Costco

imported post

I was in Costco at the Portland, branch on 138th.

I was trying to decide which camera I was going to buy. I was having trouble rationalizing spending $800 or $900 on a camera when I do not take photos for a living or that many photos, for that matter. I have the money but I am trying to buy what I need and not what I want.

So, I walked around the store, went to the food bar and got a couple of hot-dogs sat down and ate them. Went back to the camera section. A young person--12 or so--came and told me that they were going to tow my Harley because of where I had it parked. So, I went and moved my bike and went back inside to the Camera department again.

I had been there probably about 2 hours or so. While I was making up the purchase slip for the camera I chose, the assistant manager came up to me and told me I could not have my gun in the store. He said he would be more than happy to show me the policy in writing and that the "no weapons" policy was included in my membership material.

He was nice and we discused, "Where is you sign" issue. He said he liked guns himself but it was policy. We talked about my rebate that I had received because I purchase so much at Costco. I also informed him of the open carry movement in the country and a lot of people would cancel their memebership if they could not carry their weapons. He understood and sugested that I email the corporate people becasue I am a member of the private club as well. Then the security guy came walking and asked him if he was alright---amazing :?

So, I went back to my bike and pulled my shirt over my gun and went back in and purchased my camera and I left.

I went online to look at membership policies that one gets when he joins Costco. There is nothing about not carrying weapons or bringing weapons into the store. Costco.com

Called the membership center today up in Washington and the woman told me that the information she had was that weapons are not allowed in Costco. I asked her if she could send the policy to me in an email. The following is what I received via email:

Costco Wholesale is a membership-only warehouse club. It is not open to the general public. It restricts membership to a limited group of qualified individuals who agree to membership conditions. We have the right and the obligation to our members, to enact and enforce membership rules. The Member Service Employees at the exit doors are obliged to follow these rules. By obtaining a Costco membership card, our members agree to comply with the Membership Rules and the Privileges and Conditions of membership.



Costco does not believe that it is necessary for firearms to be brought into its warehouse stores, except in the case of authorized law enforcement officers. For the protection of all our members and employees, we feel this is a reasonable and prudent precaution to ensure a pleasant shopping experience and safe workplace. Our policy is meant to protect our members and employees in all warehouses around the world. This is not a new policy and we do not customize the policy for each individual city/county/state/country where we do business.



Our primary goal at Costco Wholesale is to keep our members happy. If you believe that our policy restricting members from bringing firearms into our warehouse stores is either unfair or excessively burdensome, or you cannot agree to abide by this policy, or you are dissatisfied for any other reason, Costco will promptly refund your annual membership fee in full.



Sincerely,

Sher Moyer
Exec. Service Rep
Ext. 111704

This response is a personal response and I becasue I did not see a "no weapons rule" in the membership guidlines on their web site I have to believe that the no weapons rule issomething they do not have in writing.

In either case, I was asked to leave and had to leave.

With the above response, I do not believe that it would do any good to email my concerns about my safety in their store.

I welcome any input anyone has to offer :quirky

imported post

I have heard this about Costco before. They always say it is corporate policy, but no one has ever seen it. They can't produce it except for personal emails like yours. I would email back and ask her to send you a copy of the policy with the firearms section highlighted for easy reference. If they can not do that, then take it higher up the Costco chain until there is a definite answer.

imported post

Press the issue. Yes it's private property but it's also a MEMBERSHIP CLUB and you are a MEMBER of the club. Joe Schmo, or in this case Sher Moyer, doesn't get to just make things up. Write back and state that you want to read the actual policy, not an interpretation, summary, or opinion of what the MEMBERSHIP policy is. Saying "the information I have" doesn't mean there is a policy, for all you know she or her boss just don't like guns and are making it up. As a member, demand the actual policy!!!!

Because it is a MEMBERSHIP CLUB and they have refered to the corporate policy they have no reason to deny giving a MEMBER the written policy.

Press the issue all the way up the corporate chain, including corporate legal. Be sure to mention that WalMart/SAMS club have a single policy of allowing whatever is legal in the locality where their store is located and that you know where the WalMart and SAMS club stores are and can just as easilly spend your money there.

If they can't show you the policy in writing in the materials that a new member gerts, demand a refund of your membership (if you're willing to sacrifice a little for the cause) because they didn't inform you that you wouldn't be able to shop in the store. And keep pushing for the written corporate policy.

It's always a battle when we come up against a "big guy" business that's anti-gun and you're likely to lose but if we don't press the issue we automatically lose and they win.

imported post

I sent the followingemail back to Ms. Moyer:

Actually, Ms. Moyer, I was not looking for a disagreement or a personal opinion.



I was told that the firearm “rule” was included in my membership paperwork that I signed when I became a member. Is there a written policy? What rules do the “Member Service Employees” follow concerning firearms?



I am a member of Costco and, in this case, not the “general public.” Because I am a member, I believe that I am entitled to any documentation that might pertain to firearms and Costco.



I could not find anything pertaining to firearms in the membership information on Costco.com. Without a sign prohibiting weapons posted on the entrance door of Costco, how is one supposed to know weapons are not allowed in Costco warehouses?



Again, back to “membership rules, privileges, and conditions,” I would like to know where I can find or read the firearms official policy.



Sincerely,

I wonder if she will respond?

imported post

If she doesn't respond, complain higher.

Also, I find it interesting that she tells you guns aren't allowed and that the member service employees on the EXIT DOORS are obliged to follow the rules. Seems to me that only tells someone about the no guns policy when they're leaving. LOL

imported post

I would actually appreciate if you'd post this gal's e-mail so I can send her an e-mail about this as well since I'm in the Portland area.

imported post

Ironbar wrote:

I would actually appreciate if you'd post this gal's e-mail so I can send her an e-mail about this as well since I'm in the Portland area.

Click to expand...

Here ya go......

Sher Moyer [smoyer@costco.com]

Thanks for getting involved!


Edited for color

imported post

I received this email from Oregon Firearms Federation (OFF):


By all means, if you hear back let us know. Maybe we can start a page of businesses that are off limits to gun owners.

They have done this in other states, but there are not as many here.

I would be happy to post something on our website about places unfriendly to gun owners.


We have started to post cities with restrictions; we'll do it with buisnesses too.


Edited for spacing and color

imported post

I just sent them a message asking what their policy is because my wife and I would like to switch from SAMS club to Costco but first need to know what their policy is on lawful carry of firearms as SAMS club/WalMart is that lawful carry is permited.

You see, you make them think you wanna spend some money and then you see if you get a response that doesn't equate to the reality at the store.

We shall see what they say, if anything.

imported post

Maybe we can start a page of businesses that are off limits to gun owners.

Click to expand...

Well, something I've been working on in my spare time is exactly that.

I didn't want to say anything about it yet, since it's still in the VERY early development stages, but it is coming along.

I'm writing it from scratch in PHP, doing my own database, session tracking, user account/authentication, etc. It's a lot of work.

I've picked a domain name for it that's available, but so far all I've invested into it is my personal time. If I end up flaking out and never finish development of the site, I'd rather not have wasted money on the domain I'm not using. I'd also want it to be SSL encrypted, and an SSL certificate (the widget on the server that encrypts stuff) costs a pretty penny.

The system I'm developing will allow you to report 'events' at a particular business or location - a lot like what we're doing here - but also allow for accountability and remediation for times when rights were violated.

So instead of just threatening to not visit their place of business, we can actually work towards resolving these issues. I could even put a place for each business to post their company's firearms policy for the world to see - good or bad - so when you're in one of their stores and someone starts hassling you, you can just tell them "go to this website and read your own company policy", etc.

This would also be a place where you could talk about your positive experiences - so we can bolster those businesses who do support our rights. Imagine how bad it would look for Costco if they had a bunch of reports against them and a bunch of positive reports for their competitor?

One of my ideas would be once we get a sufficient amount of reports, I could make a 'Top Ten' list of the worst rights violators and the best rights supporters - by shaming these companies publicly, we can apply real pressure to get their policies changed.

I'm also planning on making it not just for 2AD, but any Bill of Rights violation (most notably, however, 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th).

Once I get a little closer to having something worth playing with, I'll contact some of you to play with it (be my 'beta testers') and tell me what you think, etc. I'll be hosting it from my home server, so it will be a little sketchy that way, but should give a good basic idea of how it works.

I've some mandatory time off next week (yay for economic recession!) so I should make some good progress then.

I'll keep you folks posted.

imported post

DJ,

I just sent an e-mail to Sher Moyer requesting IN WRITING the official Costco policy regarding carrying of firearms inside the store. We'll see if we get any response!

I'm actually thinking about making an excuse to go to the Tigard store this weekend, and open carry just to see what the reaction is.

imported post

Or just do what a lot of us have already done.

Cut your membership card in half, and send it back to them with an explanation as to why. Demand a refund for the unused portion of your membership dues.

imported post

Ironbar wrote:

DJ,

I just sent an e-mail to Sher Moyer requesting IN WRITING the official Costco policy regarding carrying of firearms inside the store. We'll see if we get any response!

I'm actually thinking about making an excuse to go to the Tigard store this weekend, and open carry just to see what the reaction is.

Click to expand...

Please let us know if you get a response. I have not received a response as of this writting. Also, please tell us if you go to Costco in Tigard and what response you get. Thanks,

imported post

This site already maps and rates businesses. Good and bad based on user inputs.

http://friendorfoe.us/Default.aspx



It seems to be a little slow to update the map.....I put some in a week or so ago and they finally showed up. Not sure what's up with that.

imported post

Hmmm...

That seems pretty and all - but not exactly what I had in mind.

Plus, it shows only 2 hits within a 100-mile radius of where I live (one of them in Washington for Pete's sake), and both of those are "positive". No reports for Oxbow park, no reports for Costco, etc.

I was more interested in having a website that called these people to the carpet for their actions - getting them to clarify their position, and then force them to stick with it - one way or another.

I (or the co-admins I recruit) would be following up on these reports as we were able to, to get confirming details, follow it up the chain to get corporate policies, etc - all that crap we're doing here, albeit ad hoc. This would be a formalized system for all to see.

I'll work on it next week and then show a few of you.

(and We-the-People - you already have an account - I needed a second user for additional data to test)

UPDATE: There are only 5 records for all of Oregon, and all are positive. I looked at some of the negative records for out of state, and all they say is "Negative Experience" - zero details...

imported post

Oh, and can't wait to go to the Wilsonville Costco this next week sometime. OC of course.

imported post

I just got the same reply, verbatim, that the OP got on his initial inquiry but mine was signed by:

Brenda, Costco Wholesale Corporation



Of course they're all from the generic memberservice@costco.com so I doubt that "Brenda" will actually get my reply and request for the actual policy or contact info for Corp Legal, Security, of management.

Guess I won't be getting a CostCo card and instead looking for a SAMS club.

imported post

I just made an attempt to contact them by e-mail as well as I have been a member for a few years and would like to see improvements in policy. I never OC there as I had heard they were unfriendly and my g/f is still a bit less than enthused at my carry habits so in some stores I give her the 'win'... she is coming around slowly..

Rev. Jim

imported post

Wait until something happens (or hopefully nearly happens) that could have gone very badly. She'll see the error of her ways.

My late wifes mother thought I was HORRIBLE for giving my wife a handgun as an anniversary present just before departing for duty near Washington DC (Andrews AFB). When they came out to visit she decided that I was absolutey a HORRIBLE husband because I would carry (illegally) twohandguns (well hidden but quickly accessible) in the vehicle when going into Washington DC.

That all changed the third time we went into DC as on the way back (dark) she (M-I-L) insisted that we go to a McDonalds she saw because we were all hungry. I explained that we were in SouthEast DC and she did NOT want to stop for anything until clear of the area. She insisted so I made the turn and 1.2 blocklater we were confronted by three large, poorly dressed, men standing in the road stopping us.

I told my wife "get ready for the gun" which we had pre planned and she opened the hiding place for me. Islowed but didn't stop as I rolled up with one of them on the drivers side stepping towards the door and then floored it. We were in a one ton dually pickup and they scattered. My M-I-L, a few minutes later when she'd recovered from her fear, leanded forward and said "Now I understand".

After that, I could do no wrong as her mother had realized that I would do whatever was required to keep her daughter safe. She also never argued with me when I said an area was unsafe. LOL

imported post

I’ve often wondered if someone with some legal background could draft up a letter for just these sort of circumstances.

To Whom It May Concern,

Please be advised that due to your policy of barring private lawfully carried firearms from your establishment, you have assumed full legal and financial responsibility for me and my family whenever we are on your property in the event of a crime of violence. This responsibility extends for all areas of your business (sales floor, restrooms, etc) as well as the parking areas normally utilized by your customers, regardless of actual ownership or control. By denying me the ability to protect myself and other persons of my party of whom I am responsible, you are, as an only alternative, guaranteeing our complete safety from all criminal acts on the afore mentioned property, including but not limited to, assault, robbery, rape, carjacking, random shootings, kidnapping, child abduction, or any other crime of violence, regardless of your actual control or lack of control over any situation. Further, you guarantee without exception that no other customers, employees, visitors, transients, or any other persons are in possession of any firearms or other dangerous weapons while inside your establishment or in the parking areas normally utilized by your customers.

If you do not agree to these terms, please advise me in writing within five business days of receipt of this letter. Your response letter must state that you do not agree to provide me, my family, and any other persons with whom I may be traveling, complete safety and security from any and all crimes of violence, and that you do not allow lawfully carried firearms on your property for customer self protection. Any response that does not include the essential elements of this paragraph, or a non-response, will indicate your complete acceptance of all terms in paragraph one, above.

Click to expand...

Just imagine what their legal department would do if these started rolling in every few days.