
    Freedom isn't free, but this is America! We will find a way to outsource it and save some money - Jeremy

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    I not going to join a forum that is only going to see it one way, and they don't have statistics to back up some of the claims some of them are making. I'm sure it would be like trying to talk to a brick wall.

    I don't know about others, but myself and many of the others I have met a the few picnics I've been to don't seem to be OCing to stroke their own ego. Personally I do OC "because I can". I also drive a car, eat what foods I want to, and say what I want "because I can". I also do it to get other people comfortable with seeing guns out in public places, and to educate people, though no strangers have approached me to ask about my gun.

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    Thats why you dont TALK to them. Just listen and ask questions. Most people will eventually see both sides. Ask "why" and "where did you get that information"
    That should cover 90% of the entire conversation!
    Freedom isn't free, but this is America! We will find a way to outsource it and save some money - Jeremy

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    Toledo Kid wrote:

    Posted - July 12 2009 : 4:32:32 PM
    "... AND I'm sure we could find an approriate charge that I would be extremely comfortable using.
    TheSzerdi case anyone?
    All opinions posted on opencarry.org are my own, and do not necessarily reflect the views of opencarry.org or Michigan Open Carry Inc.

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    That is scary stuff, a former LEO advocating this type of harassment of law abiding citizens just because HE doesn't like it.

    I noticed after this goofs post people were saying that they took offense to the notion that an LEO would try and trump up a case against the person OCing when in the first post by that Evan person he said he would have the guy "face down in the dirt with my size 12 combat boot on the back on his neck AND I'm sure we could find an approriate charge that I would be extremely comfortable using."

    And this even more disturbing comment from this former LEO.

    "additionally, people who've never been involved in a deadly force encounter could make a foolish move that could be easily misinterpreted and result in their death."

    This final post on that thread from the blowhard, he is trying to backpedal from what he said in his first post after some readers realized that what he said is was exactly what he meant. He knows what he meant and so do we.

    "people who think I or any other copper would trump up charges needs to think about relocating their thoughts to ego. com"

    I had never been to that site before but that guy sounds like a self important blowhard to me.

    I liked this post from someone on that thread.

    "Some of you rationalize it to be machismo because that's why you would do it."

    When I start to OC it certainly will not be machismo since I am a woman.



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    I used to be a big fan of his! Have his book and thought it was ok.However I now know that he is just a product of the Detroit Police system. They have their own academy and train most of their own officers, and the system is POLITICAL. You only have to lok at who's run the city to know what the policing is going to be like. Detroit is so third world that the FBI currently monitors the police Dept. here constantly for violations. I guess you can't catch 'em all.

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    xraygil1 wrote:
    I used to be a big fan of his! Have his book and thought it was ok.However I now know that he is just a product of the Detroit Police system. They have their own academy and train most of their own officers, and the system is POLITICAL. You only have to lok at who's run the city to know what the policing is going to be like. Detroit is so third world that the FBI currently monitors the police Dept. here constantly for violations. I guess you can't catch 'em all.
    Let's hope the next one to monitor the police will actually be doing their job instead of the former mayor.
    http://www.boston.com/news/nation/ar...patrick_quits/

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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    I think his thoughts on open-carry are perhaps as valuable as his supposed "data" that he passes off as the "science" of stopping power. I know some have seen the issues with his data as minor, I think that one could argue that the types of data errors shown in his seminal work were indicative of his desire to expound his personal beliefs.

    His methodology in regards to "stopping power" falls short in regards to commonly accepted notions of rigorousness and his conclusions regarding OC are worse; he develops what-if "thought experiment" scenarios as evidence of the foolishness of OC. Then, to convince us that he thinks that by writing a book or being a LEO he is better than those who share opposing vews, he vows to use brute force to get his point across... what a loser.

    Once again... the common refrain: I'm a gun owner (cop, lawyer, politician, researcher, doctor, etc) and OC is a poor choice (illegal, not wise, "disturbing the Peace, Brandishing, etc). Until such time as people actually ask these pundits to support their conclusions with some semblance of real data, they will continue to spout the "I'm not a doctor, but I play one on TV" line. At least Marcus Welby, MD (Robert Young) didn't threaten to assault people who chose a different pain reliever. I'm surprised that people even listen to this type of egotistical banter anymore.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

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    Well it looks to me like a...done deal.springerdave.

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    springerdave wrote:
    Well it looks to me like a...done deal.springerdave.
    It is on MGO....
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

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    ()That's what this is for.springerdave.


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    Regular Member wewd's Avatar
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    Unfortunately far too many people like this guy end up becoming cops. The idea of being able to go anywhere armed and be essentially above the law is just too appealing for them. They are simply psychopaths/sociopaths. Just like a disproportionate number of pedophiles are found in certain vocations where they would have easy access to children and an automatic level of trust from the public because of their station.

    There are more than a few bad apples and it has spoiled the entire bushel, and nobody seems to give a damn about doing something about it. Most likely because those same types of people are the ones in charge.
    Do you want to enjoy liberty in your lifetime?

    Consider moving to New Hampshire as part of the Free State Project.

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    Regular Member dukenukum's Avatar
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    More interweb chest thumping sounds like some other gun forums I know of.

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