Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: Looking for advice on black powder

  1. #1
    Regular Member fire suppressor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Kitsap County
    Posts
    872

    Post imported post

    Sorry this is a little off topic of the forum but I wasn't sure who ells to ask. I am interested in getting into black powder cap and ball side arms. I have been shooting my entire life but have never shot black powder nor do I know anyone that dose. Is there a website, book or reference anyone could recommend to the new kid on the black powder black?
    "Fight like you train, train like you fight"

  2. #2
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Spokane, Wa., ,
    Posts
    265

    Post imported post

    Ah, the joys of black powder shooting. The muzzle loading community is not immune to government intrusion. Cap and flintlock guns have tripled in price. Powder its self has gone up 4x in price. Powder storage is regulated by the International Fire Code. There are a couple of cities in Washington that require you to sign for powder. That goes to the local fire marshal and your home may be inspected for proper storage. But, then you might already know this if you work for the fire dept.
    But check out,

    http://www.dixiegunworks.com

    Here is a nice little pistol that makes a good sidearm,

    http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product...ducts_id=14020


    Also be sure to check out local ml clubs in your area.

    http://www.nmlra.org/

    Also,

    http://www.wamuzzleloaders.org/


  3. #3
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    694

    Post imported post

    When/if you get a muzzle loader you can buy black powder from
    http://www.powderinc.com/catalog/order.htm
    You just have to buy it in 5 pound increments. They are where I buy my BP from. I have 5 muzzle loaders (2 rifles and 3 handguns) not counting my cannons, mortars or flare launchers all of which use BP.
    Perhaps if you would use a real computer you wouldn't have to apologize for not being able to do so many things on the internet!

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Skagit Valley, Washington
    Posts
    451

    Post imported post

    I have an old paperback, "The Lyman Black Powder Handbook"
    It has a lot of good info, and is probably enough to get you started.
    Want to read some stories of BP used in self-defense?
    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=60709
    I am not advocating you carry a BP sidearm as your primary choice of defense, but if it happened to be what was at hand, it would get the job done, until your cylinder dried up.... A lot of folks died of round ball wounds. Have a look at the records of the war between the states.
    As I've said here before, they are interesting period arms.

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    390

    Post imported post

    I wouldn't feel undergunned with a .44 cap and ball revolver, although it would not be my first choice.

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wa, ,
    Posts
    2,769

    Post imported post

    Firesuppressor,

    The next time you are in Wholesale Sports (old Sportsmans) in Silverdale, look me up at the gun counter. I have hunted and shot competetively with BP for over 40 years. At present I buy BP from powder inc in 50# lots and that will last me 6 months. Yes, I have access to a licensed magazine for storage. Also, the state has relaxed the storage requirements for households frm 5# to 25#, although local restrictions may still be in place.

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    390

    Post imported post

    Trigger Dr wrote:
    Firesuppressor,

    The next time you are in Wholesale Sports (old Sportsmans) in Silverdale, look me up at the gun counter. I have hunted and shot competetively with BP for over 40 years. At present I buy BP from powder inc in 50# lots and that will last me 6 months. Yes, I have access to a licensed magazine for storage. Also, the state has relaxed the storage requirements for households frm 5# to 25#, although local restrictions may still be in place.
    Is that a good place to work? I just applied for a job there.

    And Firesuppressor and I were just in there looking at BP firearms. The dude behind the counter suggested we talk to their resident BP expert. Couldn't remember the name, but he might have been talking about you.
    :celebrate

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wa, ,
    Posts
    2,769

    Post imported post

    Yeah that would be me. I have been there 4 years not a bad place to work. Better now that the New ownership.



  9. #9
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    390

    Post imported post

    Very nice. Hope I get the job.

  10. #10
    Regular Member Batousaii's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Kitsap Co., Washington, USA
    Posts
    1,234

    Post imported post

    Dr. Fresh wrote:
    I wouldn't feel undergunned with a .44 cap and ball revolver, although it would not be my first choice.

    Colt (replica?) Walker or Dragoon is a BEAST! - rather be hit with a 9mm ... talk about "ouch".... But yes, BP revolvers can be fickle, caps unseat from recoil, powder gets crusty andthe cylinder resists revolving after about the 3rd reload. So for modern defense, not the best, but can be done. Open carry of a BP? I'd go with an old full flap high on the hip cavalry style. Beautiful rustic piece it is...hard core pirate type you are matey? Flint lock tower pistol ?!? Go 60 cal and hang on tight. Not sure if i'd take someone serious if they pulled it out though, until it went off.....my bad...

    In all reality, BP is VERY Fun ! - unfortunately my 1860 army revolver and 44 cal tower pistol (flintlock) were stolen by a former family member. But they were fun. And yes, i carried the 1860 replica in drop loop (hiking on big private property), usually accompanied by a modern rifle. Fun combo it is. I always made sure to fire off the rounds and clean the pistol before the end of the day. Not sure i'd be comfortable with long term cap-n-ball storage.... just me.

    Trigger Dr, Whats your take on long term storage of a loaded BP Revolver (or other pistol) - I ask in a more historical manner, as in modern times it probably would rarely be done... I understand your the resident expert

    ~ ENCLAVE vmc ~
    The Enclave is looking for patriotic motorcycle riders in Washington State who support liberty and freedom for all. ~ Check us out!
    ~
    * " To be swayed neither by the opponent nor by his sword is the essence of swordsmanship." - Miyamoto Musashi.

  11. #11
    Founder's Club Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Fairfax Co., VA
    Posts
    18,766

    Post imported post

    Batousaii wrote:
    SNIP Not sure i'd be comfortable with long term cap-n-ball storage.... just me.
    Now, you got me to thinking.

    I wonder if it would work to borrow a little old-time cannon technology? Pre-measured charges in little cotton or silk bags. Like those little bags they use for Skoal Pouches or something.

    Afterthe front is loaded, then "*****" the bags just like a Civil War cannoneer, but through the hole in the nipple.Put onthe caps, and off you go.

    De-capping might take some nerve and careful attention at the end of the day.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wa, ,
    Posts
    2,769

    Post imported post

    The biggest problem with long term storage of cap n ball is the possibility of moisture getting to the powder through the nipple. I have had some stored for up to a year with the cap removed and stored in a safe. They worked just fine when capped and shot.

  13. #13
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    north mason county, Washington, USA
    Posts
    4,381

    Post imported post

    my 50 cal rifle had hung on the wall for 3 yrs, uncapped since my last hunt, my friend ask if it was still loaded? i couldnt remember for sure, so i capped it and pulled the trigger. i was right on target, shot my styrofoam bouy at 100 yrds!
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

  14. #14
    Founder's Club Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Fairfax Co., VA
    Posts
    18,766

    Post imported post

    2, 4, 5 A defender wrote:
    my 50 cal rifle had hung on the wall for 3 yrs, uncapped since my last hunt, my friend ask if it was still loaded? i couldnt remember for sure, so i capped it and pulled the trigger. i was right on target, shot my styrofoam bouy at 100 yrds!
    I think you just wanted to shoot the rifle.

    The loaded-status check for a BP weapon is to insert the ramrod and see if it goes to the "unloaded" mark.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  15. #15
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    north mason county, Washington, USA
    Posts
    4,381

    Post imported post

    of course you are right. i like shooting guns, any excuse is good enough. for sure i could have just measured with the ramrod, but whats the fun in that? besides, if i found it loaded, i would have wanted it unloaded anyway! also, pulling the trigger, when you dont know if it will go boom, is an excellent way to check for your flinch reaction!
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

  16. #16
    Regular Member fire suppressor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Kitsap County
    Posts
    872

    Post imported post

    Thanks Trigger Dr I will say hi next time I see you in there. You see so many people in the store I wouldn't expect you to remember me. We have talked in passing before and we chatted for a while at my first open carry picnic about a year and a half ago now at the lake/park in port orchard
    "Fight like you train, train like you fight"

  17. #17
    Opt-Out Members
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    4

    Post imported post

    Trigger Dr wrote:
    The biggest problem with long term storage of cap n ball is the possibility of moisture getting to the powder through the nipple. I have had some stored for up to a year with the cap removed and stored in a safe. They worked just fine when capped and shot.
    I had always heard the way it was done a century+ ago was to seal the caps onto the cylinder with wax. (This would be not for storage but just for keeping your pistol loaded on a daily basis).

    My only advice for someone new, if you want a pistol, go with an old-army style. The metal bar above the cylinder makes the pistol more forgiving of overloading :-) compared to a Colt style (particular a colt of a brass-frame, which I'd recommend avoiding). Oh and DONT under any circumstances dry fire, unless you are in the mood to replace the nipples. And if you do carry it, either load 5 of 6, or in the old-army style observe the half-way notch (which is a beautiful thing). And cleanliness is absolutely required for BP. If you don't thoroughly clean it, it will corrode. I've heard of guys who put the whole thing in the dishwasher after an initial cleaning. I've never tried that though.

  18. #18
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    390

    Post imported post

    Speaking of BP, what is the law on carrying one? Is a BP pistol legally considered a pistol? If not, does that mean I can't carry it capped inside a vehicle?

    Also, if BP pistols are OK, what's the definition of a BP pistol? Can I carry a smoothbore muzzleloader loaded and capped in a vehicle if it's a certain size, or would that be considered a shotgun?

  19. #19
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Everett / Leavenworth, Washington, USA
    Posts
    89

    Post imported post

    Dr. Fresh wrote:
    Speaking of BP, what is the law on carrying one? Is a BP pistol legally considered a pistol? If not, does that mean I can't carry it capped inside a vehicle?

    Also, if BP pistols are OK, what's the definition of a BP pistol? Can I carry a smoothbore muzzleloader loaded and capped in a vehicle if it's a certain size, or would that be considered a shotgun?
    In WA state,a BP weapon is considered a firearm meaning that if you are a Felon,etc and not allowed to own a firearm,it extends to BP also.I know that a charged and capped long gun is considered loaded and illegal to carry in a vehicle,no cap = legal,besides,it only takes a second to cap it.I would think that the handgun rules apply to a BP pistol the same as modern,but don't know for sure.

    I just got into BP about 4 years ago,it is a great sport,I didn't know what I was missing for a lot of years.

  20. #20
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    390

    Post imported post

    SANDRAT wrote:
    Dr. Fresh wrote:
    Speaking of BP, what is the law on carrying one? Is a BP pistol legally considered a pistol? If not, does that mean I can't carry it capped inside a vehicle?

    Also, if BP pistols are OK, what's the definition of a BP pistol? Can I carry a smoothbore muzzleloader loaded and capped in a vehicle if it's a certain size, or would that be considered a shotgun?
    In WA state,a BP weapon is considered a firearm meaning that if you are a Felon,etc and not allowed to own a firearm,it extends to BP also.I know that a charged and capped long gun is considered loaded and illegal to carry in a vehicle,no cap = legal,besides,it only takes a second to cap it.I would think that the handgun rules apply to a BP pistol the same as modern,but don't know for sure.

    I just got into BP about 4 years ago,it is a great sport,I didn't know what I was missing for a lot of years.
    Hmmm..

    Because I was thinking a smoothbore muzzleloading pistol with a huge bore and loaded with shot would be fun to have, but would that be a shotgun or a handgun?

  21. #21
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Everett / Leavenworth, Washington, USA
    Posts
    89

    Post imported post

    Dr. Fresh wrote:
    SANDRAT wrote:
    Dr. Fresh wrote:
    Speaking of BP, what is the law on carrying one? Is a BP pistol legally considered a pistol? If not, does that mean I can't carry it capped inside a vehicle?

    Also, if BP pistols are OK, what's the definition of a BP pistol? Can I carry a smoothbore muzzleloader loaded and capped in a vehicle if it's a certain size, or would that be considered a shotgun?
    In WA state,a BP weapon is considered a firearm meaning that if you are a Felon,etc and not allowed to own a firearm,it extends to BP also.I know that a charged and capped long gun is considered loaded and illegal to carry in a vehicle,no cap = legal,besides,it only takes a second to cap it.I would think that the handgun rules apply to a BP pistol the same as modern,but don't know for sure.

    I just got into BP about 4 years ago,it is a great sport,I didn't know what I was missing for a lot of years.
    Hmmm..

    Because I was thinking a smoothbore muzzleloading pistol with a huge bore and loaded with shot would be fun to have, but would that be a shotgun or a handgun?
    Good question,my TC Encore has a 12" BBL that takes 3" .410 shells,but is marked 45 Colt,it is also rifled with a choke that schreds the wad and sends the shot straight,if it were smoothbore,it would be a sawed off shotgun(still is in CA),I guess if a manufacturer were selling the as a smoothbore BP pistol,they would be legal.I would start by checking with Dixie Gun Works as they have an incredible selection,they could probably answer that.

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    390

    Post imported post

    It's an interesting question. Really I just want a 12 gauge pistol without going through the NFA. Haha

  23. #23
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Everett / Leavenworth, Washington, USA
    Posts
    89

    Post imported post

    Dr. Fresh wrote:
    It's an interesting question. Really I just want a 12 gauge pistol without going through the NFA. Haha
    SCOFFLAW!!

  24. #24
    Campaign Veteran OlGutshotWilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Snohomish, WA, ,
    Posts
    435

    Post imported post

    Firesuppressor,

    Check out http://www.davidscottharper.com/shoot/BP_for_CAS.htm

    It's geared for SASS and CAS shooting but covers a lot of what you want to know about BP and the substitutes.

    Good reading.

    Cheers from another fire guy!

    Bill
    THE SECOND AMENDMENT: Washington didn't use his right to free speech to defeat the British, he shot them.
    ---------------------------------------------
    Government is not reason; it is not eloquent -- it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."
    --George Washington,
    first U.S. president

  25. #25
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    390

    Post imported post

    SANDRAT wrote:
    Dr. Fresh wrote:
    It's an interesting question. Really I just want a 12 gauge pistol without going through the NFA. Haha
    SCOFFLAW!!
    Huh? :shock:

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •