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Thread: For anyone afraid to OC due to financial reasons

  1. #1
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    This thread

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_to...ghlight=afraid

    made me realize that there are probably many people who do not OC because they fear being charged criminally, and not having the financial resources to fight the prosecution in court.



    I want this fear to go away.



    If anyone here is charged with a crime for merely open carrying, and does not qualify for a public defender, I will strongly consider defending them for no attorney fees, so long as my costs--gas, ferries, hotel if needed, etc--are covered.

    Now, to cover my own butt...

    This is something Iwill generally bewilling to do to advance the cause of freedom. However, no one should rely upon my statements, or otherwise treat them as a binding promise. I reserve the right to turn down any and all potential pro bono cases for any reason, or for no reason at all, just like I can with paying clients. I only say this so no one can sue me ifI do not provide them with free legal services. I also may decide to discontinue this service at any time, with or without prior notice.

    This does not mean that I intend to sue any city, police department, etc. for a civil rights violation for free. This does not mean that I will defend for free anyone who actually shot someone, or otherwise used their self-defense firearm, or did anything more than peaceably carry a holstered sidearm in a legal location.

    Sorry for all the disclaimers.



    Bottom line, don't not OC for fear of being bankrupted by having to fight a criminal charge.

  2. #2
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    I am not going to lie...

    I have not OC'd for this very reason... I guess I've been lurking for a bit too long. Time to Practice what I've been preaching.


    Thank you.

  3. #3
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    That's great and am glad you are offering your services. This community needs someone like that. Do you have cards, that in case of arrest instead of talking to the police folks can just hand over?
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  4. #4
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    I have cards. PM me and I can mail you a few.

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    Very generous offer!

    PM sent for a few cards as well please.

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    I guess I always figured I would represent myself, my only fear is that I get murdered by cop and he gets off scott free.

  7. #7
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    P.M. Sent,

    Thanks for offering your services, hopefully it will encourage more to O.C.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  8. #8
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    PM Sent.

    Thank you again.

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    Very generous Olypendrew, We all should appreciate your efforts to promote OC

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    Drew:

    We need to get you listed as a Network Affiliated Attorney for The Armed Citizens' Legal Defense Network, LLC. It is guys like you who will make our new venture a success.

    Here is the link, www.armedcitizensnetwork.org,

    and please e-mail me privately. Mhayes@armedcitizensnetwork.org

    Marty Hayes

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    Wow, that's a very generous and incredible thing to do! It's folks like you that made me recently buy my first handgun and want to exercise my rights! Thank you very much for this Keep up the good work!
    -Oli
    Also PM'd for some cards.


  12. #12
    State Pioneer ConditionThree's Avatar
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    olypendrew wrote:
    Bottom line, don't not OC for fear of being bankrupted by having to fight a criminal charge.
    I wish we had an attorney here in California that was so inclined to defend OC. Thepro-gun attorneys here are of the concensus that OC isnt helpful, and it seems their interest in defending it is directly proportionate to the amount of cash you intend to invest in your defense.

    We have been fortunate that of the handful of arrests that I am aware of, only one is being pursued by a zealous city attorney.
    New to OPEN CARRY in California? Click and read this first...

    NA MALE SUBJ ON FOOT, LS NB 3 AGO HAD A HOLSTERED HANDGUN ON HIS RIGHT HIP. WAS NOT BRANDISHING THE WEAPON, BUT RP FOUND SUSPICIOUS.
    CL SUBJ IN COMPLIANCE WITH LAW


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  13. #13
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    ConditionThree wrote:
    olypendrew wrote:
    Bottom line, don't not OC for fear of being bankrupted by having to fight a criminal charge.
    I wish we had an attorney here in California that was so inclined to defend OC. Thepro-gun attorneys here are of the concensus that OC isnt helpful, and it seems their interest in defending it is directly proportionate to the amount of cash you intend to invest in your defense.
    What's the minimum they would accept? $1 million? $10 million? What figure would it take to defend and also file 1983 actions all the way to SCOTUS against these victim disarming bastards?

  14. #14
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    olypendrew wrote:
    This thread

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_to...ghlight=afraid

    made me realize that there are probably many people who do not OC because they fear being charged criminally, and not having the financial resources to fight the prosecution in court.

    *

    I want this fear to go away.




    *

    If anyone here is charged with a crime for merely open carrying, and does not qualify for a public defender, I will strongly consider defending them for no attorney fees, so long as my costs--gas, ferries, hotel if needed, etc--are covered.*

    Now, to cover my own butt...

    This is something I*will generally be*willing to do to advance the cause of freedom.* However, no one should rely upon my statements, or otherwise treat them as a binding promise.* I reserve the right to turn down any and all potential pro bono cases for any reason, or for no reason at all, just like I can with paying clients.* I only say this so no one can sue me if*I do not provide them with free legal services. *I also may decide to discontinue this service at any time, with or without prior notice.

    This does not mean that I intend to sue any city, police department, etc. for a civil rights violation for free.* This does not mean that I will defend for free anyone who actually shot someone, or otherwise used their self-defense firearm, or did anything more than peaceably carry a holstered sidearm in a legal location.

    Sorry for all the disclaimers.

    *

    Bottom line, don't not OC for fear of being bankrupted by having to fight a criminal charge.

    Oly,
    Very intuitive thinking. Very generous offer.

    Cheers,
    Bill
    THE SECOND AMENDMENT: Washington didn't use his right to free speech to defeat the British, he shot them.
    ---------------------------------------------
    Government is not reason; it is not eloquent -- it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."
    --George Washington,
    first U.S. president

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    In the event that anyone was relying on my pledge--to strongly consider taking any case where an OCer was charged with unlawful display of a weapon on a pro bono basis--please be advised that I am revoking it.

    I will still consider taking such cases on a pro bono or reduced fee basis, but only if I am convinced that the person charged is both libertarian-minded, and respectful of me and my profession.

  16. #16
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    Thank you for the offer, sorry to see you have to change the offer, I am guessing due to disrespect for you and or your profession. The folks here are definitely a bit outspoken on their opinions, I do wish they were a bit better about respecting the poster and agreeing to disagree with the stated opinion

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by olypendrew View Post
    In the event that anyone was relying on my pledge--to strongly consider taking any case where an OCer was charged with unlawful display of a weapon on a pro bono basis--please be advised that I am revoking it.

    I will still consider taking such cases on a pro bono or reduced fee basis, but only if I am convinced that the person charged is both libertarian-minded, and respectful of me and my profession.
    I really do not see how the offered changed, I would not think someone offering such a service for someone that neither respected them or was not on the side of law and not promoting the cause.
    • Being prepared is to prepare, this is our responsibility.
    • I am not your Mommy or Daddy and do not sugar coat it but I will tell you simply as how I see it, it is up to you on how you will or will not use it.
    • IANAL, all information I present is for your review, do your own homework.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigDave View Post
    I really do not see how the offered changed, I would not think someone offering such a service for someone that neither respected them or was not on the side of law and not promoting the cause.
    I agree with Dave. It seems more like you realized the extent of what you were offering and that it was a bit too open ended. I will definitely have you in speed dial just to have "my lawyer" on the phone while they are harassing me, if it ever happens. I will also be able to pay, should it come to that.

  19. #19
    Regular Member cougfan's Avatar
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    Thats really great that you would offer your time and expertise to someone in the situation a lot of us fear most. A lot of us that open carry are passionate about our 2nd and 4th amendment rights that all too often get trampled. Luckily I think you will find a lot of around here are libertarian minded (yep I voted for Bob Barr) and respect attorneys for helping to protect our rights.

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    Quote Originally Posted by heresolong View Post
    I agree with Dave. It seems more like you realized the extent of what you were offering and that it was a bit too open ended. I will definitely have you in speed dial just to have "my lawyer" on the phone while they are harassing me, if it ever happens. I will also be able to pay, should it come to that.
    I think "libertarian minded" excludes a number of people, including BigDave. But that's just my interpretation.
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

  21. #21
    Opt-Out Members BigDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heresolong View Post
    I agree with Dave. It seems more like you realized the extent of what you were offering and that it was a bit too open ended. I will definitely have you in speed dial just to have "my lawyer" on the phone while they are harassing me, if it ever happens. I will also be able to pay, should it come to that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
    I think "libertarian minded" excludes a number of people, including BigDave. But that's just my interpretation.
    Tawnos you just serve the pettiness master.
    • Being prepared is to prepare, this is our responsibility.
    • I am not your Mommy or Daddy and do not sugar coat it but I will tell you simply as how I see it, it is up to you on how you will or will not use it.
    • IANAL, all information I present is for your review, do your own homework.

  22. #22
    Regular Member Leatherneck's Avatar
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    PM sent.
    Thank you Oly!

  23. #23
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    First of all thank you that is very Nobel of you and I think it is because we have such a loyal and dedicated group that with time there is no doubt in my mind we will win this fight. For me personally sometimes I am less afraid of having to go to court, I am more afraid of losing my firearm. I read posts all the time of people getting there gun confiscated by a LEO. There has been times I chose not to OC just becasue if I lose my XD I cant afford to go get another one right away. Is this hypothetical simpler case of losing a firearms something you would consider?
    "Fight like you train, train like you fight"

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by olypendrew View Post
    This thread

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_to...ghlight=afraid

    made me realize that there are probably many people who do not OC because they fear being charged criminally, and not having the financial resources to fight the prosecution in court.



    I want this fear to go away.



    If anyone here is charged with a crime for merely open carrying, and does not qualify for a public defender, I will strongly consider defending them for no attorney fees, so long as my costs--gas, ferries, hotel if needed, etc--are covered.

    Now, to cover my own butt...

    This is something Iwill generally bewilling to do to advance the cause of freedom. However, no one should rely upon my statements, or otherwise treat them as a binding promise. I reserve the right to turn down any and all potential pro bono cases for any reason, or for no reason at all, just like I can with paying clients. I only say this so no one can sue me ifI do not provide them with free legal services. I also may decide to discontinue this service at any time, with or without prior notice.

    This does not mean that I intend to sue any city, police department, etc. for a civil rights violation for free. This does not mean that I will defend for free anyone who actually shot someone, or otherwise used their self-defense firearm, or did anything more than peaceably carry a holstered sidearm in a legal location.

    Sorry for all the disclaimers.



    Bottom line, don't not OC for fear of being bankrupted by having to fight a criminal charge.
    Appreciate the offer but it is a conflicted statement. Disclaimers tend to do that.

  25. #25
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    Requests for cards

    I have received several PMs asking for cards, and I will be sending them as soon as my new batch arrives from the printers.

    My phone number is on my website, if anyone wants to put it in their contacts.

    Some folks asked for cards, but didn't leave a name and/or address, so please send another PM with that information, if you are one of those folks.

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