Madison Open Carry Arrest. Paging Travis Yates

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J.Gleason wrote:

GlocksRfun wrote:

Anyone have an address for the court house?  Is there a school anywhere around it?

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Google Earth...Google Earth

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Memory hog, crash prone!

LOL

Google Maps as a stable substitute?

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Travis, email the NRA! They may do it for free. No joke, many people bash the NRA but I do believe they could really help you out on this one.



Ben

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How possible is it going to be to get some people to walk around Armed on 9-9-09 in the morning? I'm not familiar with the layout of the place. Is there a sidewalk that isn't gov. property around close to the entrence of the court house?I supposeif what you were doing is supposedly disorderly conduct, protesting with signs while armed is DC for sure.....

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GlocksRfun wrote:

How possible is it going to be to get some people to walk around Armed on 9-9-09 in the morning? I'm not familiar with the layout of the place. Is there a sidewalk that isn't gov. property around close to the entrence of the court house?I supposeif what you were doing is supposedly disorderly conduct, protesting with signs while armed is DC for sure.....

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What would prohibit being armed on a sidewalk? Doesn't matter who owns it. You can't enter the building itself while armed, but that's it.

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Yeah I'm with shotgun on this one, what is government property? I never heard of such a thing... lol I think you mean public property. Why would anyone with a gun have to stay off of public property? I'm pretty sure the pre-emption makes it so we can carry on any public property besides what is designated under state statutes. i.e inside Gov buildings, state parks.



Ben

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As I said before,
What needs to happen is for hundreds (thousands would be better)of us to converge on Madison, all OCing. At that point we should all call the cops on each other and swamp them with calls. No one should assemble but we should all wear the same clothing so we look alike and walk the streets around the capital.

If the effort isn't organized it will never work.

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J.Gleason wrote:

GlocksRfun wrote:

Anyone have an address for the court house? Is there a school anywhere around it?

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Google Earth...Google Earth

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Yes, Grasshopper. Your Google-Fu must be practiced or you shall never master it.

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J.Gleason wrote:

As I said before,
What needs to happen is for hundreds (thousands would be better)of us to converge on Madison, all OCing. At that point we should all call the cops on each other and swamp them with calls. No one should assemble but we should all wear the same clothing so we look alike and walk the streets around the capital.

If the effort isn't organized it will never work.

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I cannot agree with that tactic, there is enough criminal activity happening in Madison wherejamming up dispatchmay actually prevent someone in need from getting police aide in a timely manner.

Madison is ripe for something to happen with a large O-C showing, they brought this on themselves. I do not feel we should justsit back and watch where it goes. I think the earlier we can converge on that cesspool the better. We would get the message across that we do not condone the police departments behavior and as a class of people wewill not tolerate it.

With the deceased plan for a combined OCDO & 2A sisters event to meet in Madison , there was talk of needing some permits. Why the heck would we need permits to meet as a tour group just wandering around to see our epicenter of our state government. Does Madison require any group consisting of 3 or more people permits to wander around and see the area? I didn't think so!

I think any significant showing of people O-C'ing would be newsworthy without being classified as an organized protest that requires these alleged permit's. Is there any reason we cannot all meet up on State St.? All wearing OCDO T-shirts would be a plus IMO.

I have this coming weekend available, and I might even be able to do it before the week ends too. Anyone else??

Travis, do you have a back-up pistol? Do you think they would be stupid enough to arrest you twice? I bet that city attorney is sweating bullets right now with this case. This cannot go well for him or the police department in any way whatsoever.

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Nutczak wrote:

J.Gleason wrote:

As I said before,
What needs to happen is for hundreds (thousands would be better)of us to converge on Madison, all OCing. At that point we should all call the cops on each other and swamp them with calls. No one should assemble but we should all wear the same clothing so we look alike and walk the streets around the capital.

If the effort isn't organized it will never work.

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I cannot agree with that tactic, there is enough criminal activity happening in Madison wherejamming up dispatchmay actually prevent someone in need from getting police aide in a timely manner.

Yeah that criminal activity is being conducted by Police Officers unlawfully arresting law abiding citizens.

Madison is ripe for something to happen with a large O-C showing, they brought this on themselves. I do not feel we should justsit back and watch where it goes. I think the earlier we can converge on that cesspool the better. We would get the message across that we do not condone the police departments behavior and as a class of people wewill not tolerate it.

With the deceased plan for a combined OCDO & 2A sisters event to meet in Madison , there was talk of needing some permits. Why the heck would we need permits to meet as a tour group just wandering around to see our epicenter of our state government. Does Madison require any group consisting of 3 or more people permits to wander around and see the area? I didn't think so!

I think any significant showing of people O-C'ing would be newsworthy without being classified as an organized protest that requires these alleged permit's. Is there any reason we cannot all meet up on State St.? All wearing OCDO T-shirts would be a plus IMO.

And they will arrest you for not having a permit to assemble. I know, I know, it is your right to peacefully assemble. But they will arrest you for not having a permit.

That is why I suggested the idea above. You have to fight fire with fire sometimes. Even if we don't all call the cops, one call will have them looking at how many people?

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WI_Patriot wrote:

Hey, it's me, Travis. I talked to a couple lawyers. So far the cheapest guy will litigate it for $3500. I don't have that kind of money. I don't know if I can request money for a defense fund. I can ask the lawyer about it. If I can accept donations, I would appreciate help.

It looks like most of the facts are already known. Looks like a simple, clear case to me. I wasn't taken to jail. It was a municipal violation.

Is there a planned march, picnic, open carry event planned? I can't advocate anything.

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You got great air time on WIBA. Try calling Vicki, and tell her you legal needs, I bet she could help out. I bet she puts you on the air.

http://www.wiba.com/cc-common/podcast/single_podcast.html?podcast=upfront.xml

I can't wait to hear how your Civil case gets going for you. You should win.

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I pledge some small money for the appeal, but only if it goes directly to the appellant or the escrow account of his attorney of public record.

I made a similar pledge in Brad Krause's case and was unable to fulfill it for the condition of no third party involvement.

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I don't think another victory in muni court does anything for anyone.

As I see it, Travis has his gun (correct?) So he doesn't need to worry about getting that back and he's not without protection.

I'll support legal fees, but I don't do it at the muni court level. (of course I will still support him and home fora victory) but I too DON'T think wasting money on an attorney at the muni court level is a good idea.

Of course I am not a lawyer, BUT if you as a lawyer OF COURSE they are going to say YOU NEED A LAWYER.

I gave Brad Krause $500 for his legal defense, I'll give Travis $500 IF this goes to appeal. (I don't believe it will) If Brad's case had gone to appeal, we'd have a precedent setting case to prevent THIS from happening.

A muni case, no legal precedent.

just my 02

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I agree. For the appeal only and no third party.

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hugh jarmis wrote:

I don't think another victory in muni court does anything for anyone.

As I see it, Travis has his gun (correct?) So he doesn't need to worry about getting that back and he's not without protection.

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Litigating this in the criminal system is like swimming upstream - the government controls the lititgation. Travis should first getlegal representation and get these charges dismissed or prevail.

Then he can explore the option of filing a civil suit for damages; given the public policy of the Madison police to detain every gun owner they encounter, and the fact that this incident is post-AG opinion, this may be easier than the ongoing case filed already in Wisconsin, see http://www.examiner.com/x-2782-DC-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m4d14-Breaking-News-Federal-civil-rights-lawsuit-filed-against-West-Milwaukee.

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Well I agree that the civil case offers the opportunity to set a precedent that departments will listen to without the risk of criminal charges hanging over your head.

I'll be honest, when I gave the money to Brad Krause it was immediately after his last hearing where he was found not guilty and I was under the impression he was going to file a civil suit and he never did (or hasn't yet) That was the whole reason I gave him the money.

I guess now I'm just kinda sitting here wondering if we throw money at someone elses defense, are they gonna follow through and file a f'ing civil case to provide a return on everyone's investment or not?????

Sitting here shoveling off money for everyones legal defense but not gaining ANYTHING actionable or precedent setting is frustrating.

If all we ever do is spend money to defend muni cases we'll never make any real progress but blow tens of thousands in the process.

I felt jilted by Brad Krausedoing nothing. I guess the bad taste is still in my mouth.

I mean he had by allaccounts a great attorney.If the case is over and there has been no civil suit, I presume his legal counsel advised him there wasn't anything to be gained. I recall some of Brads de-facto "spokepersons" on the board asking what he would sue for. And with the rumors of what he spent on his legal defense, along withhis statements that it ruined his business, along with the deprivation of his property for so long... It seems to me there was PLENTY to sue for. But I'm not a lawyer, and Brad did have a lawyer... And nothing was filed...

I mean if Brad's attorney didn't think a civil case was a good idea...well... now I'm suppose to think its the answer?

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BJA wrote:

Travis, email the NRA! They may do it for free. No joke, many people bash the NRA but I do believe they could really help you out on this one.



Ben

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also try Gun Owners of America http://www.gunowners.org - they are doing the Olofson case and may help. Being that it is just municiple code (DC) you are being charged with, probably wont get anyone to do it for free until it goes to a higher court for suit against the city and arresting officer for 2A violation.

I wish I had known Travis was going to do this, I would have joined him.

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IcrewUH60 wrote:

also try Gun Owners of America http://www.gunowners.org - they are doing the Olofson case and may help. Being that it is just municiple code (DC) you are being charged with, probably wont get anyone to do it for free until it goes to a higher court for suit against the city and arresting officer for 2A violation.

I wish I had known Travis was going to do this, I would have joined him.

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No, it will be a 4A suit for illegal search and seizure, and unlawful arrest.

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i stand corrected . Yes, 4A.

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First, he isn't facing CRIMINAL CHARGES as I understand it. This is MUNICIPAL COURT just like Krause. He should be able to go in there, armed with the Krause argument and decision, the oral arguments from Kassel where he answers YES to walking on state street armed, and then the AG's memo were mere open carry in NOT DC.

Now if he is dismissed, this still does not have "force of law" because it is municipal, he just doesn't have to pay the fine. If dismissed, then Yates needs to get Jesus' attorney to file against the officer(s) and the city of Madison. It will be all civil.

Now if he looses, and it is NOT dismissed goes to municipal trial, and looses, then he should appeal to the Circuit Court. This is were an attorney will be required, and a ruling here (Circuit Court) would have "force of law." We know this will NEVER get to the Supreme Court while Van Hollen is AG, because his office would be required to defend the city, and his advisory memo basically said he wouldn't.

Travis should file an immediate complaint with the AG's office, accusing the officer of misconduct in office based on the AG's memo. He should also file a complaint against the police department with whatever governing body (police/fire commission) oversees the department.

Keep in mind, I am not an attorney either, and this isn't legal advise.