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Thread: CCW Permit Non-Res Q

  1. #1
    Regular Member vermonter's Avatar
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    I know this is OC forum, but many of you also have a CCW and may know the answer to this. my friend is moving to NC from Vermont. She has a PA non-res CCW that is accepted by NC. Once she becomes a res of NC does she have to get an NC permit, or can she inform PA of her new residency and continue to carry on that until she has the $$ to get NC.

    No opinions please, reply if you know the law on this, or lack of statute prohibiting non-res ccw by a NC res.

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    according to usacarry.com, the PA non-resident permit is valid in NC

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    I found this on google

    Note that Pennsylvania state law regarding firearms requires that a permit be denied to an applicant who lacks a CCW permit from his or her home state unless the applicant's home state doesn't have a CCW permit system. For example, a resident of Illinois could get a Pennsylvania CCW permit since Illinois doesn't have a CCW permit system, but a resident of New Jersey is out-of-luck since New Jersey does have a CCW permit system (as a rule, New Jersey only issues CCW permits to the well-connected). Some Sheriffs, however, still require home-state permits, period.

    As I understand Vermont has no permit. And once she became a resident of NC, her permit would no longer be valid. And yes this is an opinion, other then that I’d ask a lawyer versed in gun laws.



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    Good point on the PA permit... Assuming that info is correct (I know nothing about PA permit laws), the person in question could either get an NC permit, or simply get someone else's non-res permit (i.e. Virginia or Florida)

    A resident of NC can carry in NC on a non-resident permit from a state (assuming they offer a non-res) on the following list: NC AG website as of 8/19/09:

    Alabama

    Alaska

    Arizona

    Arkansas

    Colorado

    Delaware

    Florida

    Georgia

    Idaho

    Indiana

    Kansas

    Kentucky

    Louisiana

    Michigan

    Mississippi

    Missouri

    Montana

    New Hampshire

    North Dakota

    Ohio

    Oklahoma

    Pennsylvania

    South Carolina

    South Dakota

    Tennessee

    Texas

    Utah

    Virginia

    Washington

    West Virginia



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    Yea but theres a lot of benefits to going ahead and getting a NC permit, ie waving of NICS checks and carrying in over 30 states.

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    OK, I hate to be a nitpicker here, but in NC, it's not's a "CCW". In this state it is a "CHP"--Concealed Handgun Permit". This is not just word-play and semantics. The permit issued in NC is ONLY applicable to firearms, specifically Handguns. IT does not allow you to carry other concealed weapons,and the Statue specifically states this...

    If your friend in a VT resident, but is changing her residency to NC, she needs to get a NC CHP to CC in this state, no matter what other permits she has from any other state.

    The bad news is the minute she officially becomes a NC resident (when she is issued her NC drivers license) any permit she was issued as a resident of another state becomes invalid for her to CC in NC.

    The good news is, as a NC resident, when she DOES get her NC CHP, it is recognized by 30 other states (according to the NC AG website):

    http://www.ncrpa.org/ccwfaq.htm

    Just remember, CC is a little odd here in the Tarheel state. We still have a "restaurant ban" applied to any establishment that serves alcohol for consumption on premise, and you can't carry anywhere that charges admission (movie theaters, concerts, amusement parks, etc). And although cities can't ban CC or OC outright (with the exception of Cary, and the weird "gun size" restruction in Durham), they CAN enact statutes prohibiting carry on city property (like city parks and municipal centers), and ARE NOT required by state law to post such restrictions.

    Here is what she needs to do, in order:

    1) establish NC residency (get a NC drivers license)
    2) take her CC certification class
    3) get her NC CHP, and ask a LOT of questions during the class
    4) contact her local City Manager or their offical "legal dept" and ask them
    about local restrictions on OC/CC.
    5) start carrying!

    If your friend lives in Eastern NC (Greenville/Washington/Jacksonville) I know several VERY good instructors, and one in particular who is VERY successful in working with women. In the more "rural" areas, the local police and Sheriffs seem to be a LOT more open-minded about CC and OC. If she lives in one of the more "urban" parts of the state (the RTP area, or Charlotte, or gods forbid, the hippy enclave of Asheville!) the local "boys in blue" are not quite as amiable to CC/OC, and probably are also going to be more likely to run her an attitude just because she's a woman...

    I don't MEAN nothin' by that. I'm just sayin'...

    Good luck!
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

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    Dreamer wrote:
    If your friend in a VT resident, but is changing her residency to NC, she needs to get a NC CHP to CC in this state, no matter what other permits she has from any other state.

    The bad news is the minute she officially becomes a NC resident (when she is issued her NC drivers license) any permit she was issued as a resident of another state becomes invalid for her to CC in NC.

    I have learned, according to the NC Dept. of Justice, a VA non-resident permit held by a North Carolina resident is valid. I would assume that the other states' non-resident permits would also follow this protocol. It's very very difficult to get a reply from them regarding the law. Normally you get a reply letter that "the NC AG office is not permitted by law to give legal advice." crap.



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    Good site for reference. http://www.handgunlaw.us/

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    NCjones wrote:
    I have learned, according to the NC Dept. of Justice, a VA non-resident permit held by a North Carolina resident is valid. I would assume that the other states' non-resident permits would also follow this protocol. It's very very difficult to get a reply from them regarding the law. Normally you get a reply letter that "the NC AG office is not permitted by law to give legal advice." crap.
    I've never had any difficulty getting answers form the NC AG office. Every time I've called, I get a pretty quick reply. Sometimes they have to call me back, but it has never taken them more than 24 hours to get back to me on my queries...

    I think it's all dependen on how you ask the question. If you ask "Can I do X or Y", then that involves "interpretation" on their part and is not something they will do.

    However, if you ask them "is there a statute regulating X", or "What is the statute regarding Y", they will usually give you a pretty quick answer.

    Of course, I've always gotten these answers on the phone. I imagine getting them in writing might be an entirely different matter though, which is why you haven't had much luck writing letters for answers. Lawyers--even ones that are paid our tax-payers money--are usually loathe to put things like that in writing, due to the weasely nature of their profession...

    But I usually record their anwers, and have several such audio files archived on my computer and on my phone, from the NC AG, and from several local LEA's, just in case I might need them.

    I keep ending these posts with "IANAL". I'm currently in graduate school pursuing an MFA, and I'mstarting to think I might have to do a "double degree" and go ahead and get my JD while I'm at it, just for good measure. Handing an LEO a card with "J.D." after the name can go a LONG way when you're being hassled over matters of the law...
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

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    Dreamer wrote:
    OK, I hate to be a nitpicker here, but in NC, it's not's a "CCW". In this state it is a "CHP"--Concealed Handgun Permit". This is not just word-play and semantics. The permit issued in NC is ONLY applicable to firearms, specifically Handguns. IT does not allow you to carry other concealed weapons,and the Statue specifically states this...
    We pick the same "nits" here in PA....we dont have permits we have License to Carry Firearms...or LTCF. Does not say anything about concealed...

    The bad news is the minute she officially becomes a NC resident (when she is issued her NC drivers license) any permit she was issued as a resident of another state becomes invalid for her to CC in NC.
    Is this a NC statute? A PA LTCF is good until it expires or is revoked. The OP moving would not automatically cause it to "expire"...
    States don’t have rights. People do.

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    mrjam2jab wrote:

    We pick the same "nits" here in PA....we dont have permits we have License to Carry Firearms...or LTCF. Does not say anything about concealed...
    Give that a moment to sink in.......

    What you are saying is that you have to be licensed to exercise a 2nd AmendmentRight. That is a BIG difference than having a permit to conceal a weapon. The Right to bear arms is not questioned or required to be licensed in NC.

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    American Patriot wrote:
    mrjam2jab wrote:

    We pick the same "nits" here in PA....we dont have permits we have License to Carry Firearms...or LTCF. Does not say anything about concealed...
    Give that a moment to sink in.......

    What you are saying is that you have to be licensed to exercise a 2nd AmendmentRight. That is a BIG difference than having a permit to conceal a weapon. The Right to bear arms is not questioned or required to be licensed in NC.
    The purpose of a PA LTCF issued under 6109 is to provide an exemption to the prohibition of carrying concealed on or abouts one's person, or in a vehicle, under 6106. It also allows you to carry any type of firearm(long guns and handguns) during a state of emergency. The license also provides for the privilege of carrying openly or concealed on the streets in a City of the First Class(Philly).

    Off-limits places in PA and what makes them off-limits:
    1. Court Facilities - PA Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 913
    2a.*Grounds and buildings of Elementary and Secondary schools(K-12 grades), whether the school is private or public. There is an affirmative defense for "other lawful purposes" however there is no case law determining on what that includes. To be safe, its wiser to assume it does not include our carrying "rights". - PA Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 912
    2b. Within 1000ft of a school unless you have a license/permit issued by the state in which the school is located - US Title 18, Part I, Chapter 44, Subsection 922(q)
    3. Casinos - by regulation Title 58, Part VII, Chapter 465, Subsection 465a.13
    4. Certain Department of State buildings - by regulation
    5. Places off-limits by Federal Law or regulation, IE: military installations(exceptions for hunting at some bases), Federal Government buildings, after the security check point in airports, federal parks and reserves,etc****.
    6. Any private property where a landowner, tenant or person so authorized to maintain property has asked you to leave because you are carrying, or where the property owner or tenant has placed signs or placards denoting that guns are forbidden - Title 18, Chapter 35, Subsection 3503
    7. **Detention facilities, correctional institutes, or mental hospitals - Title 18, Chapter 51, Subsection 5122 (READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania)


    Off-limits places apply just the same for open as they do concealed.

    State Parks require the carrier to conceal and to be licensed.

    No "permit" is required for purchase nor for open carry (with exception of Philly)

    How many restrictions are there in NC? :P

    States don’t have rights. People do.

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    mrjam2jab wrote:
    American Patriot wrote:
    mrjam2jab wrote:

    We pick the same "nits" here in PA....we dont have permits we have License to Carry Firearms...or LTCF. Does not say anything about concealed...
    Give that a moment to sink in.......

    What you are saying is that you have to be licensed to exercise a 2nd AmendmentRight. That is a BIG difference than having a permit to conceal a weapon. The Right to bear arms is not questioned or required to be licensed in NC.
    The purpose of a PA LTCF issued under 6109 is to provide an exemption to the prohibition of carrying concealed on or abouts one's person, or in a vehicle, under 6106. It also allows you to carry any type of firearm(long guns and handguns) during a state of emergency. The license also provides for the privilege of carrying openly or concealed on the streets in a City of the First Class(Philly).

    Off-limits places in PA and what makes them off-limits:
    1. Court Facilities - PA Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 913
    2a.*Grounds and buildings of Elementary and Secondary schools(K-12 grades), whether the school is private or public. There is an affirmative defense for "other lawful purposes" however there is no case law determining on what that includes. To be safe, its wiser to assume it does not include our carrying "rights". - PA Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 912
    2b. Within 1000ft of a school unless you have a license/permit issued by the state in which the school is located - US Title 18, Part I, Chapter 44, Subsection 922(q)
    3. Casinos - by regulation Title 58, Part VII, Chapter 465, Subsection 465a.13
    4. Certain Department of State buildings - by regulation
    5. Places off-limits by Federal Law or regulation, IE: military installations(exceptions for hunting at some bases), Federal Government buildings, after the security check point in airports, federal parks and reserves,etc****.
    6. Any private property where a landowner, tenant or person so authorized to maintain property has asked you to leave because you are carrying, or where the property owner or tenant has placed signs or placards denoting that guns are forbidden - Title 18, Chapter 35, Subsection 3503
    7. **Detention facilities, correctional institutes, or mental hospitals - Title 18, Chapter 51, Subsection 5122 (READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania)


    Off-limits places apply just the same for open as they do concealed.

    State Parks require the carrier to conceal and to be licensed.

    No "permit" is required for purchase nor for open carry (with exception of Philly)

    How many restrictions are there in NC? :P
    Perhaps taking a little more time to think about itwould be enlightening.

    "What you are saying is that you have to be licensed to exercise a 2nd AmendmentRight. That is a BIG difference than having a permit to conceal a weapon. The Right to bear arms is not questioned or required to be licensed in NC.

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