Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Redford Township City Ordinance

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Redford, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    28

    Post imported post

    So, following JBlack44's lead, I decided to see what Redford township had in it's ordinances regarding firearms and sure enough there were three that seem to conflict with the 1990 preemption rule. I used that same "pre-written" letter from Mr Jeffs that JBlack44 used.

    If you fine folks wouldn't mind taking a look at the letter I plan to send over to the trustees it would be greatly appreciated. I think we need to get these local ordinances off the books as it may possibly help when we have conflicts with LEOs who think that the local ordinances are valid.

    Thanks for your help....

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Dear Township Trustees;

    In looking through the Redford township ordinances I discovered the ones listed below covering firearm possession. Under the 1990 state preemption law these ordinances are unenforceable in regards to firearm possession and are misleading to the people of Redford and other citizens. I am requesting you amend this offending ordinances within 90 days. Failure to amend these ordinances would be considered an act of malfeasance as it willfully misinforms the public of what is and is not allowed in the township of Redford.

    Thank You for your prompt attention to this matter.

    Sincerely,
    Shawn Patterson


    In 1990, the Michigan legislature enacted MCL 123.1102 which provides, in pertinent part: A local unit of government shall not impose special taxation on, enact or enforce any ordinance or regulation pertaining to, or regulate in any other manner the ownership, registration, purchase, sale, transfer, transportation, or possession of pistols or other firearms, ammunition for pistols or other firearms, or components of pistols or other firearms, except as otherwise provided by federal law or a law of this state.

    THEMICHIGAN APPEALS COURTCONCLUDED:
    April 29, 2003
    9:10 am. v No. 242237 MCGRO vs Ferndale.

    In sum, we conclude that § 1102 is a statute that specifically imposes a prohibition on local units of government from enacting and enforcing any ordinances or regulations pertaining to the transportation and possession of firearms, and thus preempts any ordinance or regulation of a local unit of government concerning these areas. ]

    Further, we conclude that the specific language of the 2000 amendments to MCL 28.421 et seq., particularly §§ 5c and 5o, which were adopted more than a decade after the enactment of § 1102, do not repeal § 1102 or otherwise reopen this area to local regulation of the carrying of firearms.17 Accordingly, we hold that the Ferndale ordinance is preempted by state law and, consequently, we reverse.


    Township ORDINANCES in question:

    Sec. 58-271. Possession, transportation. (a)It shall be unlawful for any person other than a police officer to carry a firearm 30 inches or less in length on his person, concealed or otherwise, in the public streets, the alleys, public shopping centers or places of business frequented by the public, public parks, public school property, locations of religious worship open to the public or any other public place in the township unless the bearer possesses a duly authorized unexpired state license to carry a concealed weapon. (b)It shall be unlawful for any person other than a police officer to carry a firearm commonly referred to as a longgun (rifle, shotgun or firearm over 30 inches overall length) on the public streets, alleys, public shopping centers or places of business, public parks, public school property, property locations of religious worship open to the public, or any other public place within the township, whether cased or uncased, except under the provisions of this division. (c)Unloaded longguns may be transported from a place of purchase to the residence of the purchaser if enclosed in a carton, container, closed gun case, or wrapped completely in commercial wrapping paper securely closed by tape or string, while being so transported. (d)Unloaded longguns may be transported by motor vehicle to and from hunting and firearms practice or target shooting, but must be fully enclosed in closed carton, container or gun case or carried in the trunk of the vehicle. (e)Unloaded longguns may be carried by persons 17 years and older, on foot, to and from a regulated gun range, when the firearm is fully enclosed in a closed carton, container or gun case. Persons so involved shall proceed to and from the gun range without delay by avoiding loitering on the public streets and all other public places within the township. (Ord. No. 167, §§ 1--5, 8-18-69)

    Sec. 58-275. Concealed weapons. It shall be unlawful for any person within the township to carry any pistol, knife, dirk, knuckles, slingshot or other dangerous weapon concealed on his person. (Ord. No. 161, § 2, 3-3-69)
    Sec. 58-276. Dangerous weapons. (a)No person shall possess any machine gun, sawed-off shotgun, or any instrument or weapon of the kind commonly known as a blackjack, slingshot, sand club, sandbag, switchblade knife, or metal knuckles, nor any instrument, attachment or appliance for causing the firing of any firearm to be silent or intended to lessen or muffle the noise of the firing of any firearms, except as is otherwise permitted by law.

  2. #2
    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    SE, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    2,330

    Post imported post

    IG - looks pretty good, I would PM GeneralDet to make sure he is aware of what you are doing (local coordinator).
    Rights are like muscles. You must EXERCISE THEM to keep them from becoming atrophied.

  3. #3
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Redford, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    28

    Post imported post

    Will do... Thanks.

  4. #4
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Lansing area, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    6,343

    Post imported post

    InspectorGadget wrote:
    Dear Township Trustees;

    In looking through the Redford township ordinances I discovered the ones listed below covering firearm possession. Under the 1990 state preemption law these ordinances are unenforceable in regards to firearm possession and are misleading to the people of Redford and other citizens. I am requesting you amend theseunlawful ordinances within 90 days. Failure to amend these ordinances would be considered an act of malfeasance as it willfully misinforms the public of what is and is not allowed in the township of Redford.

    Thank You for your prompt attention to this matter.

    Sincerely,
    Shawn Patterson


    In 1990, the Michigan legislature enacted MCL 123.1102 which provides, in pertinent part: A local unit of government shall not impose special taxation on, enact or enforce any ordinance or regulation pertaining to, or regulate in any other manner the ownership, registration, purchase, sale, transfer, transportation, or possession of pistols or other firearms, ammunition for pistols or other firearms, or components of pistols or other firearms, except as otherwise provided by federal law or a law of this state.

    THEMICHIGAN APPEALS COURTCONCLUDED:
    April 29, 2003
    9:10 am. v No. 242237 MCGRO vs Ferndale.

    In sum, we conclude that § 1102 is a statute that specifically imposes a prohibition on local units of government from enacting and enforcing any ordinances or regulations pertaining to the transportation and possession of firearms, and thus preempts any ordinance or regulation of a local unit of government concerning these areas. ]

    Further, we conclude that the specific language of the 2000 amendments to MCL 28.421 et seq., particularly §§ 5c and 5o, which were adopted more than a decade after the enactment of § 1102, do not repeal § 1102 or otherwise reopen this area to local regulation of the carrying of firearms.17 Accordingly, we hold that the Ferndale ordinance is preempted by state law and, consequently, we reverse.


    Township ORDINANCES in question:

    Sec. 58-271. Possession, transportation. (a)It shall be unlawful for any person other than a police officer to carry a firearm 30 inches or less in length on his person, concealed or otherwise, in the public streets, the alleys, public shopping centers or places of business frequented by the public, public parks, public school property, locations of religious worship open to the public or any other public place in the township unless the bearer possesses a duly authorized unexpired state license to carry a concealed weapon. (b)It shall be unlawful for any person other than a police officer to carry a firearm commonly referred to as a longgun (rifle, shotgun or firearm over 30 inches overall length) on the public streets, alleys, public shopping centers or places of business, public parks, public school property, property locations of religious worship open to the public, or any other public place within the township, whether cased or uncased, except under the provisions of this division. (c)Unloaded longguns may be transported from a place of purchase to the residence of the purchaser if enclosed in a carton, container, closed gun case, or wrapped completely in commercial wrapping paper securely closed by tape or string, while being so transported. (d)Unloaded longguns may be transported by motor vehicle to and from hunting and firearms practice or target shooting, but must be fully enclosed in closed carton, container or gun case or carried in the trunk of the vehicle. (e)Unloaded longguns may be carried by persons 17 years and older, on foot, to and from a regulated gun range, when the firearm is fully enclosed in a closed carton, container or gun case. Persons so involved shall proceed to and from the gun range without delay by avoiding loitering on the public streets and all other public places within the township. (Ord. No. 167, §§ 1--5, 8-18-69)

    Sec. 58-275. Concealed weapons. It shall be unlawful for any person within the township to carry any pistol, knife, dirk, knuckles, slingshot or other dangerous weapon concealed on his person. (Ord. No. 161, § 2, 3-3-69)
    Sec. 58-276. Dangerous weapons. (a)No person shall possess any machine gun, sawed-off shotgun, or any instrument or weapon of the kind commonly known as a blackjack, slingshot, sand club, sandbag, switchblade knife, or metal knuckles, nor any instrument, attachment or appliance for causing the firing of any firearm to be silent or intended to lessen or muffle the noise of the firing of any firearms, except as is otherwise permitted by law.
    Bolded a couple you missed and added a comment in red. They can't control long guns either. And any minor (Under 17 in this case) can possess a loaded long gun with supervision by an adult.

    I don't like the part about the machine gun and sawed off, because you can possess those with a proper licence. Better just to say unlawful firearms.
    Special offer - buy a copy of "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" and get a free copy of "Bond of Unseen Blood" Go to http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Redford, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    28

    Post imported post

    Thanks for the input Venator. I would like to see the entire Sec. 58-271 removed and any reference to a firearm removed from the other two. I believe that this would satisfy the preemption rule.



  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Redford, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    28

    Post imported post

    Email was sent to the Township Trustees (trustee@redfordtwp.com) on Mon, Aug 24, 2009 at 9:34 PM.

    I will keep everyone updated.


  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Grand Rapids, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    1,416

    Post imported post

    Venator wrote:
    InspectorGadget wrote:
    Dear Township Trustees;

    In looking through the Redford township ordinances I discovered the ones listed below covering firearm possession. Under the 1990 state preemption law these ordinances are unenforceable in regards to firearm possession and are misleading to the people of Redford and other citizens. I am requesting you amend theseunlawful ordinances within 90 days. Failure to amend these ordinances would be considered an act of malfeasance as it willfully misinforms the public of what is and is not allowed in the township of Redford.

    Thank You for your prompt attention to this matter.

    Sincerely,
    Shawn Patterson


    In 1990, the Michigan legislature enacted MCL 123.1102 which provides, in pertinent part: A local unit of government shall not impose special taxation on, enact or enforce any ordinance or regulation pertaining to, or regulate in any other manner the ownership, registration, purchase, sale, transfer, transportation, or possession of pistols or other firearms, ammunition for pistols or other firearms, or components of pistols or other firearms, except as otherwise provided by federal law or a law of this state.

    THEMICHIGAN APPEALS COURTCONCLUDED:
    April 29, 2003
    9:10 am. v No. 242237 MCGRO vs Ferndale.

    In sum, we conclude that § 1102 is a statute that specifically imposes a prohibition on local units of government from enacting and enforcing any ordinances or regulations pertaining to the transportation and possession of firearms, and thus preempts any ordinance or regulation of a local unit of government concerning these areas. ]

    Further, we conclude that the specific language of the 2000 amendments to MCL 28.421 et seq., particularly §§ 5c and 5o, which were adopted more than a decade after the enactment of § 1102, do not repeal § 1102 or otherwise reopen this area to local regulation of the carrying of firearms.17 Accordingly, we hold that the Ferndale ordinance is preempted by state law and, consequently, we reverse.


    Township ORDINANCES in question:

    Sec. 58-271. Possession, transportation. (a)It shall be unlawful for any person other than a police officer to carry a firearm 30 inches or less in length on his person, concealed or otherwise, in the public streets, the alleys, public shopping centers or places of business frequented by the public, public parks, public school property, locations of religious worship open to the public or any other public place in the township unless the bearer possesses a duly authorized unexpired state license to carry a concealed weapon. (b)It shall be unlawful for any person other than a police officer to carry a firearm commonly referred to as a longgun (rifle, shotgun or firearm over 30 inches overall length) on the public streets, alleys, public shopping centers or places of business, public parks, public school property, property locations of religious worship open to the public, or any other public place within the township, whether cased or uncased, except under the provisions of this division. (c)Unloaded longguns may be transported from a place of purchase to the residence of the purchaser if enclosed in a carton, container, closed gun case, or wrapped completely in commercial wrapping paper securely closed by tape or string, while being so transported. (d)Unloaded longguns may be transported by motor vehicle to and from hunting and firearms practice or target shooting, but must be fully enclosed in closed carton, container or gun case or carried in the trunk of the vehicle. (e)Unloaded longguns may be carried by persons 17 years and older, on foot, to and from a regulated gun range, when the firearm is fully enclosed in a closed carton, container or gun case. Persons so involved shall proceed to and from the gun range without delay by avoiding loitering on the public streets and all other public places within the township. (Ord. No. 167, §§ 1--5, 8-18-69)

    Sec. 58-275. Concealed weapons. It shall be unlawful for any person within the township to carry any pistol, knife, dirk, knuckles, slingshot or other dangerous weapon concealed on his person. (Ord. No. 161, § 2, 3-3-69)
    Sec. 58-276. Dangerous weapons. (a)No person shall possess any machine gun, sawed-off shotgun, or any instrument or weapon of the kind commonly known as a blackjack, slingshot, sand club, sandbag, switchblade knife, or metal knuckles, nor any instrument, attachment or appliance for causing the firing of any firearm to be silent or intended to lessen or muffle the noise of the firing of any firearms, except as is otherwise permitted by law.
    Bolded a couple you missed and added a comment in red. They can't control long guns either. And any minor (Under 17 in this case) can possess a loaded long gun with supervision by an adult.

    I don't like the part about the machine gun and sawed off, because you can possess those with a proper licence. Better just to say unlawful firearms.
    Not only that, but what is their definition of "sawed off"? Lots of people saw off the barrels of their shot guns, but they are still within legal limits.

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Redford, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    28

    Post imported post

    Already got an initial reply from the Redford Twp Supervisor!!!

    Dear Mr. Patterson,
    Thank you for bringing your concern to my attention. I have forwarded your email to our township attorney for review. I will contact you within ten business days with follow up to this matter.

    Sincerely,
    Tracey Schultz Kobylarz
    Redford Township Supervisor
    313-387-2705

    WOW!! Now that is the way it should always go!

  9. #9
    Regular Member Generaldet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    President, CLSD, Inc., Oxford, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    1,073

    Post imported post

    Nice work. Keep us updated with any responses.

  10. #10
    Campaign Veteran
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    RTM, Lake Linden, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    232

    Post imported post

    Went to high school there, wish you luck in your endeavors!

  11. #11
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Redford, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    28

    Post imported post

    Looks like we are almost there...

    ----------------------------------------------------

    Good afternoon Mr. Patterson,

    I have reviewed the information with our Chief of Police and township
    attorney. As you are aware, State law has precedence in this matter. We
    have reviewed our township ordinance and it will be updated soon.

    In the interim, our Chief has educated our officers on the current State
    law. We have been assured that we are in compliance and no action will be
    taken that is contrary to the law.

    Thank you for your follow up!

    Warm regards,
    ~Tracey


    Tracey Schultz Kobylarz
    Redford Township Supervisor

  12. #12
    Campaign Veteran
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    RTM, Lake Linden, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    232

    Post imported post

    nice work

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •