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Thread: Gun Buy Back Program

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    Let's help rid our streets of evil guns and institute a GUN BUY BACK program! We can setup a booth, pay cash or gift cards for guns. Then, we can recondition them, keep the ones we want, and sell the rest for profit. Contribute to a legal fund for when one of us gets arrested and we need to sue the police.

    Many gun buy back programs run by police departments destroy perfectly good weapons and also buy complete garbage. We don't need to do that. Ideas? Thoughts?

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    ive seen some of those gun buybacks on the TV! id be happy to give $50 for those guns. some of them were worth really big bucks. and to think theyre just gonna melt them down! historical rellics, machine guns, lotsa quallity firearms, and junk guns, like the ones ive got at home!
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    Tim,

    Do you have an FFL?

    Ken

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    No. But if we only buy from Nevada residents and conduct the transaction in the State of NV, we don't need an FFL, right?



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    I will look on the Attorney General's website for names like"federal gun buyback LLC" etc. Its genius Tim.

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    timf343 wrote:
    No. But if we only buy from Nevada residents and conduct the transaction in the State of NV, we don't need an FFL, right?

    I would review the definition of "dealer" in Federal Firearms laws. IANAL, but I am cautious.

    Ken

    P.S.; IMHO there is no problem with buying guns in the way you describe, but as soon as you offer them for sale ("and sell the rest for profit")it may be a problem. And, of course there is the issue of compliance with the Clark County registration law. etc.

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    I have to agree, this is genius. If the legalities of it can be worked out, it could start a nationwide trend. I can see the steam coming out of the ears of grabbers now!
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    Old thread. But i say the timing is perfect right now to do a buyback. Just read in the drudge report seattle had theirs and some people had a booth set up and were paying cash. Im talking $100 for pistols. $200 for rifles. Right in front of the police. They hated it. Then the police ran out of gift cards so everyone was going to the private citizens.

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    Re: Gun Buy Back Program

    Quote Originally Posted by VegasGlocKid View Post
    Old thread. But i say the timing is perfect right now to do a buyback. Just read in the drudge report seattle had theirs and some people had a booth set up and were paying cash. Im talking $100 for pistols. $200 for rifles. Right in front of the police. They hated it. Then the police ran out of gift cards so everyone was going to the private citizens.
    One guy had a booth setup. I was only paying $50 per rifle and picked up some beautiful ones including a 1903 Springfield...

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    Quote Originally Posted by CowboyKen View Post
    ...as soon as you offer them for sale ("and sell the rest for profit") it may be a problem...
    This actually is not illegal. It is quite common for collectors to buy several items, take their time (or not) determining which ones they wish to keep in the collection, and then sell the rest. And there is no limit on the profit one can make in this process. There is no hard line that determines what is "dealing in firearms" and they have a burden of proof to demonstrate that that is your intent.
    Last edited by MAC702; 01-29-2013 at 02:09 PM.
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    All it takes is the money.

    If a group of people got together and pooled their money, this could be very successful. All they would have to do would be have an FFL with them in states which limit civil rights.

    Can you imagine the screams of anguish if someone did that in Oakland?

    Or maybe not -- you might even get the police to endorse it, since you would be taking the guns off the streets of their town and taking them out of state.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DVC View Post
    All it takes is the money.

    If a group of people got together and pooled their money, this could be very successful. All they would have to do would be have an FFL with them in states which limit civil rights.

    Can you imagine the screams of anguish if someone did that in Oakland?

    Or maybe not -- you might even get the police to endorse it, since you would be taking the guns off the streets of their town and taking them out of state.
    No, I don't believe they would like this one little bit. If that happened they would not get to add a nice free piece to their collections.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VegasGlocKid View Post
    ....Im talking $100 for pistols. $200 for rifles. Right in front of the police. They hated it. Then the police ran out of gift cards so everyone was going to the private citizens.
    I was at the seattle gun show. I was purchasing weapons before the entered the "police line". I was paying US$50 for a good pistol (a colt police positive made in 1926 beauty) and US$100 for a good long gun (Win 1894 made in 1937, mint), but some were not as nice. I bought a pair of long guns for US$125 (K98 made in spandau in 1920 and an Arisaka type 38 made in tokyo).
    It was a lot of fun.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

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    Does anyone know if there is going to be a buyback program in vegas? I wouldnt mind showing up with a pocket full of cash and picking up some peices..

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    I've never heard of one here. I think they know better.
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    Quote Originally Posted by VegasGlocKid View Post
    Does anyone know if there is going to be a buyback program in vegas? I wouldnt mind showing up with a pocket full of cash and picking up some peices..

    In the gun buyback programs they give full amnesty. At least that is my understanding. If you buy a firearm and it turns out to be stolen, you get caught, you go to jail.

    TBG
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    Re: Gun Buy Back Program

    Quote Originally Posted by The Big Guy View Post
    In the gun buyback programs they give full amnesty. At least that is my understanding. If you buy a firearm and it turns out to be stolen, you get caught, you go to jail.

    TBG
    Forgive my delivery in regards to this question: if they granted amnesty then what would you go to jail for and how would you know whether it was stolen or not?

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    I think he was describing the DIFFERENCE between the "buy back" program and someone else buying what could be stolen property.

    Cops are in possession of more stolen property than anyone else.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Quote Originally Posted by DooFster View Post
    Forgive my delivery in regards to this question: if they granted amnesty then what would you go to jail for and how would you know whether it was stolen or not?

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    For being in possession of a stolen firearm.

    In the buyback program, you would have amnesty when selling the firearm to the cops only, not to private individuals. They won't ask where you got it, or who you are. If you buy one from one of the people coming to sell the firearm and for some reason you get into trouble, and they find you have a stolen firearm, you will have legal problems.

    I remember reading a ways back on one of these programs where there was an uptick in stolen firearms right before the buyback. Why not, you steal a gun and the cops pay you for it with no repercussions. And they say crime doesn't pay. Such a deal!

    TBG
    Last edited by The Big Guy; 01-30-2013 at 02:41 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big Guy View Post
    No, I don't believe they would like this one little bit. If that happened they would not get to add a nice free piece to their collections.
    Since they can't publicly say that, it should be possible to maneuver them into publicly endorsing your "privately-funded effort to reduce gun violence in Oakland."

    Call the group "National Gun Buyback Program, LLC" and in the press release mention that these guns will be taken "out of your town and out of your state."

    When someone figures out the guns aren't being melted down, simply point out that they are being transferred LEGALLY through a Federally-licensed dealer, "which is a lot better than how they are being sold on the streets of Oakland!"

    In other words, the hoplophobes may have baked this cake, but we can make them CHOKE on it!

    I find this VERY attractive. If I had a couple of thousand dollars, I would organize this LLC myself, sell stock, and stockholders have first pick of collected firearms, in order of when they buy into the group, with proceeds from sales divided per share.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big Guy View Post
    For being in possession of a stolen firearm.
    It's very difficult to send an LLC to jail, but you have a point.

    OTOH, the cops have no legal power to offer amnesty in the first place, and there's nothing that says the LLC can't video every transaction, as well as the entrance to the parking lot being used. To the FFL, add a licensed private detective tasked with searching for one particular stolen gun. Until that one gun is found, any others which are stolen are collected in the process of an ongoing investigation. If you discover that a gun is stolen, you can contact the owner and offer to return it for the actual cost involved in recovering it, under a mechanic's lien -- if the owner refuses, the lien is used to take possession. This is the same process used by towing companies to get titles of impounded vehicles.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DVC View Post
    It's very difficult to send an LLC to jail, but you have a point.

    OTOH, the cops have no legal power to offer amnesty in the first place,.
    I agree but I wonder if estoppel would attach if they make public statements saying that they would not enforce the laws during a buyback period?

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I agree but I wonder if estoppel would attach if they make public statements saying that they would not enforce the laws during a buyback period?
    No.

    Estoppel can only be claimed by a defendant when there is a reasonable expectation that the person or agency making an offer has the authority necessary to do so. The line "we don't make the laws, we only enforce them" would be considered a preexisting and reasonable explicit notice negating the promise of immunity. One line that drew my attention some years back was a promise that the cops wouldn't "prosecute" anyone who turned in a gun in a Chicago "amnesty."

    Cops don't prosecute ANYONE. That's what ATTORNEYS do.

    Thus, they were technically correct, and therefore covered if / when they did make arrests of people who had accepted their statement at face value.

    If you turned in a murder weapon, do you REALLY believe that you would never hear any more about it? Even if the cops promised not to enforce the law, they would either ignore the statement or, at most, claim that the promise only applied to the cop who actually made it and not the rest of the department.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big Guy View Post
    For being in possession of a stolen firearm.
    TBG
    Cite?


    NRS 205.275  Offense involving stolen property: Definition; penalty; restitution; prima facie evidence; determination of value of property.

    1.  A person commits an offense involving stolen property if the person, for his or her own gain or to prevent the owner from again possessing the owner’s property, buys, receives, possesses or withholds property:

    (a) Knowing that it is stolen property; or

    (b) Under such circumstances as should have caused a reasonable person to know that it is stolen property.
    Are you claiming that a person who purchases a firearm from a private party would fit either (a) or (b)? Or is there a separate statute making a private party purchase of a firearm a presumption of stolen property?
    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

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    Regular Member The Big Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wrightme View Post
    Cite?


    Are you claiming that a person who purchases a firearm from a private party would fit either (a) or (b)? Or is there a separate statute making a private party purchase of a firearm a presumption of stolen property?
    At what point did ignorance become a justifiable defense? Who said anything about presumption? You get arrested for some unrelated offense, they find the firearm and run it and discover it's stolen. You're going to jail.

    As for me personally I have purchased a firearm in a private sale 3 times in my life. In one case I knew exactly where it came from. In the other two I ran the serial # through the police to see if it was reported stolen.

    TBG
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